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Here's what I want to know: Is it possible to discuss issues and candidates without rancor or hatred? Is it possible to concede that your opposition might have a good point or two? Or do we honestly, truly hate each other this much, so much that no candidate alive could ever really unite us? (And PLEASE, no rushing to plug your candidate as the Second Coming, no matter who he or she may be, and that includes Republicans.)
Discuss, if you want to. Or ignore. Your prerogative, really.
Well, I have been very aware of the election discussions back to the Kennedy vs Nixon election in 1960, and have no problem at all with the discussions as they take place today.
I have voted for, and supported, candidates on both sides of the aisle. I will be splitting my ticket again this year. So I approach this without hatred myself, but I certainly find one candidate preferable over the other (but most of you already know this...).
I do not hate the opposing candidate himself. Never have hated or resented anyone running for office, just agree with one over the other. My sentiments change with the situation, and who I think has a better long term strategy and leadership skills.
As far as the Election Forum discussions, they are pretty typical with past election sentiments. The difference now is that we have more outlets, such as this site, to express opinions and folks tend to be a bit competitive.
Frankly, I quite enjoy the process. Doesn't bother me a bit, and NO candidate will ever unite us (nor should they).
Flourchild
I have had lots of grand discussions and have agreed to disagree on many occasions. Verbal fencing is a good way to learn, to practice critical thinking skills, etc. I have never called anyone stupid, ugly, etc, as it serves no purpose. I have strong opinions matched by other's strong opinions, but that does not mean I hold malice in my heart for any of my debate opponents, on the contrary, it is a challenge to discuss matters.
Excellent points. I just hope that whomever becomes our next President that EVERYONE will hope that he becomes the best President ever. I am a Republican and if Obama wins, he starts off on a clean slate with me in January. Every day I will pray he becomes the best President ever because we need it more than ever right now. I hope the Democrats feel the same way should McCain win.
Flourchild
I have had lots of grand discussions and have agreed to disagree on many occasions. Verbal fencing is a good way to learn, to practice critical thinking skills, etc. I have never called anyone stupid, ugly, etc, as it serves no purpose. I have strong opinions matched by other's strong opinions, but that does not mean I hold malice in my heart for any of my debate opponents, on the contrary, it is a challenge to discuss matters.
Neither this thread nor my posts herein was intended to put anyone on the defensive. It wasn't meant as an accusation or an indictment of anyone. I just wanted to get all of us to stop and think and evaluate the quality and the level of our debate. That "all of us" most emphatically does include me, by the way.
I know that vigorous debate is an integral part of a democracy, and that a populace uniform in its thoughts, opinions and feelings would be a terrifying thing. It's America's heterogeneity that makes us strong, after all. But I kept seeing people tossing invective not only at the candidates, but at each other, and I've gotten into it a few times. It's depressing, it's destructive, and it's discouraging to anyone who is interested in talking about issues or in trying to understand why the opposition thinks as they do.
Conservatives have some very good reasons for believing and feeling as they do. Their experiences and (believe it or not) educations have generally formed or reinforced what they believe to be right and good. Liberals ALSO have reasons for believing and feeling as THEY do. I may disagree with either side on a given issue, but to call someone a fool, or a Communist, or a Nazi, or a liar, or to insult their religion or lack thereof, shuts down any further attempts at understanding on either side. Both parties get to walk away, thinking "Well, I showed THEM." But nobody gets shown anything, other than how much the other person seems to hate them. Nobody's mind is changed--but our heels are dirtied from digging in harder.
People, I ain't Gandhi, here. I just get a bad case of Weltschmerz from coming here, sometimes, and I can't accept that that's what this site is for.
I make an effort to debate honestly and even learn from those with whom I disagree. When someone throws partisan spin or nastiness my way, I usually call them on it and then ignore future posts from that person.
I appreciate anybody who is a marshal of cool facts. I have an even greater appreciation for anyone who can use facts to draw conclusions, instead of using cherrypicked statistics to back up what they insist on believing. I may not agree with that person on ethical or religious grounds, but I respect his or her ability to be honest and to think through a position. I am not always the coolest head around; I gravitate toward hyperbole, and sarcasm, and anger. These things don't make for a great debater, and (as is usually the case with human beings) these things anger me when I see them in others. Silly, but true.
It has become a zero-sum game because the divide is so great between the right and the left; and then there are all those people stuck in the middle trying to figure out what to do and what to believe in.
We need to stop trying to persuade each other to thinking our way. It's a cycle of non-accomplishment that causes frustration. Liberals get elected and are opposed by conservatives. Then conservatives get elected and are opposed by liberals. Then liberals get elected again and the cycle continues.
The answer isn't unity. That's a pipe dream. We need to divorce ourselves from each other. Only then will we be free. I am a conservative separatist, and I don't bother trying to persuade liberals. It's a waste of energy and resources arguing with them. In fact, I'm not even sure if I want them to think like me. It's sad that we've adopted their tactics. I just wanna be done with it.
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