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We often have discussions in here over the media and inevitably the discussion regresses into what I call source wars. Well MSNBC is liberally biased… Fox news is a right wing fascist propaganda machine and CNN is often referred to as the Communist News Network. Depending on your personal politics, you will line up behind one of these and cheer while the programming fills your living room. Yet I personally find them less than a degree different.
During the latest news event with Russia entering into Georgia, I decided to surf the net and get a broader view of this conflict from a larger variety of sources. I attempted to surf my satellite stations, but oddly, out of all these near 1000 channels, I cannot find any news feeds to foreign sources of information. I cannot even get them if I paid for them, so I am forced to use the internet. Sad really, that here in America our TV’s only get state cleansed and approved information. You would have a more varied selection of information and points of view if you live in France, Germany, Japan, Canada, and even places like Lithuania.
One thing that is often failed to be mentioned on any American TV station is that this situation is almost identical to the UN supporting the separatist in Kosovo/Serbian conflict. Only then, we supported the separatist instead of the other way around. In any event, one particular aspect that is rarely mentioned and when it is, it is stated briefly, quietly, and infrequently is that the Georgian President, Mikheil Saakashvili also killed a few thousand civilians and fifty some odd Russian aid workers. Of course he is our guy in country so it’s ok for him to kill civilians. Between the US and Israeli military advisors and the mention by name of John McCain (whose foreign policy advisor is an active lobbyist for the state of Georgia) you get the sense that Saakashvilli was told two things, one that Russia will never attack and two, if they did the US would have their back… wrong on both. (Also failed to be mentioned in the US press) Then, as has been repeatedly stated by Russia, they acted and responded to pleas for help from the break away province of Ossetia. A little bit like when Iraq reclaimed Kuwait and the Kuwaitis called upon the US to intervene.
Now if the US press is “liberal” as so many claim, one might expect a contrary point of view from that of the Bush administration, yet the press in unison sides against Russia and fails to mention that there is more to the situation and the story. Once again the US media acts like a single entity which more resembles the White House press office than an independent 4th estate that is determined to seek the truth. Even after it has been discovered that the White House has been using certain press organizations as simple propaganda arms of the government line, Americans once again swallow the story whole and without question from our nightly entertainment channels.
For the record, I do not agree with how Russia has responded, although I think I understand why they did. I of course didn’t agree with how the US acted in and on Iraq, Haiti, in Panama, and how it is acting towards Iran. Our foreign policy gives one the appearance of a tactical view instead of a strategic one and the press in America is complicit in failing to point this out.
At least there have been two things that have managed to become self evident through all this. One is that the United States foreign policy is witnessing the biggest blunder in the past 60 years and that the press in America no longer functions as an instrument of truth but instead better resembles a propaganda arm of our government providing what better resembles coverage of a football game or pep rally than reality.
"Now if the US press is “liberal” as so many claim, one might expect a contrary point of view from that of the Bush administration, yet the press in unison sides against Russia and fails to mention that there is more to the situation and the story."
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"Our" media is OWNED . Some channels are liberal some conservative but in the end ALL are owned and much of the news is the same .
EVERY media network gave Bush a free pass pre Iraq and you could say still do.
As far as political candidates FOX likes Mccain -MSNBC likes Obama but BOTH still owned as far as other news goes.
They can report certain things but some topics they wont touch as their master/s wont allow it.
As you know Russia can't be trusted but you like so many now feel "our" news "our' gvmt can't be trusted either so that puts us in a dilema.
"Our" media,Gvmt doesn't deserve our trust that's the sad reality.
I expect governments to often behave poorly or led by those with a personal agenda contrary to public opinion but I expect the press to at least make a reasoned attempt at pointing this out.
In order for any democracy to function properly, it requires an informed, reasonably educated and aware population. Without these we are in essence merely spectators at a grand football game, sitting in the stands cheering for our team.
Do what I did and get rid of your television altogether! Me and my wife have been without television for almost 6 months. I HONESTLY HAVE NOT MISSED IT AT ALL. Pink Floyd would have to revise his classic "13 channels of sh** on the TV to choose from" to 1000 channels.
what are you talking about? the bigfoot press conference should be about to start.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper
We often have discussions in here over the media and inevitably the discussion regresses into what I call source wars. Well MSNBC is liberally biased… Fox news is a right wing fascist propaganda machine and CNN is often referred to as the Communist News Network. Depending on your personal politics, you will line up behind one of these and cheer while the programming fills your living room. Yet I personally find them less than a degree different.
During the latest news event with Russia entering into Georgia, I decided to surf the net and get a broader view of this conflict from a larger variety of sources. I attempted to surf my satellite stations, but oddly, out of all these near 1000 channels, I cannot find any news feeds to foreign sources of information. I cannot even get them if I paid for them, so I am forced to use the internet. Sad really, that here in America our TV’s only get state cleansed and approved information. You would have a more varied selection of information and points of view if you live in France, Germany, Japan, Canada, and even places like Lithuania.
One thing that is often failed to be mentioned on any American TV station is that this situation is almost identical to the UN supporting the separatist in Kosovo/Serbian conflict. Only then, we supported the separatist instead of the other way around. In any event, one particular aspect that is rarely mentioned and when it is, it is stated briefly, quietly, and infrequently is that the Georgian President, Mikheil Saakashvili also killed a few thousand civilians and fifty some odd Russian aid workers. Of course he is our guy in country so it’s ok for him to kill civilians. Between the US and Israeli military advisors and the mention by name of John McCain (whose foreign policy advisor is an active lobbyist for the state of Georgia) you get the sense that Saakashvilli was told two things, one that Russia will never attack and two, if they did the US would have their back… wrong on both. (Also failed to be mentioned in the US press) Then, as has been repeatedly stated by Russia, they acted and responded to pleas for help from the break away province of Ossetia. A little bit like when Iraq reclaimed Kuwait and the Kuwaitis called upon the US to intervene.
Now if the US press is “liberal” as so many claim, one might expect a contrary point of view from that of the Bush administration, yet the press in unison sides against Russia and fails to mention that there is more to the situation and the story. Once again the US media acts like a single entity which more resembles the White House press office than an independent 4th estate that is determined to seek the truth. Even after it has been discovered that the White House has been using certain press organizations as simple propaganda arms of the government line, Americans once again swallow the story whole and without question from our nightly entertainment channels.
For the record, I do not agree with how Russia has responded, although I think I understand why they did. I of course didn’t agree with how the US acted in and on Iraq, Haiti, in Panama, and how it is acting towards Iran. Our foreign policy gives one the appearance of a tactical view instead of a strategic one and the press in America is complicit in failing to point this out.
At least there have been two things that have managed to become self evident through all this. One is that the United States foreign policy is witnessing the biggest blunder in the past 60 years and that the press in America no longer functions as an instrument of truth but instead better resembles a propaganda arm of our government providing what better resembles coverage of a football game or pep rally than reality.
Do what I did and get rid of your television altogether! Me and my wife have been without television for almost 6 months. I HONESTLY HAVE NOT MISSED IT AT ALL. Pink Floyd would have to revise his classic "13 channels of sh** on the TV to choose from" to 1000 channels.
Gotcha beat by seven months. I guess the only thing I miss is, um, is, ah, well, hm, cartoons, no, not cartoons as the pc crowd has done in Bugs Bunny and crowd cause it's too belligerent, hm, well, how about PBS, uh, oh, no, can't do that - too liberal for my taste, well, shoot, I guess I really don't miss a darn thing. Sheez, I been sweating getting a converter, too.
I don't pretend to be an expert here, but Trudy Rubin is. And she disagrees with Hilltopper's confident (and unattributed) reading of what he sees as the truth of the Russian/Georgian conflict:
Worldview: Teaching Russia a lesson | Philadelphia Inquirer | 08/13/2008 (http://www.philly.com/inquirer/columnists/trudy_rubin/20080813_Worldview__Teaching_Russia_a_lesson.html - broken link)
Now, I'm not saying that Hilltopper is wrong. It does seem, though, that his assumption of the mantle of expert here resembles nothing so much as the approach of the media he crticizes...
I don't pretend to be an expert here, but Trudy Rubin is. And she disagrees with Hilltopper's confident (and unattributed) reading of what he sees as the truth of the Russian/Georgian conflict:
Worldview: Teaching Russia a lesson | Philadelphia Inquirer | 08/13/2008 (http://www.philly.com/inquirer/columnists/trudy_rubin/20080813_Worldview__Teaching_Russia_a_lesson.html - broken link)
Now, I'm not saying that Hilltopper is wrong. It does seem, though, that his assumption of the mantle of expert here resembles nothing so much as the approach of the media he crticizes...
Well, at least I have offered an opinion based upon a large number of varied sources both foreign and domestic, instead of dropping a link to a single news outlet and claiming it the word of truth. Such is the case with many people and especially Americans, to pick a single or narrowly defined information outlet in which happens to agree with their point of view, then parade it out for all to witness the majesty of how they had it right all along. Truth having no value when it disagrees with their point of view.
While I normally don't do homework for the other students, nor do I solely rely upon or believe that any other single author has in their pockets the absolute fact and truth, it only takes a few moments and a simple google search to see that there is deeper substance to this issue than the standard "America good, they bad", jingoistic diatribe put forth by the mindless and faithful Jim Juice drinkers.
Lets start with this interesting piece from the Atlanta Journal Constitution which describes how US troops will be doing joint training missions in the Republic of Georgia. Gives some credibility to those claims that US and Israeli troops acting as advisers for Georgia. I wonder what would happen if Russia were to deploy troops or weapons in Cuba or Canada? Oh wait, we already been there...
Troops from Atlanta will train in Republic of Georgia | ajc.com (http://www.ajc.com/news/content/metro/stories/2008/07/13/georgia_national_guard_.html - broken link)
Now I realize this piece, while reasonably objective, comes from the UK, so thus it is non-American, and so thus not credible... or at least that is how most here think. After all, we can't have information that doesn't root for our football team~! Yay... go team rah rah.... puke.
Now here we have a Russian news source stating that the US is training mercenaries in Georgia. Now being a Russian source of news it is obviously biased (unlike our news which only speaks truth) in favor of the Russian point of view, however whether it is true or not, it is plausible in light that our own papers describe US troops being deployed in the Republic of Georgia.
Another interesting perspective from the Nobel laureate Aleksander Solzhenitsyn who accuses U.S., NATO of encircling Russia. Of course you only have to look at a map or read any paper to see this. Again, if it were the United States being surrounded by Russians and Chinese or having them install "missile shields" in Canada and Mexico that it would not bother us in the least bit.
Here is a rather interesting tid bit from the Israeli daily newspaper and one of my personal favorites sources, Haaretz, which goes on to describe Israeli military weapons shipments and aid to Georgia. Again, I'm sure that if Russia or China were arming the Taliban, that the United States would have no concerns.
Quote:
Saakashvili said he is aware of problems with supplying the pilotless drones that his army ordered from Israeli companies, but not of the stopping of any other shipments of military aid.
"The Israeli weapons have proved very effective," he said at a press conference at his office. When asked whether the Israeli arms played a role in the military successes he claimed the Georgian army had achieved, he joked: "Are you asking me as a representative of Elbit or of Israel Aerospace Industries?"
Now this piece from the Moscow Times is noteworthy as it talks about Russia's right to use "preemptive strikes" to defend itself. Sounds a bit like the United States preemptively striking Iraq or its desire to preemptively strike Iran to "protect itself". Of course they are wrong and we are right, because after all, we wear white hats and represent all that is righteous and pure in the world.
Moscow News - News - Top Brass Defends Russia's Right to Preemptive Strike (http://www.mnweekly.ru/news/20080124/55305669.html - broken link)
Now, I could sit here for hours finding a variety of stories with a variety of other views than is presented in our press here in America. Of course, many will read this and say that all these sources are either biased as pro-Russian or anti-west, etc... and they would be right. The point here is that while most will say that these links are crap because they are biased pro-Russian, they will at the same time then quote American media sources as "truth" on the ground, and untouched by pro-American bias. It is from this egocentricism that I find so much disgust, because it merely perpetuates emotionally driven and reactionary responses from people too damn lazy to think for themselves for one minute and consider for just one moment that there is possibly more going on then they are told.
I may be right or I may be completely wrong or even a little of both, however I came to my opinion through a bit more effort than most. for one, my contact with the various editors that print my own articles in a variety of news outlets. Two, because I actually enjoy researching and reading all those lovely tid bits from places like foreign embassy press releases, a variety of foreign policy think tanks as well as the standard entertainment garbage that passes for news around here. After all of this, I am certain of one thing, the average consumer of Americanized news is an idiot who would sooner die than to think or come to their own conclusions at the risk of being wrong.
I will always choose to risk being wrong over being obedient.
Well, at least I have offered an opinion based upon a large number of varied sources both foreign and domestic, instead of dropping a link to a single news outlet and claiming it the word of truth.
Your OP contained no references to any sources.
I did not refer to Trudy Rubin as "the word of truth."
Congratulations on having so much time to sit and Google. I envy you.
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