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I look at it like this, if someone in Europe talks about "big mouth" Americans, I do not take offense since I am not have a "big mouth". Muslims that do not have a terrorist agent should not be offended by the tape unless they support terrorism or are one of those that mean harm to us or our friends in other nations. The Muslims that take offense are questionable.
bandi - I think that the Muslims that complain in this country see themselves as being "lumped in" with the bad guys by people who seem to think "well, if you've seen one, you've seen them all" mentality.
bandi - I think that the Muslims that complain in this country see themselves as being "lumped in" with the bad guys by people who seem to think "well, if you've seen one, you've seen them all" mentality.
I agree with you. But, the DVD specifically refered to the "radicals". I would like to see more Muslims join together to denounce terrorism. I believe that if they made it loud and clear that they are opposed, they wouldn't be so much suspicion. And, there are so many great Muslims that aren't even associated with the problem areas, ie. Turkey, India, Indonesia, etc. Most Americans don't know the difference in a person from India and a person from Saudi. Arabs from many of the Arab countries tend to not assimilate, isolate themselves and make no attempt to become part of our culture. I think that if a person takes the oath of allegiance to a country, they should adhere to the oath and contribe to our diverse , not isolate themselves from it. Assimilation is one way to gain more acceptance and experience less suspicion. London has had the horrible experience of having British citizens of Muslim backgrounds become terrorist, train in radical countries, and return to Britain to set off bombs and cause other destruction. Staying in isolation causes one to become suspicious. The DVD was quite explicit about pertaining only to "radical" Muslims.
Emissary and Ani, if I could give you more positive reps you know I would.
I mentioned this DVD at a gathering of several neighbors/friends/soccer moms this afternoon. One brilliant father in the group responded: "Send some fighter planes over there and just flatten the place." Sounds like the same mentality that these extremists have: "Kill 'em ALL!"
Is "an eye-for-an-eye" really the answer?
Although it won't be easy, and as Ani stated; change from within is the answer: Educate the MOTHERS who raise the children and maybe, we'll see a change. (????)
Sadly, that's the only positive solution I can come up with.
I hope to hear both candidates address this issue in the upcoming debates.
I personally thank more of the Observer for sending a video regarding Radical Islam's war against the west. I was beginning to think that the paper was too leftist and liberal. Hopefully everyone will look at the video and remember that we are in a very precarious situation in the western world. I am glad Charlotte was included in the loop to have the valuable information distributed to its citizens. Many liberals are going to be crying about the politics of the tape, but who cares about them. They don't understand reality if it smacked them in the face anyway. I feel better about the Observer.
I hope all Charlotteans (ideological left wingers) watch the tape and see what the world is really like out there. So many Americans have never witnessed terror or even been to a country where terrorism has occured (other than 9/11). Wake up those of you that are to ideological to see reality and watch the tape. There are those out there that hate us and want us all dead. Thanks Observer.
Unfortunately it shows how desperate the right is to send this proganda out. I have been to many parts of the Middle East, and have witnessed terror. Extremists are extremists.
Emissary and Ani, if I could give you more positive reps you know I would.
I mentioned this DVD at a gathering of several neighbors/friends/soccer moms this afternoon. One brilliant father in the group responded: "Send some fighter planes over there and just flatten the place." Sounds like the same mentality that these extremists have: "Kill 'em ALL!"
Is "an eye-for-an-eye" really the answer?
Although it won't be easy, and as Ani stated; change from within is the answer: Educate the MOTHERS who raise the children and maybe, we'll see a change. (????)
Sadly, that's the only positive solution I can come up with.
I hope to hear both candidates address this issue in the upcoming debates.
Are you talking about educating the mothers that raise the children in the "radical" environments? They are being educated. They are being educated to hate the infidels. That being everyone that does not subscribe to Islam. Maybe you and the soccer moms should take a trip to the Middle East or Northwest Asia and see what life is like outside of suburbia? Before you criticize the father too harshly for his comments, just remember that we have the means to do what he suggests but don't. The radicals do no have the means but without a doubt would destroy us without a thought.
One of my favorite dramas is Aristophanes' Lysistrata. Simply explained . . . the women of Athens joined together to stop war through a two-fold approach: controlling the state coffers and refusing to have sex, LOL. It always made sense to me that it would be the women of the world who would bring peace to the planet . . . as what mother wants to see her sons (and daughters) march off to war?
I don't see change coming until children are taught something other than "kill the infidels" - and this IS what is being taught (by the radicals).
Sadly, in some societies, women have little (if any) voice . . . and I think that this is the case w/ Islamists. To call this culture paternalistic is an understatement, methinks.
But I do believe that if women had more influence on their sons, it would be peace that would be emphasized . . . rather than the distorted, hate-filled propaganda that is taught by these radical factions.
BANDI: I wanted to comment on a point you made - I agree that it would be meaningful if moderate Muslims would be more vocal in disavowing the extremist rhetoric. I have found it perplexing that they haven't. In addition, I think it has created an atmosphere of mistrust between American Muslims and the rest of the country, wh/ is unfortunate.
Last edited by brokensky; 09-14-2008 at 07:02 PM..
Reason: rearrange sequence
BANDI: I wanted to comment on a point you made - I agree that it would be meaningful if moderate Muslims would be more vocal in disavowing the extremist rhetoric. I have found it perplexing that they haven't. In addition, I think it has created an atmosphere of mistrust between American Muslims and the rest of the country, wh/ is unfortunate.
Can I ask what is missing, what would you like to see as in being more vocal? *Every* convention I've gone to as well as every leader at a mosque *always* denounces terrorism. All the Muslims I know get scared every time we turn on the tv and hear of some act of terror and literally pray and cross our fingers that it wasn't a so called Muslim. Then if it was, we're scared to go to work or school the next day. Because we know it was wrong, we know it's not us, but people look at us differently. Even though we're doing the same thing as everyone else which is just trying to make a living, earning our dollar and trying to survive.
I think our voices who feel that way, no one wants to hear it and certainly the media doesn't. It won't bring ratings. Who wants to see a normal person on TV who just gets up goes to work, comes home, cooks dinner, then irons, watch some tv and then go to bed? That would be boring.
I do agree w/ some of the above sentiments and that is the change needs to come within. I think the only way is with education. But I think most of us who are educated come here to the West to get away from the sh*t overseas to live a better life. And then nobody wants to go back. My parents never went back, and my husband never wants to go back either.
As for myself, only living here in the States, I'd never want to live there either. However, if I ever make millions or build up some wealth later in life, I would like to create a school somehow with teachers who were educated in the West. I just have no idea how to implement something like that though either. But I do think a combination of money (which I think many Muslims in America do have as most of the ones I know are physicians, lawyers, self employed, etc) and getting off our behinds and doing somehting about it. I think the latter is really more so needed. Unfortunately I think it's easier to stay here in our bubble (that's safe as well), earn our money, and live in our nice houses with a nice car than do what we can to help.
Unfortunately it shows how desperate the right is to send this proganda out. I have been to many parts of the Middle East, and have witnessed terror. Extremists are extremists.
It shows that the left are a bunch of ignorant ideologists and need to be education about what is happening outside of lalaland. Obviously you didn't see terror or you would be glad that the DVDs were sent out. Sometimes a tourist doesn't see the whole story. Moderator cut: flaming
Last edited by SunnyKayak; 09-15-2008 at 07:24 AM..
Can I ask what is missing, what would you like to see as in being more vocal? *Every* convention I've gone to as well as every leader at a mosque *always* denounces terrorism. All the Muslims I know get scared every time we turn on the tv and hear of some act of terror and literally pray and cross our fingers that it wasn't a so called Muslim. Then if it was, we're scared to go to work or school the next day. Because we know it was wrong, we know it's not us, but people look at us differently. Even though we're doing the same thing as everyone else which is just trying to make a living, earning our dollar and trying to survive.
I think our voices who feel that way, no one wants to hear it and certainly the media doesn't. It won't bring ratings. Who wants to see a normal person on TV who just gets up goes to work, comes home, cooks dinner, then irons, watch some tv and then go to bed? That would be boring.
I do agree w/ some of the above sentiments and that is the change needs to come within. I think the only way is with education. But I think most of us who are educated come here to the West to get away from the sh*t overseas to live a better life. And then nobody wants to go back. My parents never went back, and my husband never wants to go back either.
As for myself, only living here in the States, I'd never want to live there either. However, if I ever make millions or build up some wealth later in life, I would like to create a school somehow with teachers who were educated in the West. I just have no idea how to implement something like that though either. But I do think a combination of money (which I think many Muslims in America do have as most of the ones I know are physicians, lawyers, self employed, etc) and getting off our behinds and doing somehting about it. I think the latter is really more so needed. Unfortunately I think it's easier to stay here in our bubble (that's safe as well), earn our money, and live in our nice houses with a nice car than do what we can to help.
Moderator cut: flaming , we will always be suspicious. Yes, Americans need to be educated, but part of it is learning from Muslims that you are valuable, contributing individuals that want to assimilate into the American society. You need to come to our schools, churches, and festivals and show and tell us more about your religion. Furthermore, give some indication that you do not support terrorism. Silence depicts indifference.
Last edited by SunnyKayak; 09-15-2008 at 07:48 AM..
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Sad.
