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View Poll Results: How many guns do you keep at home for personal use?
More than 20 19 14.29%
Between 10 and 20 10 7.52%
Between 1 and 10 54 40.60%
None 50 37.59%
Voters: 133. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 10-17-2008, 06:12 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,992,173 times
Reputation: 36644

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Knocker View Post
I guess you dont know that we beat the biggest superpower of the time just like that to form our country. Iraq is doing it today.
.
Do you really think the British could not have put down the rebellion if there had been no ocean in between? Conversely, Washington's entire force would have been wiped out in a day if they had landed at Dover.

Almost all wars are won on their own turf, if there is an ocean in between, unless the visiting team has an enormously overwhelming firepower advantage. The logistics of fighting a war accross an ocean are just too costly. The Americans only contributed, but did not win and could not have won either of the two European World Wars by our selves.

Which is why our own defensive chutzpah is so absurd. It would take a military force five or ten times the size and firepower of our own for a nation across the ocean to subdue us That is unimaginable. The Japanese could never have successfully held a single square foot of land east of Hawaii.
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Old 10-17-2008, 06:14 PM
 
Location: In a house
5,232 posts, read 8,416,920 times
Reputation: 2583
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParkTwain View Post
Well then the typical "fear" of a tyrannical military coup is unfounded, I suppose. Do you really want the argument both ways?
If its unfounded its so because we have a mechanism built into our Constitution making it so.
There is no argument. Gun ownership is a right & an absolute necessity in a truly free country. That was once universally understood & those countries that withheld this right knew & their people knew, that they were not a free country.
Its a very recent phenomenon that people can be made to believe they are free when they obviously are not.
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Old 10-17-2008, 06:21 PM
 
Location: In a house
5,232 posts, read 8,416,920 times
Reputation: 2583
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Do you really think the British could not have put down the rebellion if there had been no ocean in between? Conversely, Washington's entire force would have been wiped out in a day if they had landed at Dover.
No I dont. It would have taken longer perhaps but they were fighting people who wanted to win because their futures & lives depended on it.

Quote:
Almost all wars are won on their own turf, if there is an ocean in between, unless the visiting team has an enormously overwhelming firepower advantage. The logistics of fighting a war accross an ocean are just too costly. The Americans only contributed, but did not win and could not have won either of the two European World Wars by our selves.
Whats your point? I think you are wrong but this has nothing to do with the topic at hand. Personally I'v come to the conclusion that Europe mostly deserved & still deserves to be overrun. They are too quick to forget about liberty & its importance in preserving a free society & as such dont deserve one.

Quote:
Which is why our own defensive chutzpah is so absurd. It would take a military force five or ten times the size and firepower of our own for a nation across the ocean to subdue us That is unimaginable. The Japanese could never have successfully held a single square foot of land east of Hawaii.
Well the fact is they DID hold land east of Hawaii but thats irrelevant.

I do agree that our current fighting under the guise of national security is silly. There are many reasons for our hostilities but national security isn't one. IMO anyway.
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Old 10-17-2008, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,992,173 times
Reputation: 36644
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Knocker View Post
If its unfounded its so because we have a mechanism built into our Constitution making it so.
There is no argument. Gun ownership is a right & an absolute necessity in a truly free country. That was once universally understood & those countries that withheld this right knew & their people knew, that they were not a free country.
Its a very recent phenomenon that people can be made to believe they are free when they obviously are not.
Most of the "truly free countries" on earth have civilian gun regulations that are more stringent than our own. And never mind trying to weasel out by saying American is the only "truly free country". And don't insult us by saying the definitin of "truly free" rests upon lack of gun regulation. If you believe that, your argument above collapses into a meaningless tautology, and lord knolws we have enough meaningless arguments going on on this forum.
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Old 10-17-2008, 06:26 PM
 
Location: In a house
5,232 posts, read 8,416,920 times
Reputation: 2583
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Most of the "truly free countries" on earth have civilian gun regulations that are more stringent than our own. And never mind trying to weasel out by saying American is the only "truly free country". And don't insult us by saying the definitin of "truly free" rests upon lack of gun regulation. If you believe that, your argument above collapses into a meaningless tautology, and lord knolws we have enough meaningless arguments going on on this forum.
You insult yourself by saying not free is free.

Its not only gun regulation but gun regulation is a great litmus. It is the first thing to go as a nations freedoms are whittled away.

IMO America is no longer truly free, we are over regulated in many areas, but, it is definately the closest thing to a truly free country at this time.
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Old 10-17-2008, 06:39 PM
 
4,104 posts, read 5,310,577 times
Reputation: 1256
None.....of your business.
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Old 10-17-2008, 06:41 PM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,554 posts, read 86,992,173 times
Reputation: 36644
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Knocker View Post
You insult yourself by saying not free is free.

Its not only gun regulation but gun regulation is a great litmus. It is the first thing to go as a nations freedoms are whittled away.

IMO America is no longer truly free, we are over regulated in many areas, but, it is definately the closest thing to a truly free country at this time.

Links, please. Preferably, internationally recognized rankings of countries according to the degree to which there is general freedom for the citizenry, lin which the United States ranks first.
Here's one:

The United Nations Human Freedom Index (0 = least freedom, 40 = most freedom.

Sweden 38
Denmark 38
Netherlands 37
Austria 36
Finland 36
France 35
Germany 35
Canada 34
Switzerland 34
Australia 33
United States 33
Japan 32
United Kingdom 32

Of course, this ranking is invalid, in your view, because A) It does not give sufficint weight to gun laws, and B) some foreigners had a hand in making the evaluations and C) Joe McCarthy said the UN was all commonest. Every fifth-grader knows that if the US doesn't rank first, its a faulty metric.
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Old 10-17-2008, 07:06 PM
 
Location: The Woods
18,358 posts, read 26,499,682 times
Reputation: 11351
The UN is mostly made up of dictatorships/etc., and their ratings on "freedom" are highly suspect.
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Old 10-17-2008, 07:48 PM
 
271 posts, read 583,185 times
Reputation: 87
None yet, but ill be getting one for the communist takes office.
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Old 10-17-2008, 09:19 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,266,002 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by jtur88 View Post
Just curious---that intruder in your home that you killed. Was it really necessary to shoot to kill, in order to deter him/her?
Yes - it was necessary to shoot to kill.

As for the "need" issue / argument: I can make the argument that I "need" a firearm for protection in that I live in a very rural area - rural enough that if I were to summon law enforcement, it would probably take between 20 and 30 minutes to reach me. I also have had to deal with dangerous wildlife such as javelina who came very near my family - and I was forced to shoot them (done so twice within the last few months)
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