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Will President Obama trigger a secession movement?
No.
The secession movement and dissolution of the Union is already in progress.
But it may swell the ranks of the secessionists.
" Welcome to the website of the Hawaiian Kingdom Government presently
operating within the occupied State of the Hawaiian Islands. Since the
Spanish-American War, 1898, our Nation has been under prolonged
occupation by the United States of America. Our web pages tell you
about the range of activities carried out by the Hawaiian Government
in developing our relations with the community of Nations in regards
to the occupation and the profound economic benefits that arise from
its exposure."
"...the United States admitted its illegal overthrow of the Hawaiian
Kingdom..."
There are Hawaiians actively seeking to restore their independence
from the United States of America.
Next, Sarah Palin could take Alaska out, and join OPEC.
The Alaska Independence Party would vote her Queen of Alaska. Alaskan Independence Party
Goal: "Alaskans to achieve independence under a minimal government"
On 20 December 2007 representatives of the Lakota Nation declared previous treaties with the United States null and void and further declared their intention to join the family of nation and perform all functions rightfully due a legitimate government.
(Uh oh - They might repossess Mt Rushmore!)
http://www.nhne.org/news/NewsArticlesArchive/tabid/400/articleType/Ar (broken link)...
A Daily Kos poll on April 2 asked, "Should states be allowed to secede
from the union peaceably?" and 65 per cent answered affirmatively—
which is interesting especially because it is conventional liberals,
of the kind that this blog mostly attracts, who usually believe in
working within the system and are not often fans of secession. A
previous poll in 2005 showed only 53 per cent in favor of "I like
secession as an option."
The answer to your question is yes. Many if not most states already have it written into their state Constitutions that secession from the USA is permissible if certain conditions exist at the Federal level. This is true for virtually every New England state and I suspect most others in the country.
The answer to your question is yes. Many if not most states already have it written into their state Constitutions that secession from the USA is permissible if certain conditions exist at the Federal level. This is true for virtually every New England state and I suspect most others in the country.
I strongly disagree. According to the Articles of Confederation, 1777, the united States formed a perpetual union. The US Constitution only made a more perfect union, and incorporated the Articles of Confederation into the Constitution, via Article 6.
Any state part of a perpetual union cannot secede.
However, that does not infringe upon any American's right to be a sovereign, and establish his domain (domicile) upon his private property.
SOVEREIGN - A person, body or state in which independent and supreme authority is vested...
Black's Law Dictionary Dictionary, Sixth Edition, p. 1395.
"The people of the state, as the successors of its former sovereign, are entitled to all the rights which formerly belonged to the king by his own prerogative."
Lansing v. Smith, (1829) 4 Wendell 9, (NY)
"At the Revolution, the sovereignty devolved on the people and they are truly the sovereigns of the country."
Chisholm v. Georgia, 2 Dall. 440, 463
"People are supreme, not the state."
Waring v. the Mayor of Savannah, 60 GA at 93.
[No, a U.S. citizen is not one of the sovereign people. A citizen, by definition, is a subject.]
"Government is not Sovereignty. Government is the machinery or expedient for expressing the will of the sovereign power."
City of Bisbee v. Cochise County, 78 P. 2d 982, 986, 52 Ariz. 1
CITIZEN - ... Citizens are members of a political community who, in their
associative capacity, have established or submitted themselves to the dominion of government for the promotion of the general welfare and the protection of their individual as well as collective rights. "
- - - Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Ed. p.244
I was taught during my social studies class in Jr. High School, the New England states have provisions written into their state Constitutions that permit them to secede from the USA.
And a friend of mine with considerable legal experience in areas such as this confirmed this fact not too long ago when researching this very subject. The following article on this very subject seems to confirm this fact.
Well, it is true that the United States engineered the overthrow of Hawaii's monarchy. But secession movements based on Obama's winning the election? That's just plain silly. (People who don't study much history probably don't realize that there were somewhat similar panic reactions in 1960 at the thought of John Kennedy, a Roman Catholic, being elected President. There was talk of his election being a free pass for the Pope to run the United States. This did not happen).
Let's see how many of the people who really feel strongly about this leave the country if he should win the election. I'm pretty sure none of them will!
I strongly disagree. According to the Articles of Confederation, 1777, the united States formed a perpetual union. The US Constitution only made a more perfect union, and incorporated the Articles of Confederation into the Constitution, via Article 6.
Any state part of a perpetual union cannot secede.
So then, in effect, the 13 independent and soverign states (recognized as such by the Treaty of Paris), entered into a Union in which it meant they voluntarily gave up a right they had just excercised by "seceding" from England?
And further, that by doing so, they surrendered the principle of that "government derives its powers from the consent of the governed?"
I hasten to add, I am not arguing whether or not that secession (either today or in 1861) was/is a wise move. Only that it defies all historical evidence to believe that these "rebellious" states would have entered into a compact with the understanding beforehand they could never get out of it...
Here is the preamble to the Constitution of the Confederate States of America:
We, the people of the Confederate States, each State acting in its sovereign and independent character, in order to form a permanent federal government, establish justice, insure domestic tranquillity, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity — invoking the favor and guidance of Almighty God — do ordain and establish this Constitution for the Confederate States of America.
I mean, THIS wording -- with the use of "permanent" is even stronger than those in either the AOC or the original United States Constitution! But it would seem just a matter of surface logic that no way would the fire-eating states of the original Confederacy have agreed to wording such as this as in that they decided to render impossible the "right" (if such a term can be used) to secede. And, further, it was a matter of absolute conviction that the Southerners prided themselves over that they felt themselves to be the true heirs to the original Constitution (largely written by Southern men, anyway)...
Last edited by TexasReb; 11-02-2008 at 02:38 PM..
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