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So, you are willing to gladly pay $5,000 more for a car made by American workes, rather than pay $2,000 in increased taxes in order to smooth out the disparity in the income of American familiies or even assure health care for all of them.
I think you've stumbled into the wrong place. The Karl Marx holiday party is down the hall.
You mean goodbye to those jobs in Michigan, and the Rust Belt? The Southeast (and Indiana curiously enough) have all received enormous modern car manufacturing facilities that will far outlast Ford, GM, and Chrysler. The suppliers of the big three can just move down here like everyone else does!
So those jobs are going to still be in the US, but they'll be located in a place where the employers respect employees without pesky Unions.
So take your crumbling auto manufacturers, if you can't change with the times then good riddance
look, this is not the problem of the workers, who spend thier days in the factories. In Canada, the workers with thier unions agreed to recieve lower pays and less benefits, so the factory could stay open. then what did GM annouce a week later? they are closing the factory! wow so they made sure theyd have to pay them the least possible before they fired them.
are the CEO's making less?? of course they arent!!!!it isnt only about killing the electric car, its abotu selling only huge gas guzzeling vehicle.
fuel efficient cars work so well now that theres no reason demand should fall and workers be paid less..
what America in particular needs to realize is that if you wanna buy that burger at mcdicks for 99 cents, you need to pay the people behind the counter a lower wage.
same goes for cars. if you want that american cheap, tax free vehicle, you ahve to realize that there will be consequences. and as long as you prefer to pay less, you ahve to expect work outsourcing to other 3rd world countries the norm. you ahve to understand that you as the consumer, who continues to buy that cheap chinese stuff, have the power to support american companies who pay fairer.
No, as of now I have not heard of any concessions by top management and that adds to my reasons to not bail them out. The entire company needs to look at how they do business.
GM doesn't only make gas guzzlers. The fact is they have the most models with an EPA estimate of 30mpg highway than any other manufacturer. As far as corporate average, I believe they come in 3 out of 18 when compared to all imports. Yet another thing the MSM is slow to talk about.
Actually, what the US workers, specifically union workers need to understand is in order to keep these jobs here in the U.S. they have to either become more productive or accept a lower wage.
I don’t think the press can be objective, since the advertising that the networks and stations runs pay the bills. Entertainment or exciteformation is about public interest. It’s sad that the public is not interested in real news. Gracious it's boring!! The mob gets what it votes for, or what it shows antipathy towards... by not showing up for the past many years. Buying product is also a vote.
I have always lived in a right to work state. Unions seem like a good idea but they must have an inherent problem. Yeah they protect the workers, but the animal turns into a monster that must be fed. It seems that the commonalities that reinforce this creature can’t be productive character traits. Giving the mob what it wants is not a good thing I would suppose.
it is interesting that this particular story was not on our news, nor was the story about GM wanting to up their stake in SAIC. hmmm, makes you wonder about the objectivity of the press!
The press gets their $$$ from business, so how can they be free?
One thing, goods we buy from other countries should be only on the grounds that they follow good pollution control and have certain benefits for their workers.
Another is that many competitor countries have nationalized medical care for the population so it is paid through taxes. That is why they have so many laws to protect the health of the public, like banning things like high fructose corn syrup and inspecting every member of the herd for disease, including mad cow.
So, our companies have the additional expense of health care. If the government took this over it certainly would help us to compete.
File 11, cut wages and bennies in half so you don't have to can anyone and get to making decent economy cars. It really isn't that hard if you don't let the UAW drive it.
File 11, cut wages and bennies in half so you don't have to can anyone and get to making decent economy cars. It really isn't that hard if you don't let the UAW drive it.
Well, the decision to make garbage cars was that of management. How long have the Japanese been the only competitors in the US market? They STILL have not learned, because they are still making those mini trucks/vans.
There is enough blame to go around, but surelymanagement should take the brunt of it.
They have had more than enough warnings of the lousy job they were doing. There is no reason for them to just sit back while the Japanese took over the market, bit by bit.
When Iaccoca took over Chrysler he found the management so pitiful that he would have fired them all. He had to eat the overhead of an entire new management team.
These companies will NEVER be able to adequately compete unless ALL the management are dismissed, and without those golden parachutes or any other perks.
They ran the company down to the ground, just sitting on their fat posteriors, while employees got laid off and everything folded up around them. Why should they care? They got theirs.
Rewarding them with a bailout is just throwing good money after bad. The fact that they should come to the taxpayer with their hands out with NO plan on how they would turn their business around just proves how inept they are.
Then, the labor union agreements have to be nullified, and even some of the cushy pensions now being collected should be looked at if they are too far out of the range of 'normal'. THis is not punishing workers, but enabling more of them to survive.
Some of those agreements were way out of line, years back.
This can ONLY be done during bankruptcy, so that's what should happen, in my humble opinion.
Oh, and the new management should NEVER have salaries that exceed 5 times that of the average worker.
Frankly, I think the entire business is abysmal and probably not worth salvaging. There are new startup companies, like Tesla, that should be rewarded for actually trying to provide the public with a good product. In fact, maybe tesla management should be in charge of GM.
Some of these smaller startup auto manufacturers have proven that they are innovative and organized well. Oh, and willing to actually work.
Last edited by goldengrain; 11-27-2008 at 05:26 PM..
Well, the decision to make garbage cars was that of management. How long have the Japanese been the only competitors in the US market? They STILL have not learned, because they are still making those mini trucks.
There is enough blame to go around, but certainly the management should take the brunt of it.
They have had more than enough warnings of the lousy job they were doing. There is no reason for them to just sit back while the Japanese took over the market, bit by bit.
When Iococca took over Chrysler he found the management so pitiful that he would have fired them all. He had to eat the overhead of an entire new management team.
These companies will NEVER be able to adequately compete unless ALL the management is fired.
Rewarding them with a bailout is just throwing good money after bad. The fact that they should come to the taxpayer with their hands out with NO plan on how they would turn their business around just proves how inept they are.
Then, the labor union agreements have to be nullified, and even some of the cushy pensions now being collected should be looked at if they are too far from pensions of other companies.
This can ONLY be done during bankruptcy, so that's what should happen, in my humble opinion.
Oh, and the new management can NEVER have salaries that exceed 5 times that of the average worker.
Frankly, I think the entire business is abysmal and probably not worth salvaging. There are new startup companies, like Tesla, that should be rewarded for actually trying to provide the public with a good product.
Like I said in an a previous post, GM doesn't only make gas guzzlers or mini trucks as you say. The fact is they have the most models with an EPA estimate of 30mpg highway than any other manufacturer. As far as corporate average, I believe they come in 3 out of 18 when compared to all imports. And it also makes me wonder when people keep saying that the U.S. auto makers produce cars no one wants. I think to be more accurate, they are building cars that the environmentalist don't want. GM has reinstated overtime at SUV plants so if no one wanted them you would think they would be closing those places down. The Ford F150 has been the best selling vehicle for over 20 years. GM has always out sold all other car makers worldwide although this year for the first time that probably will change. Point is, while I agree GM and the other U.S. manufacturers can do things better, they are not as bad as some people wold like to make them out.
I'm not for these bailouts and I will never be for gubmint to tell us what our salaries must be.
I refuse to buy a car not made in America. I think the republican red states with the like of Toyota plants are trying to see that the big 3 fail. They think they will get the corner on the manufacturing market if Detroit goes down.
I agree that taking luxury private jets was stupid, but what makes anyone think that the folks from Toyota or Honda wouldn't have done the same thing?
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