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As long as we have people whose first definition of blacks is as welfare cheats or even affirmative action cheats, no...the dream is not yet realized.
And as long as it is more important to get "the first non-white president" in office, it is not realized.
When it is made such a big deal...the dream is not realized. He is being judged by the color of his skin and not his character. It seemed more important to get him in because he was who he was as opposed to his policies.
Location: Huntersville/Charlotte, NC and Washington, DC
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Originally Posted by Reads2MUCH
Hello everyone, I just wanted to start up a thread to discuss Dr. Martin Luther King. But please understand, his death is not what this thread is about! Instead, I'd really like to discuss the influence of Dr. King and ask the question, "Have we realized the dream that Dr. King spoke about?"
Sure, your thinking how in the hell can any of us really answer that question. Well, that's a good point. But I for one feel like we aren't there yet, but we are gaining on it. I believe that had the man lived to see today he would have felt his life meant something. Because that's what we fail to talk about on Martin Luther King Day. His life. Most conversation usually centers around his death. And that seems like such a waste.
Yes, before any of you start I know he was no saint. Just like me and you and you and you he had a past. But does that change who the man became? Absolutely not. His message was one of peace, love, and equality and for me that is what is important. No matter who Dr. Martin Luther King may have been at home, when he spoke he brought a message of hope to a torn people and placed strange thoughts into the minds of many narrow minded people.
So now that I have bored you to death, please feel free to comment on Dr. King, his life or any other thoughts you may have on this subject. Please, keep it respectful.
To be honest, i dont think we have reached King's total vision. We just elected a president who some would vote for only b/c of his color and some wouldn't vote for only beacuse of his color. I didn't vote for him squarely because of his stance on the issues and i would probably be called a sellout because of my vote for another candidate (not McCain.) There are still goons (Don Imus for example) who judge certain communities only b/c of skin color. As a hard-line anti-illegal i can assure you some who share my views on illegals are totally racist and would not want latinos in the US regardless of if they are here illegally or not or even assimilated fully. There are still too many stereotypes about every race.
I think Dr. King's vision can and will be reached. I think it will be a long and hard process but i think one day Dr. King will look down on the United States and will have a smile from ear to ear. In my personal life, i try my hardest everyday to live Dr. King's dream by letting people show that they are worth my time, regardless of color, before i'll befriend them.
I honor this man on his birthday but I think he would be pleasantly surprised where we are today regarding race relations in the US. I was born post Civil rights and can't even imagine that era or what my fellow black Americans had to go through.
Dr King's message was one of hope which was something most of humanity can relate to.
I think hs feelings would be mixed.
There is still a lot of white racism around. It's not exactly 1963 Mississippi, but it's not like there aren't a lot of white people who wouldn't be too happy with their daughter going out with a black guy. Any black guy.
Also, up until the late 60s the black community was improving in both Civil Rights and economic prosperity. White Flight, the increase in alcoholism and drug addiction in the black community, the black middle class moving out of traditionally black neighborhoods, and race riots are the roots of this.
So while King would certainly be happy to see that a black family could move into most white neighborhoods without any fear for their safety and that a significant percentage of white people will vote for black man (never mind those who would if he had comparable politics as themselves), he would still be dishearted that white racism still isn't exactly rare and that the black community has seen relatively little economic and social improvement since his death.
I can say without a doubt we have made vast progress in views of race, but as far as reaching King's vision, not even close. We still have a very long way to go and it will probably be at least two more generations (likely more) before we reach such a point of view.
King's vision spoke of people viewing each other as people, instead of black, white, Christian, Jew, Muslim, etc... I'm not sure people are capable of this and it is hard for me to see this happening in my lifetime as people seem to always seek out some means to differentiate themselves from others and keep tribally segregated. I suppose there will be a day when it is the tribe of humans but it is hard to imagine.
"Have we realized the dream that Dr. King spoke about?"
I don't think that we are anywhere close to fulfilling the dreams of King. Most folks do great disservice to the I Have Dream speech, which has to be viewed in historical context, pressuring the Kennedy administration to pass both Civil Rights and voting rights legislation, by ignoring King's prior statements, those made subsequently regarding affirmative action and economic and social justice. If one wishes to discuss King's dream, one has to do so in the full context of King's later efforts on behalf of peace and social justice.
Yesterday, I was at Duke University where Rev. Joseph Lowery, who along with King founded the Southern Christian Leadership Conference (SCLC) spoke during a commemorative celebration where he made this point painfully apparent. Lowery reminded those in attendance that the great disparity between CEO and worker salaries wasn't a fulfillment of King's dream, he chastised those in the black community who opposed the rights of gays and lesbians and he reminded us of King's forthright opposition to unjust wars. In light of these growing disparities, we have a very long ways to go before realizing King's dream. As Lowery also pointed out, the election of Obama, as exhilarating as it may be, is just another step towards fulfilling the Dream.
I don't think that we are anywhere close to fulfilling the dreams of King. Most folks do great disservice to the I Have Dream speech, which has to be viewed in historical context, pressuring the Kennedy administration to pass both Civil Rights and voting rights legislation, by ignoring King's prior statements, those made subsequently regarding affirmative action and economic and social justice. If one wishes to discuss King's dream, one has to do so in the full context of King's later efforts on behalf of peace and social justice.
Yesterday, I was at Duke University where Rev. Joseph Lowery, who along with King founded the Southern Christian Leadership Conference (SCLC) spoke during a commemorative celebration where he made this point painfully apparent. Lowery reminded those in attendance that the great disparity between CEO and worker salaries wasn't a fulfillment of King's dream, he chastised those in the black community who opposed the rights of gays and lesbians and he reminded us of King's forthright opposition to unjust wars. In light of these growing disparities, we have a very long ways to go before realizing King's dream. As Lowery also pointed out, the election of Obama, as exhilarating as it may be, is just another step towards fulfilling the Dream.
I think this is where we start to get off track. When you start talking about CEO pay, foreign policy and economics "mission creep" begins to set in and you begin devovling from "civil rights" into "peace & socail justice".
King's most profound impact was to shame white america into the realization that the denial of basic civil rights to blacks was wrong & needed to be redressed and then people need to be treated equally regardless of race. We have made huge strides in this area ( exhibit A. occurs tommorow).
Many other people have tried to tap MLK's moral authority by using his stances on Vietnam, income disparities, etc to advance their own agendas. But at the end of the day, it was his message on racial justice that rings the most true and where he changed the hearts of his countrymen and will be what he is remebered for 200 years from now.
I don't think that we are anywhere close to fulfilling the dreams of King. Most folks do great disservice to the I Have Dream speech, which has to be viewed in historical context, pressuring the Kennedy administration to pass both Civil Rights and voting rights legislation, by ignoring King's prior statements, those made subsequently regarding affirmative action and economic and social justice. If one wishes to discuss King's dream, one has to do so in the full context of King's later efforts on behalf of peace and social justice.
Yesterday, I was at Duke University where Rev. Joseph Lowery, who along with King founded the Southern Christian Leadership Conference (SCLC) spoke during a commemorative celebration where he made this point painfully apparent. Lowery reminded those in attendance that the great disparity between CEO and worker salaries wasn't a fulfillment of King's dream, he chastised those in the black community who opposed the rights of gays and lesbians and he reminded us of King's forthright opposition to unjust wars. In light of these growing disparities, we have a very long ways to go before realizing King's dream. As Lowery also pointed out, the election of Obama, as exhilarating as it may be, is just another step towards fulfilling the Dream.
Well said and point taken. I guess many of us are probably guilty of concentrating more on King's fight for equality for black men and women than his overall fight for basically the betterment of mankind as a whole. This was sort of the point I was getting at with the OP. He fought for equality, peace, love and respect between all races. He wanted us all to accept and work together and have the opportunity to really live the American dream. A dream that corporate America has been hard at work destroying while they make themselves richer and richer.
So while King would most assuredly be pleased by the current state of race relations here in America, he would probably still be fighting tooth and nail for equal rights in the work place and competitive pay for the worker. These are issues we should all be fighting for anyway. We just need a presence to get behind with a good heart and just intentions. There can be only one Dr. Martin Luther King, but there is always room for another historic figure to step in and galvanize the nation.
Many other people have tried to tap MLK's moral authority by using his stances on Vietnam, income disparities, etc to advance their own agendas. But at the end of the day, it was his message on racial justice that rings the most true and where he changed the hearts of his countrymen and will be what he is remebered for 200 years from now.
It isn't me who is veering off track, the veering off track is being done by those who would prefer to deal only with Kings legacy regarding race. When King moved to social and economic justice, he threatened interest far more sweeping than those of Bull Connor and George Wallace, King then became a threat to the very basis of the countries economic and social structure.
"We aren't merely struggling to integrate a lunch counter now... "We're struggling to get some money to be able to buy a hamburger or a steak when we get to the counter.
It didn't cost the nation one penny to integrate lunch counters. It didn't cost the nation one penny to guarantee the right to vote. The problems that we are facing today will cost the nation billions of dollars."
Hello everyone, I just wanted to start up a thread to discuss Dr. Martin Luther King. But please understand, his death is not what this thread is about! Instead, I'd really like to discuss the influence of Dr. King and ask the question, "Have we realized the dream that Dr. King spoke about?"
Sure, your thinking how in the hell can any of us really answer that question. Well, that's a good point. But I for one feel like we aren't there yet, but we are gaining on it. I believe that had the man lived to see today he would have felt his life meant something. Because that's what we fail to talk about on Martin Luther King Day. His life. Most conversation usually centers around his death. And that seems like such a waste.
Yes, before any of you start I know he was no saint. Just like me and you and you and you he had a past. But does that change who the man became? Absolutely not. His message was one of peace, love, and equality and for me that is what is important. No matter who Dr. Martin Luther King may have been at home, when he spoke he brought a message of hope to a torn people and placed strange thoughts into the minds of many narrow minded people.
So now that I have bored you to death, please feel free to comment on Dr. King, his life or any other thoughts you may have on this subject. Please, keep it respectful.
I agree ! It feels like we are close but not entirely there yet. I think had he lived, we might have seen his dream fulfilled sooner.
He was such a good man, and a hero in my book.
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