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are you guys really so blind you can't see the GOP is simply offering more of the same policy? At which point are you guys going to realize tax cuts aren't the answer? We tried it look where we are!
This was echoed in an editorial today in the Washington Post. I think this one line sums it up nicely:
"If Republicans hadn't broken the bank with drunken-sailorish spending during most of George W. Bush's time in the White House, their complaints about the cost of the stimulus package and its impact on future deficits would be more credible."
The Republicans disagree with what is in the "stimulus" package. There are too many items that do nothing to stimulate the economy or create employment. The Democrats crafted this bill with zero input from the Republicans. Why are they surprised when Republicans disagree with how the money is spent...
This proves that republicans live under the rock. According to a study presented, food stamps and UI have the best return for each dollar that government spends. Sounds like an alien idea, doesn't it?
are you guys really so blind you can't see the GOP is simply offering more of the same policy? At which point are you guys going to realize tax cuts aren't the answer? We tried it look where we are!
Grrr...first response went *poof*.
You may call me naive (I can handle it) but I think the failure there was in the way we 'redistributed' the money...issuing returns with the bid to spend it. SPEND! SPEND! SPEND!
Look, Walmart has that glossy wide-screen on sale and I'll be stimulating the economy, too!
They should've saved it as emergency funding.
Tax cuts which would be reflected directly on the pay stub better help enable the struggling worker - while seeming insignificant in a weekly amount, would make the difference between a tank of gas, a healthy meal on the table or remitting a utility bill - or not. While people scoffed at the notion, I thought back to when I was living paycheck to paycheck and what it might have done for me...
That might be one of the only things I've agreed with Obama on so far.
You and I seem to view the package differently - I see lots of fluff in there. And waste to me is not anything we can afford, no matter the quantity. Some of the development sounds half-assed. Sorry.
Food stamps, if re-managed like WIC where it was set for specific purchases - OK. I've gotten in to that argument before - I don't see candy and soda as food staples. And I get flamed for it. I call it public assistance and not 'owed' to the recipient. More flames.
Oh well.
Education and jobs - YES.
I am behind the idea of creating 'new jobs' in a workforce being left behind by technology, too stifled by economic turns to advance themselves - retraining is a viable option to better prepare the otherwise uneducated worker. There may or not be a job immediately waiting, but he will have the ability to effectively change fields and attempt to manage his position with the proper tools. I do not suggest by this permission to constantly flip, stirred by whim, but a concentration of courses based on the study of future needs.
Not free degrees, just basic introductions. An attempt at modest prosperity instead of remaining idle.
I don't think everyone is 'entitled' by taxation to go to college, but as a society it makes sense that we educate our citizens, so by their own motivation and our national resource, to the extent that they are able to productively support themselves. I'd prefer to see that as a local community effort, not Government bulk...but at this point, well...
To assist the unskilled laborer, even there we need to focus on supply and demand. I'm not an analyst, but it would seem to me prudent to encourage growth and sustainable employment...resodding a mall (etc.) is not exactly what I had in mind, because that's only a temporary fix. Cosmetic in every way. A band-aid to cover a gaping wound. Rural development? That could be ridiculous. I don't know enough about that yet to see if that means paved roads to the boondocks or Dollar Generals on every corner of Appalachia. I'm still mulling over a solution - if I come up with one, I'll let you know. And then you can take my great idea and run for office.
I was not raised to believe that my country owed me a position, that I would need little effort to make my way. I was taught to utilize initiative, to choose to be productive by my own means. Old-fashioned gumption. However, I do see a deficit where we as a whole are allowing for a population to fall behind and that concerns me. Not at a government level but as a society.
I am with you in want for success, however. To fail means more suffering and decline.
The House Reps are smarter then you think. They know that this package was nothing more then a socialist welfare program with little if any stimulus to the economy. The Reps also know how fickle the American people are and in two years when things don't get better there will be another "cleaning out" of Congress as there was 2 years ago.
Why would Reps sign their names to a destined to fail package? In the next 2 years they will use this failure to pick up seats in both the House and Senate. Let's also not forget the 11 smart Dems that voted against this sham. They also know the truth and had the cajones to vote against this sham, (in the real spirit of bipartisanship), and put their constituents first.
Anyway, why are the Dems and the Obama's so worried about what Reps do? Reps are the minority and the Dems can outvote them at anytime. No, Obama and the Dems wanted the Reps to go along with this miserable failure so that they could point to the Reps, (when the American people wake up and see the failure as well), and say that they also went along with it. Very smart move on the House Reps part and the 11 very smart Dems. Obama is not looking for bipartisanship from the Reps, he's looking for complicity so he and the Dems won't have to take the heat alone when the American people start wanting real answers.
You may call me naive (I can handle it) but I think the failure there was in the way we 'redistributed' the money...issuing returns with the bid to spend it. SPEND! SPEND! SPEND!
Look, Walmart has that glossy wide-screen on sale and I'll be stimulating the economy, too!
They should've saved it as emergency funding.
They didn't!
Tax cuts which would be reflected directly on the pay stub better help enable the struggling worker - while seeming insignificant in a weekly amount, would make the difference between a tank of gas, a healthy meal on the table or remitting a utility bill - or not. While people scoffed at the notion, I thought back to when I was living paycheck to paycheck and what it might have done for me....
Your ignoring the fact the many aren't getting a paycheck! The number of unemployment is skyrocketing!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458
That might be one of the only things I've agreed with Obama on so far.
You and I seem to view the package differently - I see lots of fluff in there. And waste to me is not anything we can afford, no matter the quantity. Some of the development sounds half-assed. Sorry..
There is always waste! This is quickly becoming an emergency situation and the Reps. offered nothing of substance! We don't have time to wait for them! Many people are struggling and its becoming more expensive to fix by the day! I applaud moving foraward without them!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458
Food stamps, if re-managed like WIC where it was set for specific purchases - OK. I've gotten in to that argument before - I don't see candy and soda as food staples. And I get flamed for it. I call it public assistance and not 'owed' to the recipient. More flames..
Confused about what you propose!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458
Oh well.
Education and jobs - YES.
I am behind the idea of creating 'new jobs' in a workforce being left behind by technology, too stifled by economic turns to advance themselves - retraining is a viable option to better prepare the otherwise uneducated worker. There may or not be a job immediately waiting, but he will have the ability to effectively change fields and attempt to manage his position with the proper tools. I do not suggest by this permission to constantly flip, stirred by whim, but a concentration of courses based on the study of future needs.
Not free degrees, just basic introductions. An attempt at modest prosperity instead of remaining idle.
I don't think everyone is 'entitled' by taxation to go to college, but as a society it makes sense that we educate our citizens, so by their own motivation and our national resource, to the extent that they are able to productively support themselves. I'd prefer to see that as a local community effort, not Government bulk...but at this point, well....
So you oppose the expansion of Pell grants! Ok, thats your right!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458
To assist the unskilled laborer, even there we need to focus on supply and demand. I'm not an analyst, but it would seem to me prudent to encourage growth and sustainable employment...resodding a mall (etc.) is not exactly what I had in mind, because that's only a temporary fix. Cosmetic in every way. A band-aid to cover a gaping wound. Rural development? That could be ridiculous. I don't know enough about that yet to see if that means paved roads to the boondocks or Dollar Generals on every corner of Appalachia. I'm still mulling over a solution - if I come up with one, I'll let you know. And then you can take my great idea and run for office..
The point is to go forward with shovel ready projects creates the demand!
325,000,000, for priority road, bridge, and trail repair or decommissioning, critical deferred maintenance projects, facilities construction and renovation, hazardous fuels reduction, and remediation of abandoned mine or well sites!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458
I was not raised to believe that my country owed me a position, that I would need little effort to make my way. I was taught to utilize initiative, to choose to be productive by my own means. Old-fashioned gumption. However, I do see a deficit where we as a whole are allowing for a population to fall behind and that concerns me. Not at a government level but as a society..
I think you and I see the situation in a different manner! These jobs are not being put in place only to employ someone they're addressing real problems that have been ignored! So going forward with the projects creates demand!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 33458
I am with you in want for success, however. To fail means more suffering .and decline.
I agree and thank you for an honest well informed response!
I was still trying to validate the idea of tax cuts...but to address those not earning a paycheck - yes - we need to examine the current proposed assistance in the way of programs...and that retraining I mentioned. Some skills are still in demand but the businesses are failing, hence no need for new employees...others are in need of a new way to earn a living because that trade has become limited or obsolete.
Businesses themselves will fall because of this and while it is unfortunate, I think some of what we're seeing is a consumer-based natural selection. Too bad it hurts the workers most but not so much the CEO.
*I'm over-simplifying but that's the gist of it.*
About food stamps - my point was to structure the benefits so that items considered nutritional staples and or necessary toiletries would be allowed but nonsense like cheesy-poofs and twice-the-sugar-soda would be exempt...WIC, (back when I was an RX Tech that still had to ring up a grocery item or two) would only allow certain things to be purchased using the vouchers - anything deemed outside the parameters had to be funded by personal means (cash money)...what often gets me in 'trouble' is the idea that I dare suggest we limit what can or not be bought with such government assistance...and that's an argument for another thread.
"325,000,000, for priority road, bridge, and trail repair or decommissioning, critical deferred maintenance projects, facilities construction and renovation, hazardous fuels reduction, and remediation of abandoned mine or well sites!"
That isn't specific enough for me...I know, you're thinking - what the hellO does she WANT!? - but I see room for misuse of funds and flat-out stupidity. Have seen it, will see it again. I do not trust politicians or contractors. (I think I'm about to get in to 'trouble' again...) When I see a list of the exact repairs and construction, I may feel better about this.
People will hopefully come to appreciate what is actually a luxury, formerly taken for granted as common lifestyle. (Don't mean to sound preachy...I am one of those "people".)
"Set aside that Economists and over 60% of Americans agree that the Economic Stimulus Package is a critically needed shot of adrenaline to the heart of our economy. Think of HR 1 as a crash cart brought into ICU with no time to waste. So what do the Republicans do? They get in between the patient and the doctor and say “let’s lay hands instead”. Really. That is what they did. The bill passed last night without ONE SINGLE REPUBLICAN VOTE. Not one Republican was willing to reverse course, change the Bush Policies that got us into this fix. NOT ONE will even try to save this Economy
Not one.
Politics came first, governing dead last. You can starve, freeze or watch a sick child go without medicine for all they care. Their goal is to become a MAJORITY PARTY again, and nothing else matters."
Why are there quotes around this? Who are you quoting?
"Set aside that Economists and over 60% of Americans agree that the Economic Stimulus Package is a critically needed shot of adrenaline to the heart of our economy. Think of HR 1 as a crash cart brought into ICU with no time to waste. So what do the Republicans do? They get in between the patient and the doctor and say “let’s lay hands instead”. Really. That is what they did. The bill passed last night without ONE SINGLE REPUBLICAN VOTE. Not one Republican was willing to reverse course, change the Bush Policies that got us into this fix. NOT ONE will even try to save this Economy
Not one.
Politics came first, governing dead last. You can starve, freeze or watch a sick child go without medicine for all they care. Their goal is to become a MAJORITY PARTY again, and nothing else matters."
Have you read this bill? Didn't think so. This isn't a "stimulus". It is a pork barrel spending bill, with all kinds of pet projects.
Anyway, what do you care? They didn't need Republican support.
The only reason they wanted the Republicans to go along is because when it fails, and it will, they wanted to be able to say that it was "bipartisan" and the Republicans voted for it too. This way, they can hang by themselves.
The republicans are following in jesus footsteps as a carpenter! They're putting the last nails in their coffin! They met an extended hand and turned their backs to it!
Oh, give me a break!!! How silly! Are you for real?
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