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Said by economic historian Arnold Toynbee. He died in the 1970's, so it's not a commentary on the present economic situation, but I fear he may be right.
Quote:
"The release of initiative and enterprise made possible by self-government ultimately generates disintegrating forces from within. Again and again, after freedom brings opportunity and some degree of plenty, the competent become selfish, luxury-loving and complacent; the incompetent and unfortunate grow envious and covetous; and all three groups turn aside from the hard road of freedom to worship the golden calf of economic security. The historical cycle seems to be: from bondage to spiritual faith; from spiritual faith to courage; from courage to liberty; from liberty to abundance; from abundance to selfishness; from selfishness to apathy; from apathy to dependency; and from dependency back to bondage once more."
Did you actually read the Snopes article you just linked, or did you just punch in part of the quote into Google and link when you saw "Snopes" come up with an article with "False" in red at the top?
That article makes no mention of Toynbee, who is a well-documented 20th century historian who examined history through the rise and fall of civilizations. The article is about an email circulating around that attributes statements made by an 18th century professor Tyler/Tytler, of which are of unverifiable. It appears whoever concocted this e-mail attributed to Tyler integrated some of Toynbee's suppositions into his creation in order to make it look more "prophetic" coming from someone 200 years earlier.
Toynbee however, is contemporary and well-documented who studied societal decay. Maybe you don't agree with some of his conclusions, that's fair. (And Toynbee certainly doesn't claim that civilizations must always follow this pattern, just that this pattern exists.) However, it's a pattern that some of us observe in our current society. It doesn't mean that our society WILL follow this pattern, but that it might. IF enough of us do, at some point, see a pattern of complacency and self-entitlement currently present, maybe if we wake up and make wiser choices and change the outcome.
This quote itself is most likely attributed to The Prospects of Western Civilization (New York, Columbia University Press 1949), which is a collection of Toynbee's lectures, as it is primarily a verbal attribution from his talks. Even if not precise, the content of the quote reflects Toynbee's very well-documented ideas.
Actually, I went to a rather extensive quote site and did a search for this before looking at Snopes, and didn't find any matches there. Since you attribute this to Toynbee, I requested the source writing where this was stated.
So far, you haven't provided anything specific. So I guess you just don't know.
Toynbee is a historian who studied comparative economic history in which he observed patterns that led to the rise and fall of civilizations. Part of his studies including observing patterns of prosperity leading to decadence and a lack of productivity, which in tern can (and often has) contributed to a civilization's doom.
Do we see this occurring in our society now? Should we be concerned? What changes can we make to prevent this decay? Is this observation about history valid? (i.e., are we moving toward the proverbial "fiddling while Rome burned"?)
Not really, I was requesting a legitimate source. I assumed it may be true, and if so I wanted to read the context in which the observation had been stated.
When one states that a significant and respected historical figure said something profound, and relevant to todays issues, one would hope that individual had validated the specific source.
Otherwise, what we have is speculation, which is of little value in the discussion.
Not really, I was requesting a legitimate source. I assumed it may be true, and if so I wanted to read the context in which the observation had been stated.
When one states that a significant and respected historical figure said something profound, and relevant to todays issues, one would hope that individual had validated the specific source.
Otherwise, what we have is speculation, which is of little value in the discussion.
Toynbee is a historian who studied comparative economic history in which he observed patterns that led to the rise and fall of civilizations. Part of his studies including observing patterns of prosperity leading to decadence and a lack of productivity, which in tern can (and often has) contributed to a civilization's doom.
Do we see this occurring in our society now? Should we be concerned? What changes can we make to prevent this decay? Is this observation about history valid? (i.e., are we moving toward the proverbial "fiddling while Rome burned"?)
That is the meat of what I had hoped to discuss.
Toynbee was not an economic historian per se. His major work A Study of History was a comparison of many major and minor civilizations over the ages, looking for common principles in their respective rises and falls.
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