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I've seen the photos of the station guards actually pushing and STUFFING people into the trains so the doors could shut.
Who in their right mind would want to live like that?
I'd rather be gut-shot.
In my almost twenty years of riding public transportation in Chicago, I've never been stuffed onto a train by another person, Tokyo is an extreme example, and everyone knows this. Yes, there have been uncomfortably crowded trains that I've found myself on, but my subway ride lasts only about ten minutes, so it still beats driving in my opinion. But again, this is all about choice, is it not? It is my choice to live where I live and commute how I commute, just as it is your choice to live where you live and commute where you commute. If I were willing to shell out hundreds of more dollars a month so that my ten minute ride to work was more pleasant, then that is my choice also, as it is the choice of anyone who is standing next to me on the subway, but must of us find that our money is best used in other fashions (e.g. the vacation I'm planning in a couple of weeks).
As for why some people would choose to live a certain way (e.g. being crammed into a little metal box for several minutes a day, well, life is also about compromise, I chose a career that is difficult to engage in outside of an urban environment, so you just have to take the good with the bad sometimes). For me to then complain that it is crowded and there are too many people in my way would be just as silly as a rancher complaining about the lack of contemporary art museums, Broadway productions, or world class symphonies in the countryside surrounding Cheyenne Wyoming.
Like others have said, PT is a great tool, but too many Americans are wedded to their cars. Part of it is the freedom of it, another is the insiduous mentality/bigotry of "I don't want to be in a public space with people not like myself".
He is right, you know. The taxes rural people pay to have landlines and electricity and mail routes extending out there alone wouldn't cover it. Rural-America is, in a way, subsidized by Metro-America.
Sure! ... and we see how well metro America produces milk, cheese, corn, wheat, cotton, and every other consumable! City people are clueless - ever work on a farm? It was the hardest work I ever did! Harder than mixing mud, and stacking for 3 bricklayers (by myself). IF you know about REAL work - you will know that is back breaking work! Without rural America you would be eating dogs & cats and wearing their fur.
FYI: hooking up to town resources cost a SMALL FORTUNE - several thousand dollars to hook to sewer so the town can stay in your pocket EVERY MONTH! ... same with water ... electric ... gas ... and even trash removal is a permanent expense.
You are seeing things on your side of the coin ... try looking at it in a third person prospective then you MIGHT START understanding my grievance with most of you and the weak perception you have on facts.
the way many of you see things is clearly JUST US (even though it almost sounds the same) which is NOT Justice.
You seem to get it like a senator who said he was in 57 states ... any you still FAIL to see the problem!
You worry about the few extra MPG and over look the cruise ship that takes HUNDREDS of gallons to go ONE MILE and the jets (like John Travolta owns a fleet of) which burns a horrendous amount of fuel.
it's like crying about the little clump of crab grass next to the huge bush of poison ivy!
Like others have said, PT is a great tool, but too many Americans are wedded to their cars. Part of it is the freedom of it, another is the insiduous mentality/bigotry of "I don't want to be in a public space with people not like myself".
I think you're painting with a broad brush, there.
Personally, I don't like crowds or crowded situations. Shoot, i don't even like being in a car with more than one other person. Even family.
Disneyworld has an efficient transportation system, but I hated it. It was also the last time I was on a bus (1986). But that's just me.
Outside of really dense cities, mass transit won't work. Not going where we want, when we want. we can afford the personal freedom of a car, and will use them until it is finacially imprudent to do so.
I think you're painting with a broad brush, there.
Personally, I don't like crowds or crowded situations. Shoot, i don't even like being in a car with more than one other person. Even family.
Disneyworld has an efficient transportation system, but I hated it. It was also the last time I was on a bus (1986). But that's just me.
Outside of really dense cities, mass transit won't work. Not going where we want, when we want. we can afford the personal freedom of a car, and will use them until it is finacially imprudent to do so.
It's a chicken and egg syndrome. I don't hate cars BTW. It's raining out and I sure wish I had one. But let's be real here: Los Angeles was built by and for the car, is that an enviorment you really want to live in?
The chicken/egg thing comes in when you look at American history: We scrapped PT and now people complain it doesn't work, so we scrap it some more, and people complain even more and so on. Europe and Japan have effcient networks and they're not "Festering Hellholes". More americans used mass transit in the 1920s, and arguably we were a far, far freeer, more capitalist society back then.
Nothing wrong with cars or driving, but more the mentality. If driving was so great, why the road rage? I personally know people who would never use PT but did drive once when they went to Europe. When asked why they didn't shift their habits when they came back home, they said "Becuase our buses and trains are filled with "Those People". I think that speaks volumes about the underlying drive behind American surubanization.
Sure! ... and we see how well metro America produces milk, cheese, corn, wheat, cotton, and every other consumable! City people are clueless - ever work on a farm? It was the hardest work I ever did! Harder than mixing mud, and stacking for 3 bricklayers (by myself). IF you know about REAL work - you will know that is back breaking work! Without rural America you would be eating dogs & cats and wearing their fur.
That's funny, considering that your agriculture is also heavily subsidized. I think you're getting your knickers twisted too quickly. No one is condescending on your lifestyle. Just realize how heavily interdependent it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital_Duck
You worry about the few extra MPG and over look the cruise ship that takes HUNDREDS of gallons to go ONE MILE and the jets (like John Travolta owns a fleet of) which burns a horrendous amount of fuel.
it's like crying about the little clump of crab grass next to the huge bush of poison ivy!
how petty have people REALLY GOTTEN?
It's amazing ...
How do you know I don't complain about cruise ships and private jets? Or is it just that you haven't heard me complain about cruise ships and private jets, therefore you assume I don't complain about cruise ships and private jets? Not to mention you apparently must not have heard me say that suburbs are much larger problems, emission wise, than rural areas. But I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume that you did, but you just have short term memory loss. No harm done.
It's a chicken and egg syndrome. I don't hate cars BTW. It's raining out and I sure wish I had one. But let's be real here: Los Angeles was built by and for the car, is that an enviorment you really want to live in?
Using LA (and the LA Basin) as an example - it it means not becoming a "high rise" world (such as New York), then yes - I for one, don't mind an enviornment built "for the car".
Nonsense might be too strong an opinion. I wasn't trying to lay down a single point as the overeall reason.
"What is the National Highway System?
It is approximately 160,000 miles (256,000 kilometers) of roadway important to the nation's economy, defense, and mobility. The National Highway System (NHS) includes the following subsystems of roadways (note that a specific highway route may be on more than one subsystem):
Interstate : The Eisenhower Interstate System of highways retains its separate identity within the NHS.
Other Principal Arterials: These are highways in rural and urban areas which provide access between an arterial and a major port, airport, public transportation facility, or other intermodal transportation facility.
Strategic Highway Network(STRAHNET): This is a network of highways which are important to the United States' strategic defense policy and which provide defense access, continuity and emergency capabilities for defense purposes.
Major Strategic Highway Network Connectors: These are highways which provide access between major military installations and highways which are part of the Strategic Highway Network.
Intermodal Connectors: These highways provide access between major intermodal facilities and the other four subsystems making up the National Highway System. A listing of all official NHS Intermodal Connectors is available....."
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. But let's be real here: Los Angeles was built by and for the car, is that an enviorment you really want to live in? 
