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Old 03-23-2009, 07:28 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,261,360 times
Reputation: 4937

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiwos View Post
I'm talking about the extreme case when nothing else has saved the polar bear from imminent extinction.
You put the animal(s) ahead of / over humans?
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:29 PM
 
Location: The Woods
18,358 posts, read 26,495,840 times
Reputation: 11351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiwos View Post
History shows a very poor track record of that actually happening.
What time period, who and where? Currently the goal of wildlife management is to protect animals so they do not go extinct and are kept in balance with what the environment can support, and so that hunting is sustainable. The Inuit have hunted polar bears for thousands of years. The early White settlers in many instances wanted to exterminate wildlife they saw as pests. There's no comparison with the different times, people, and places.
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,261,360 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiwos View Post
Rest assured they would if it came down to the Inuit vs. the last thousand polar bears.
You can provide proof of your assertion I am sure.

Or, is it merely your opinion?
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:32 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,261,360 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiwos View Post
In order for people to eat, threatened species do not have to die. Your argument fails.
Ah - no. Your argument HAS ALREADY FAILED.

They are not "threatened".

And, even if they were, I would fully support the Intuits rights to harvest the Bears for food, clothing etc.
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:33 PM
 
Location: Rural Central Texas
3,674 posts, read 10,605,252 times
Reputation: 5582
Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward View Post
Polar bears cannot "adapt." They need the ice sheets to survive.

The global temperature is changing because of us. It's idiotic to just blindly declare otherwise--against overwhelming evidence from scientists, worldwide--simply because you prefer to live in denial.

You can "support" the wanton destruction of other beings if you wish, and you can arrogantly live in ignorance and its subsequent denial, as well, about the anthropogenic causes of global climate change.
LOL. You are funny.


I know you are not going to heed anything mentioned beyond the first line where I "personally attacked you", but just in case....

Mankind has not created Global warming. Our contributions toward this effect are miniscule at best when compared to the greenhouse emmissions of the planet on it's own. Compare the total industrial world gas output against that of a couple volcanoes. Check the solar emissions against historic solar output and see if the temperature variants are not more in line with those values then the CO2 content of the atmosphere.

Global warming aside....let's pretend it is factual so you can feel better.....

Why do you think polar bears are less capable of adapting than any other animal? There are polar bears in zoos all over the world that do not have any ice sheets available. Why have they not died? They did not adapt to some other means of feeding or keeping cool due to their lack of adaptability, I am sure.

We all support the wanton destructions of other beings, even you. Your food is insect free I suppose. Those bugs had to be destroyed somehow for you to eat bug free meals. Your house is ant, roach and rodent free? How do you persuade them to stay away without killing them? Surely you don't permit someone to kill them for you do you? That would count as sport hunting if not for their own sustenance.
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:34 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,261,360 times
Reputation: 4937
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiwos View Post
I think their habitat loss is a drop in the bucket compared to 2% killed annually by hunters.
Yep - a few are killed by hunters.

How many are BORN each year? How many Polar Bear Cubs are born each year.

And why are you so hesitant to answer this question - which has been posed to you a number of times?

Afraid it might hurt your agenda?

Yep - that's it
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:36 PM
 
960 posts, read 1,163,240 times
Reputation: 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
You put the animal(s) ahead of / over humans?
No
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:39 PM
 
960 posts, read 1,163,240 times
Reputation: 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Currently the goal of wildlife management is to protect animals so they do not go extinct and are kept in balance with what the environment can support, and so that hunting is sustainable.
That may be the goal, but there are many changes yet to be made to reach it. Current methods clearly aren't working.

Quote:
The Inuit have hunted polar bears for thousands of years. The early White settlers in many instances wanted to exterminate wildlife they saw as pests. There's no comparison with the different times, people, and places.
I don't care if the white man killed off 99% of the polar bears, I'd still be against the Inuit killing the remainder.
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:43 PM
 
960 posts, read 1,163,240 times
Reputation: 195
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greatday View Post
They are not "threatened".
I disagree.

Quote:
And, even if they were, I would fully support the Intuits rights to harvest the Bears for food, clothing etc.
No surprise there. Conservatives don't care if the world goes to hell, as long as they're fat & happy.
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Old 03-23-2009, 07:46 PM
 
Location: NW Nevada
18,160 posts, read 15,628,539 times
Reputation: 17150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heiwos View Post
I'm talking about the extreme case when nothing else has saved the polar bear from imminent extinction. Some people in the Makah tribe (WA state) killed a whale, against the law. They were given a slap on the wrist from the tribe but if they do it again they'll likely go to jail outside the tribe. Yes millions of people think humans over other animals always, but millions of others disagree.


Total conservative B.S. What they do can affect us all, so we (or Canadians) will regulate them however we want, and do.
You deal with the res much? Lol, obviously not (that was a rhetorical question). Nobody but the tribe regulates jack on the res. When they say "soveriegn nation" they mean it. if you try to force this kind of attitude on the Indians around here you better come well armed. I figure the Inuit aren't that different. I don't care if the last whatever is on the res, if the Indians want to shoot and eat it they will, and what you, or any others may think about that matters about a fart in a high wind. LMAO, why don't you (and all these "millions"of others you claim to represent) march on out to a reservation and let the Indians know how you feel? I'm sure they will give you a warm welcome and see it your way. Have you EVER actually been to Indian land? Not just passing through but interacted with them and really seen how it is? Have any Indian/Native friends? I'm thinking not because the attitude you present regarding their rights would get you skinned and left in a gully around any of the folks I know on the res. If you think I'm kidding or don't know what I'm talking about think again. The Native folks I know would be about as nice as a grizzly bear with a sore tooth to someone marching onto their land and demanding they conform to some white mans ideal of making nice with nature. Thats NOT "conservitave BS". Thats the way it is. Inuit, Shoshone, Paiute, Apache, Washoe, Ute, Cheyenne, Souix, whatever, will give no more than they have. Don't think for a second that they are going to be "regulated" in any way because you might not like the fact they hunt Polar bears, elk , deer, Buffalo or any other animal and allow a certain number of tags for these animals to be purchased for hunt on their lands. They don't care a whit what some white man in a city somewhere thinks about how they do business and they will go to fighting about it as well if they get pushed. Thats reality, not a PETA pamphlet. Whew! The ignorance about Indian/Native people that some folks have is appalling! These folks don't mess around. They have been pushed enough and ifn' someones smart they won't push them much harder.
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