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Old 04-01-2009, 01:50 AM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,659,127 times
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NEW YORK (AP) — More than 1,000 retired military officers, including several who were top commanders, are urging President Barack Obama and Congress to maintain the law that bars gays from serving openly in the armed forces.

Obama is consulting with the Pentagon on the issue and says he supports eventual repeal of the "don't ask, don't tell" policy, which prohibits gays in the military from being open about their sexual orientation. A bill that would allow gays to serve openly has been introduced in Congress.

A statement issued by the retired officers Tuesday said passage of that bill "would undermine recruiting and retention, impact leadership at all levels, have adverse effects on the willingness of parents who lend their sons and daughters to military service, and eventually break the All-Volunteer Force."

The Associated Press: Retired military officers: keep ban on gays
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Old 04-01-2009, 01:52 AM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,659,127 times
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I think this sends two messages:

1. If you have any same-sex attractions, you should be ashamed of yourself.

2. American military men are wimps. Nearly every other modern country in the world (and some not-so-modern) allow all of their citizens to serve in the military with no restrictions based on sexual orientation. Why can't Americans handle it?
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Old 04-01-2009, 02:10 AM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,880 posts, read 15,191,594 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
I think this sends two messages:
1. If you have any same-sex attractions, you should be ashamed of yourself.

2. American military men are wimps. Nearly every other modern country in the world (and some not-so-modern) allow all of their citizens to serve in the military with no restrictions based on sexual orientation. Why can't Americans handle it?

get in a foxhole with an infantryman and say that agian.
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Old 04-01-2009, 02:11 AM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,659,127 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
get in a foxhole with an infantryman and say that agian.
I will. Gladly.
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Old 04-01-2009, 02:21 AM
 
Location: somewhere in the woods
16,880 posts, read 15,191,594 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
I will. Gladly.

if you are openly gay and the infantryman is not, then the one who is not gay would probably be worried that something might happen, and not his duty.

in combat that can get you killed.

even if you say to him nothing will happen, it will still be in his mind, and that is a distraction, and soldiers get kille by distractions.
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Old 04-01-2009, 02:44 AM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,659,127 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeywrenching View Post
even if you say to him nothing will happen, it will still be in his mind, and that is a distraction, and soldiers get kille by distractions.
All of the military guys I've heard from (including many here) have said that they don't go around thinking about anybody else's sexual orientation. It's a non-issue for most of them.

Also, if it's such a distraction, then how is it that almost every military in the modern world is able to handle openly gay people, but the U.S. cannot?

It comes down to conduct. That's all that matters.
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Old 04-01-2009, 03:44 AM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,271,474 times
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There are as many who say to overturn it.
This has been discussed in another thread with links included.

The ones wanting it overturned were Generals.
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Old 04-01-2009, 03:48 AM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
1,030 posts, read 1,453,175 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
All of the military guys I've heard from (including many here) have said that they don't go around thinking about anybody else's sexual orientation. It's a non-issue for most of them.

Also, if it's such a distraction, then how is it that almost every military in the modern world is able to handle openly gay people, but the U.S. cannot?

It comes down to conduct. That's all that matters.
I served 7 years and I agree with don't ask, don't tell even though I don't care if they get married. They don't need to be open in the military. Guess who is going to get tossed on the grenade.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:27 AM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,271,474 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nrfitchett4 View Post
I served 7 years and I agree with don't ask, don't tell even though I don't care if they get married. They don't need to be open in the military. Guess who is going to get tossed on the grenade.
Then heteros shouldn't "don't need to be open in the military" either.
No photos, no sickeningly sweet phonecalls, etc.
Separate and unequal is always a bad policy.

From the article: The retired officers said they strongly supported the principle that "homosexuality is incompatible with military service" and warned that repeal of current law could jeopardize morale and "unit cohesion."
They said the same thing about blacks and women.
"They" were wrong and out of touch with the times then, as well.
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Old 04-01-2009, 06:37 AM
 
1,902 posts, read 2,467,414 times
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Why is Barry dragging his feet on lifting this ban?

Did he change his mind?
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