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what would you say to someone who doesnt' believe in god? For anyone to ask a question outside of the wrelm of god in your eyes is indeed invalid.. because you cannot think in terms of god ever not existing.. yet you cannot prove that he/she does...
Don't ya just love the Bible? There's an answer for everything.
People that don't believe in God aren't searching for God or they are being driven by Satan. The Bible teaches that only those that pursue a belief in God will every achieve that. Go to church, read the bible, pray on it (hardest of all for non-believers obviously) and make it your life's journey to find God.
To the second part of what you just said, my answer would be 'Yep, that's right'. Except the 'she' part. Wow, now there's a whole other discussion waitin' to happen.
It's the old joke about an immovable object hitting an unstoppable force when you compare faith with science. Neither side will ever agree with the other so you just have to pick a side and go with it.
Shows I've seen on those very channels suggest scientific data from fossils and other findings that would prove the earth is a LOT older than religion states. I recently saw a program on a local news channel discussing this very topic where they interviewed teens to get their viewpoint.
Let's cut to the chase - how long ago was earth "created"? Would you automatically disagree with any scientist that finds evidence that might show otherwise?
the shows that i have seen from sept '08 through jan '09 have been shows that were centered on an attempt to reconcile science findings w/ the scriptures. from what i have seen, i have a totally different impression about the findings. to answer your question about the creation of the earth, my answer is that it was created when god formed it. it may have been many thousands of years ago or it may have been millions of years ago. we know that the bible doesn't say. to christians, it has no significance to our salvation. currently, carbon dating is the accepted method of dating geologic material, even though controversy has existed w/in the scientific community for years regarding the accuracy of its findings. that said, i assume that scientist have an innate desire to find the answers to seemingly perplexing questions. i know of no credible evidence which disproves any of the biblical account of creation. in fact, i would need to challenge anyone who makes a claim that they can disprove the creation with science. let them bring clear and convincing evidence on the subject. opinions and speculations of neofytes mean very little in the scheme of things.
Don't ya just love the Bible? There's an answer for everything.
People that don't believe in God aren't searching for God or they are being driven by Satan. The Bible teaches that only those that pursue a belief in God will every achieve that. Go to church, read the bible, pray on it (hardest of all for non-believers obviously) and make it your life's journey to find God.
To the second part of what you just said, my answer would be 'Yep, that's right'. Except the 'she' part. Wow, now there's a whole other discussion waitin' to happen.
It's the old joke about an immovable object hitting an unstoppable force when you compare faith with science. Neither side will ever agree with the other so you just have to pick a side and go with it.
I choose science... my experience with religion in being a gay person is that it involves a swift knife thrust to your back mid embrace...
no thankyou...
you can have it... best of luck to you on that..
that said, i assume that scientist have an innate desire to find the answers to seemingly perplexing questions. i know of no credible evidence which disproves any of the account of creation. in fact, i would need to challenge anyone who makes a claim that they can prove such a thing. opinions and speculations of neofytes mean very little in the scheme of things.
Guess what? I disprove your belief of a god. Why? Because to this day & age, to this very minute & second, there is NO proof that there is a god. How's that? Can YOU prove that there is a god? If you can, bring it on.
Since god has been brought into the debate.. i'd like to pose the question what does god have to do with religion? If you are Hindu you don't believe in a Christian god and the same with a Sikh. Does that mean they have any less claim to an afterlife or salvation than any other individual. I just don't think any religion has ownership of god. I as an individual have a personal relationship with god that countermands the bible, but that is part of my own spirituality. If you want to have faith in a Christian god and believe in all the figures in the bible, go right on ahead, have your god and have your religion, you can take ownership of that, but don't take ownership on my right as a human being to be married to someone I love. My god supports that. Christians don't have ownership of marriage, - or any other of the worlds great stories - i mean religions for that matter. Come to think of it -neither does a Miss California wannabe, but she can still marry whoever she wants regardless. God for these matters - isn't seperation of church and state a good thing.
Last edited by mississauga75; 05-01-2009 at 01:51 AM..
Since god has been brought into the debate.. i'd like to pose the question what does god have to do with religion? If you are Hindu you don't believe in a Christian god and the same with a Sikh. Does that mean they have any less claim to an afterlife or salvation than any other individual. I just don't think any religion has ownership of god. I as an individual have a personal relationship with god that countermands the bible, but that is part of my own spirituality. If you want to have faith in a Christian god and believe in all the figures in the bible, go right on ahead, have your god and have your religion, you can take ownership of that, but don't take ownership on my right as a human being to be married to someone I love. My god supports that. Christians don't have ownership of marriage, - or any other of the worlds great stories - i mean religions for that matter. Come to think of it -neither does a Miss California wannabe, but she can still marry whoever she wants regardless. God for these matters - isn't seperation of church and state a good thing.
Yep separation of Church and State is a great thing indeed and while I agree with you on your right to be married with whomever you wish, some of your religious musings don't make alot of sense. For instance, its easy to thrown around these terms of "my God" and "your God" but logically looking at it, one of these "Gods", none of them, or all of them (most unlikely) could be the real deal. The statement that "my God allows something that yours does not" indicates that one believes in no Gods or just their own. This is fine but it would make sense to say "your God doesn't exist" instead of the feel-good stuff.
You asked does a Hindu have less claim on an afterlife...well from an agnostic or atheistic standpoint than no. But if the Christian God is the correct one, which I believe, than yes absolutely. Conversely, if the Hindus have the correct answer than there is no Christian God.
So wile I respect the fact that you believe in your own spiritual God doesn't mean that I believe you are correct.
Ok that's enough religious/philosophical rambling out of me for tonight.
Guess what? I disprove your belief of a god. Why? Because to this day & age, to this very minute & second, there is NO proof that there is a god. How's that? Can YOU prove that there is a god? If you can, bring it on.
much better question? in the affirmative...can you prove there is no god? that will show me that you're much more intelligent.
What if she had said, "Honestly, ya'll, I think gays should be thrown into ovens and cremated. They're gross!" Would you still say she showed integrity because she answered the question honestly and straightforwardly? It sounds like you agree with her, and I'm okay with that, but would you still be admiring her honesty and integrity if she had said she thinks same-sex marriage should be legal?
She didn't say that, and if she had it would clearly have been outrageous and many more people would be outraged.
I don't happen to agree with her.
But she was asked for her opinion an a fractious issue. Asked for her personal opinion. Clearly Perez Hilton wanted to put someone on the spot, and she was the lucky girl. She could have given a meaningless politically correct answer. Some of the other girls did, and some of the answers were inane. She was asked for her personal opinion, and she gave it. That took some personal integrity, and a certain amount of bravery. She may not be Stephen Hawking intelligent, but to be Miss California she has to have a fair amount of social intelligence. And so she knew that her opinion wouldn't go over with everyone. Yet she still offered a direct answer to a direct question.
Perez Hilton's behavior in all this has been to terrible. He posed the question with the sole motivation of promoting his agenda. Any answer would serve his purpose. An exuberant yes, any couple that wants to get married should be able to do so would have been used in his PR campaign as validation. A politically correct answer would have been ridiculed. And California's answer, the goldmine!
I think she would now be better served by letting it go. Certainly the Miss USA Pageant would be better served by her letting it go.
Since god has been brought into the debate.. i'd like to pose the question what does god have to do with religion? If you are Hindu you don't believe in a Christian god and the same with a Sikh. Does that mean they have any less claim to an afterlife or salvation than any other individual. I just don't think any religion has ownership of god. I as an individual have a personal relationship with god that countermands the bible, but that is part of my own spirituality. If you want to have faith in a Christian god and believe in all the figures in the bible, go right on ahead, have your god and have your religion, you can take ownership of that, but don't take ownership on my right as a human being to be married to someone I love. My god supports that. Christians don't have ownership of marriage, - or any other of the worlds great stories - i mean religions for that matter. Come to think of it -neither does a Miss California wannabe, but she can still marry whoever she wants regardless. God for these matters - isn't seperation of church and state a good thing.
Believing in God and believing in religion are two different thing, agreed.
Do they (Sikh's and people of other religions) have less of a claim on the afterlife? Yes. Actually, not less of a claim but no claim at all.
Would they say the same about me? Yes.
God does not support homosexuality or gay marriage. If you bend God's words to fit what your situation then you're on your own. When you say 'My God....' then you're on the wrong track.
Christians do have ownership over marriage. You're getting married in the eyes of God.
Separation of Church and State? You need to educate yourself here. There is no law that says there has to been any separation of Church and State. What the law does say is, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." - this is the 1st Amendment and it just says that people can practice any religion they want.
Nowhere does it say that religious beliefs can't dictate and drive our federal or state laws. If voters want to restrict gay marriage because of their religious beliefs then this in completely Constitutional.
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Except the 'she' part. Wow, now there's a whole other discussion waitin' to happen. 
you show me yours...i'll show you mine!
