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Old 04-25-2009, 12:18 PM
 
Location: on the edge of Sanity
14,268 posts, read 18,821,156 times
Reputation: 7982

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miborn View Post
I totally respect your fear of Pitts. But I think they are getting a bad rap just like Dobie's and Rottie's have gotten in the past. I think the Pitts could have more of a tendency to be a mean dog if mishandled and mistreated that is probably why they are good for the fighting.
I agree with you, but what do we do about irresponsible pet owners? Miami has a ban on owning a pit bull. Humans are very cruel animals. After all, we even torture other humans. We bomb them and murder their children. However, we don't ban all humans. But a dog is a different story, since they are unpredictable and we cannot communicate with them to know if they are predisposed to violence. I've met a lot of very loving pit bull terriers. I've also met a few very mean labs. Euthanasia is a tough subject for me, because right now I've got 6 stray cats in my backyard who depend on me for food and I'm probably going to move. They deserve to live too, but the dozen or so shelters I've called won't even consider rescuing them. Having said that, I don't think they'd adapt well to living indoors.

Anyway, this is a difficult subject since these dogs often make wonderful, loyal pets, but they also maul and/or kill people for no reason.

 
Old 04-25-2009, 01:38 PM
 
Location: Florida
23,153 posts, read 26,038,809 times
Reputation: 27877
Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward View Post
This is the kind of story in which other salient facts are usually missing.
For example, was the dog poorly bred? Was the dog abused? Unsocialized? Did he spend his days tied to a tree, subjected to abuse by neighborhood kids or even his owners? Did the child taunt the dog or hurt the dog? Was a child left alone with a dog with known aggression?

Nope. MUCH easier to just demonize the dog.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward View Post
This is the kind of story in which other salient facts are usually missing.
For example, was the dog poorly bred? Was the dog abused? Unsocialized? Did he spend his days tied to a tree, subjected to abuse by neighborhood kids or even his owners? Did the child taunt the dog or hurt the dog? Was a child left alone with a dog with known aggression?

Nope. MUCH easier to just demonize the dog.
Tasha, an absolutely adorable, friendly and affectionate pit and my 2 year old grandson were raised together.
You know all those photos pit owners put up showing their kids and their pits snuggling? I can show you a dozen of those with Tasha and my grandson.
I can also show you the one with all the stiches holding his face together ...after Tasha suddenly grabbed him when he walked behind her while she was eating.
It took two adults to get Tasha to let go.
Pit owners refuse to acknowledge the difference those jaws make (not to mention the unpredicability), just cause they haven't witnessed it personally.
Neither would my son until that day.
 
Old 04-25-2009, 01:52 PM
 
3,709 posts, read 4,610,654 times
Reputation: 1671
Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward View Post
Amazing, isn't it?

Bad Rap : Bay Area Doglovers Responsible About Pitbulls (http://www.badrap.org/rescue/myths.cfm - broken link)

Pit Bull Myths
[quote=Venom View Post
Lock jaw theory.
lol]

I never made a claim that they were bred physically to lock their jaws, just instinctively. It is instinctive behavior with them. Interpretation: you do not have to train them to do this.

If you do not believe me, I am sure that I could set up a poodle bite vs. pit bull bit demonstration for you, but I assure you that it would not be pleasant for you during the second half.

Then you will see what I mean.

As far as your links, if you can imagine how Greenpeace members feel about oil companies' "green" commercials, there you have it. Apparently written by breeders for the consumption of the gullible.
 
Old 04-25-2009, 02:01 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,894,826 times
Reputation: 15037
Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
Every dog has it's own character even within breeds.
Well that's a fact, but having said that, temerament just like confirmation are qualities which breeders use when selectively pairing two dogs. I suspect that because too many Staffordshire Terriers (pitbulls) are bred by backyard breeders who are looking for traits far different than scrupulous breeders who are breeding for companionship or confirmation (show quality) that there is an overabundance of aggressive dogs which would require extensive expert training to socialize.

Quote:
The early months are the most important and the repetition of the same environment during those months will have a very important role in how it develops.
That is true as well but dogs can and should be temperament tested at 5 months of age. Dogs that show fear or aggressive dominance should never be sold or used as breeding stock when they reach maturity. Some breeders of work dogs that I have known would not hesitate from putting down an overly fearful or aggressive pup to eliminate the problem from the breeds line.

Quote:
If for example you have a dog that is beaten constantly you'll completely break it down into submission and it's going to be afraid of just about anyone.

On the other hand if you have a dog and constantly antagonize it from the time its a pup that dog will be a danger to anyone it's around including the owner.
I understand your point but I disagree with your examples, and I will also spare us all the details.
 
Old 04-25-2009, 02:07 PM
 
31,387 posts, read 36,894,826 times
Reputation: 15037
[quote=irishvanguard;8511516]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom View Post
Lock jaw theory.
lol


If you do not believe me, I am sure that I could set up a poodle bite vs. pit bull bit demonstration for you, but I assure you that it would not be pleasant for you during the second half.
I don't know what you are talking about. I can get a poodle to hold a bite just like any other dog including a pit bull, in point of fact after getting married I had to drop Dobermans due to my wife's allergies but our Standard Schnauzers were as tenacious biters (in a game of tug-a-war) as any Doberman or Rottweiler I've ever worked. In fact I could spin our male around in the air while he held on to a towel, just like a bulldog or a pit.
 
Old 04-25-2009, 02:14 PM
 
Location: San Diego
50,056 posts, read 46,553,810 times
Reputation: 33893
Quote:
Originally Posted by Venom View Post
Words from someone with no comeback.
I won't answer a question with another question and another question and another question. We could be here all year.

I will say it's like a lifted truck, a compensator
 
Old 04-25-2009, 02:22 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,600 posts, read 26,206,896 times
Reputation: 12624
Quote:
Originally Posted by MovingForward View Post
This is the kind of story in which other salient facts are usually missing.
For example, was the dog poorly bred? Was the dog abused? Unsocialized? Did he spend his days tied to a tree, subjected to abuse by neighborhood kids or even his owners? Did the child taunt the dog or hurt the dog? Was a child left alone with a dog with known aggression?

Nope. MUCH easier to just demonize the dog.
Read the stats I included. The pure bred pit bulls are the ones that attack. The muts are about the same as other dogs. No, no ,no and no. The dog was a family pet that simply decided to latch onto the child's jaw. Stop making excuses.
 
Old 04-25-2009, 02:39 PM
 
Location: Michigan
5,376 posts, read 5,323,831 times
Reputation: 1633
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
I've had it with these glassy eyed lunatic Pit Bull owners who simply refuse to understand that their dogs are a danger to all children at all times. Their is no safe Pit Bull ever. How many more times will we need to hear of a baby, small child or senior citizen being ripped to shreads by these ignorant animals before we realize that they cannot be made safe? I propose we ban this most vicious of dog breeds nationwide.

Pit bull kills 7-year-old Minneapolis boy at home

Pit Bull Kills Child in Huntington - WBOY-TV - WBOY.com (http://wboy.com/story.cfm?func=viewstory&storyid=2866 - broken link)

Pitbull KILLS 12month old in EastPointe MI - February 2009 Birth Club - BabyCenter

Pit bull kills child and injures grandmother | Independent, The (London) | Find Articles at BNET

12-Year-Old Boy Killed By Pit Bull - CBS News

http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Attacks%201982%20to%202006%20Clifton.pdf (broken link)
One of the few times I will pretty much agree with you.
 
Old 04-25-2009, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Michigan
5,376 posts, read 5,323,831 times
Reputation: 1633
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Speaking of...

Here's the numbers again.

http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Atta...%20Clifton.pdf (http://www.dogbitelaw.com/Dog%20Attacks%201982%20to%202006%20Clifton.pdf - broken link)

Nice to see my dogs are not on the list..........
 
Old 04-25-2009, 02:47 PM
 
Location: East Chicago, IN
3,100 posts, read 3,285,781 times
Reputation: 1697
Basically, if you own a big dog, as close as you are to them or how well you have trained them, like people, if they decide to just snap one day, you'll have a hell of a time attempting to get them under control.
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