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Old 05-10-2009, 04:11 AM
 
Location: Boise
4,426 posts, read 5,924,988 times
Reputation: 1701

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Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Last I heard sin was sin, but that's a straw man. Your sin is between you of your Creator. Redefining marriage and the public values we maintain as a nation are the actual issues. It would be a tremendous convenience for the pro-gay marriage folks to have a single opponent in the ultra-conservative Christian community, but that isn't the case since 37 states and the federal government have DOMAs. Their is no support for this in the public square. The reason gays will settle for nothing less than a legal distinction of marriage is that they want to force the rest of us to acknowledge their unnatural sexual relationship as equal to that of a natural heterosexual union. The rest of us, to include Christians and non-Christians, aren't buying it.
sin is sin... so why are you christians making such a fuss about gays marrying.. and not the same fuss over infidelity.. because last time I checked adultery is a sin as well... you have to battle all sin and not just sit and pick and choose which sin you want to combat as a christian..
Don't expect those DOMA laws to stick around too much longer.. and as it stands now.. more and more states are voting it in through the legislatures...
I don't want you to acknowledge anything about my relationship.. certainly not my sexual practicies thankyou very much..
but I do want the government I pay taxes to to be issuing me the same marriage license you recieve as well as all the perks and bene's...anything less is not acceptable.. and it is not YOURS as another citizen to withhold it from me! What you want to call unnatural is your business.. please don't throw it in my face that anything about me is unnatural.. because firstly you don't know anything about me and my relationship because it is none of YOUR business..
And for the record, marriage was not defined as a man and a woman until THOSE 37 states passed ammendments to their constitution for it to actually SAY THAT...
You're a hater, armed with what you think is godly and holy and just.. but really it's just ignorant bigotry...
you're welcome to it.. and please feel free to enlighten us further on your opinion.. I just think it's important for you to know where it stems from...
good luck with all that anger and bigotry.. life is a hard road when you have a chip on your shoulder..

cheers
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Old 05-10-2009, 09:47 AM
 
339 posts, read 708,213 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
Don't assume that all gay people agree with the attacks on her. I don't.

Actually, don't assume that all gays think alike on anything. A lot of people fall into that trap.
I don't, but they aren't exactly coming out saying, "hey now...wait a minute" either. Either are womens groups. You have to admit that. As a matter of fact, some (not all) are all for her bashing. Unfortunately, these are the ones are being well advertised. It's pathetic.
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Old 05-10-2009, 09:50 AM
 
Location: exit 0
5,344 posts, read 4,443,225 times
Reputation: 7076
Whoaaaaaaa, people. Let's stay on topic here. This thread (however inconsequential it may be) is about Miss California, not homosexual issues.
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:18 AM
 
339 posts, read 708,213 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by mississauga75 View Post
I guess when it comes to human rights people can get a little pissy. MLK was probably seen as pissy in his time, but alot of people tolerated injustice, alot of people tolerated racism and today alot of people tolerate homophobia and will tolerate classifying my relationship as 2nd tier - well I say lets not tolerate this double standard, lets not tolerate 2nd class citizens, lets not tolerate stereotypes about gays based on ignorance and fear, so I say lets not tolerate it anymore and lets promote equality for all.
Yeah...it's much better that people lie. And...it's about marriage not whether or not she likes homosexuals. Did she stand up there and say "I hate homosexuals"? No, but you would think she did. Most of the real hatred I have seen has been from people who keep talking about how we should be tolerant. I guess they never heard the phrase, "Kill em' with kindness", and they clearly don't practice what they preach.

Again...Don't ask the question if you don't want an honest answer. If I was "the judge" who asked the question, I would probably give her a good score for her answering honestly when she could have taken the easy way out (as apparently a majority thinks she should have). That's just me.
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Mississauga
1,577 posts, read 1,958,717 times
Reputation: 306
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Last I heard sin was sin, but that's a straw man. Your sin is between you of your Creator. Redefining marriage and the public values we maintain as a nation are the actual issues. It would be a tremendous convenience for the pro-gay marriage folks to have a single opponent in the ultra-conservative Christian community, but that isn't the case since 37 states and the federal government have DOMAs. Their is no support for this in the public square. The reason gays will settle for nothing less than a legal distinction of marriage is that they want to force the rest of us to acknowledge their unnatural sexual relationship as equal to that of a natural heterosexual union. The rest of us, to include Christians and non-Christians, aren't buying it.
A nations people evolve and change. This has been a constant dynamic through time including that of the public values of a nation. What is very real here is the fact that the U.S has had very recent and strong example of this evolution that it is being repeated.

The fact that you feel it is an unnatural sexual relationship and is second tier is again is a matter of opinion, however the opinion has destructive consequences to a group of people who grow up with this message. It is why we are more apt to commit suicide. It is why boys are bullied at school and kill themselves. It reinforces the allowance of discrimination because at the end of the day it all boils down to, people like you who aren't buying it because you feel it is unnatural. It is why I can't walk down many streets without being laughed at because I hold my dates hand. That is sad, when an expression of love is invalidated because someone is of the belief that I am unnatural.

Going back to the matter of public policy. In Canada, denying the right of two individuals to marry was considered unconstitutional because it violated the charter of rights. From then on, that precedent was set and one by one the provinces followed that precedent. The same is happening right now in the U.S at an earlier stage and i presume this is the reason these threads are so popular.

Putting religion aside, because I think many of the people who don't support gay marriage aren't all religious fundamentalists. Making that assumption, the contention that homosexuality is unnatural is not supported by nature as we have a plethora of examples in the animal kingdom of homosexuality. Nature/God has provided us, those of us who want to look at this with open eyes many of examples of same-sex unions.

Last edited by mississauga75; 05-10-2009 at 10:41 AM..
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:39 AM
 
Location: Mississauga
1,577 posts, read 1,958,717 times
Reputation: 306
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDTD View Post
Yeah...it's much better that people lie. And...it's about marriage not whether or not she likes homosexuals. Did she stand up there and say "I hate homosexuals"? No, but you would think she did. Most of the real hatred I have seen has been from people who keep talking about how we should be tolerant. I guess they never heard the phrase, "Kill em' with kindness", and they clearly don't practice what they preach.

Again...Don't ask the question if you don't want an honest answer. If I was "the judge" who asked the question, I would probably give her a good score for her answering honestly when she could have taken the easy way out (as apparently a majority thinks she should have). That's just me.
Ultimately my friend, if we advocate second tier status to committed adults she might as well have said that she hates homosexuals. Lets get right to the heart of it shall we.

She is advocating the human rights of a group of people be null and void. Of course we have freedom to say such things in venues like this and others. I think its good she made the statement because it gets people talking about this and violating human rights is worth talking about.
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:56 AM
 
Location: Mississauga
1,577 posts, read 1,958,717 times
Reputation: 306
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibginnie View Post
Whoaaaaaaa, people. Let's stay on topic here. This thread (however inconsequential it may be) is about Miss California, not homosexual issues.
It's easy for that to happen, though I do think the two are now intertwined.
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Old 05-10-2009, 12:53 PM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,705,849 times
Reputation: 7943
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDTD View Post
I don't, but they aren't exactly coming out saying, "hey now...wait a minute" either. Either are womens groups. You have to admit that. As a matter of fact, some (not all) are all for her bashing. Unfortunately, these are the ones are being well advertised. It's pathetic.
Well, I guess I don't see any organized gay groups making public statements against her. I could be wrong about that, I admit. I also don't think it's the responsibility of gay groups to support her either. This is mostly a tabloid-type of story, and doesn't deserve to be elevated any higher than it already is.
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Old 05-10-2009, 01:05 PM
 
339 posts, read 708,213 times
Reputation: 173
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale View Post
Well, I guess I don't see any organized gay groups making public statements against her. I could be wrong about that, I admit. I also don't think it's the responsibility of gay groups to support her either. This is mostly a tabloid-type of story, and doesn't deserve to be elevated any higher than it already is.
True...not that I recall either. That one dude was absolutely vicious on her, but that was more of a tabloid thing if I remember.
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Old 05-10-2009, 01:14 PM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,705,849 times
Reputation: 7943
Quote:
Originally Posted by JDTD View Post
True...not that I recall either. That one dude was absolutely vicious on her, but that was more of a tabloid thing if I remember.
Yeah, I would consider him to be tabloid material, definitely. The only problem for gays is that some people consider him to be a spokesman for all gays, which is obviously not true.
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