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View Poll Results: Pro choice or pro life?
I am pro-life with children 79 18.12%
I am pro-life without children 69 15.83%
No opinion-don't care 18 4.13%
I am pro-choice with children 124 28.44%
I am pro-choice without children 146 33.49%
Voters: 436. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-17-2009, 11:33 AM
 
Location: NJ
31,771 posts, read 40,672,588 times
Reputation: 24590

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Langlen View Post
And for some women, abortion is that way of "paying for it".

It's not a decision made lightly, nor easily. You don't just skip down to the abortion clinic with a happy demeanor and asked to be vacuumed.
abortion is an easy way out. its not paying for the mistake.

if they didnt see it as murder, why would it be such a difficult decision?

 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:37 AM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
8,346 posts, read 7,041,135 times
Reputation: 2874
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainNJ View Post
abortion is an easy way out. its not paying for the mistake.

if they didnt see it as murder, why would it be such a difficult decision?
Just because one doesn't see it as murder doesn't mean it's an easy decision. People struggle with it. Some, like my wife, wanted to have the child, but knows that if she tried, she would have died. And if I had to choose between my wife and a child, I'd choose my wife every time.

It may be the "easy way out", but by no means is it "easy".
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:37 AM
 
439 posts, read 443,286 times
Reputation: 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Langlen View Post
And for some women, abortion is that way of "paying for it".

It's not a decision made lightly, nor easily. You don't just skip down to the abortion clinic with a happy demeanor and asked to be vacuumed.
In an abortion, the child pays for it with his/her life.

Thats why it is unacceptable.

Why should the child pay for the woman's mistake?

To give someone the death penalty because his/her mother had sexual relations is not right.

Doctors should not be able to kill one patient for the convenience of another.

If you went to the doctor and asked him to cut off your arm, he would tell you he cannot do it. (i.e. you cannot always do what you want with your own body)

Why should he be allowed to destroy a separate individual at the woman's request?
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:39 AM
 
439 posts, read 443,286 times
Reputation: 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Langlen View Post
Just because one doesn't see it as murder doesn't mean it's an easy decision. People struggle with it. Some, like my wife, wanted to have the child, but knows that if she tried, she would have died. And if I had to choose between my wife and a child, I'd choose my wife every time.

It may be the "easy way out", but by no means is it "easy".
Nearly everyone agrees that abortion should be allowed if the woman's life truly is in imminent danger.

That's not what we're talking about. The overwhelming majority of abortions are done for convenience, not for saving the woman's life.
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:41 AM
 
Location: NJ
31,771 posts, read 40,672,588 times
Reputation: 24590
Quote:
Originally Posted by Langlen View Post
Just because one doesn't see it as murder doesn't mean it's an easy decision. People struggle with it. Some, like my wife, wanted to have the child, but knows that if she tried, she would have died. And if I had to choose between my wife and a child, I'd choose my wife every time.

It may be the "easy way out", but by no means is it "easy".
i dont understand what makes it a difficult decision if it isnt murder.

an instance where the woman would die if she underwent childbirth is not the norm.
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:44 AM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
8,346 posts, read 7,041,135 times
Reputation: 2874
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainNJ View Post
i dont understand what makes it a difficult decision if it isnt murder.

an instance where the woman would die if she underwent childbirth is not the norm.
Let me ask you this. Would you have a hard time putting down a pet? Or making the decision to pull the plug on a family member?

It's like that.

But it is my wife's situation. And certain pro-life fanatics (not saying you) would want to take even that away from her. That's why I hold no bias towards any situation, and why I don't have a problem with abortion.
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:47 AM
 
Location: NJ
31,771 posts, read 40,672,588 times
Reputation: 24590
Quote:
Originally Posted by Langlen View Post
Let me ask you this. Would you have a hard time putting down a pet? Or making the decision to pull the plug on a family member?

It's like that.

But it is my wife's situation. And certain pro-life fanatics (not saying you) would want to take even that away from her. That's why I hold no bias towards any situation, and why I don't have a problem with abortion.
i think an unborn child is in a much different situation than a dying pet or dying family member. that unborn child, if left unkilled, has a life ahead of it. those other situations are where the person/animal is already dying.

i wouldnt be opposed to aborted a baby if the mother is going to die. however, i understand that most situations dont have that justification and shouldnt be seen as the same.
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:50 AM
 
439 posts, read 443,286 times
Reputation: 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainNJ View Post
i dont understand what makes it a difficult decision if it isnt murder.

an instance where the woman would die if she underwent childbirth is not the norm.
yes I agree Capt NJ, it would be difficult if you wanted the baby, but had to abort to save the mother's life. A very difficult situation and not the norm.

But for others, if abortion is no more than removing a wart or mole (an unwanted blob of tissue) , then I agree why would it be difficult?

I think it's because women instinctively know that it is more than a blob of tissue.

And with increasingly sophisticated medical technology which shows us that the 'blob' of tissue has a beating heart before most women know they are pregnant, it becomes very difficult to deny that.
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:51 AM
 
Location: Virginia Beach
8,346 posts, read 7,041,135 times
Reputation: 2874
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainNJ View Post
i think an unborn child is in a much different situation than a dying pet or dying family member. that unborn child, if left unkilled, has a life ahead of it. those other situations are where the person/animal is already dying.
I'm not saying it's the same. I'm saying the emotional involvement iin the decision is.

Quote:
i wouldnt be opposed to aborted a baby if the mother is going to die. however, i understand that most situations dont have that justification and shouldnt be seen as the same.
It shouldn't be seen "on the same level", but it's still readily acceptable in my mind.

If one cannot afford to be a parent, how can they afford the pregnancy and the resulting childbirth?
 
Old 07-17-2009, 11:53 AM
 
439 posts, read 443,286 times
Reputation: 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Langlen View Post
But it is my wife's situation. And certain pro-life fanatics (not saying you) would want to take even that away from her.
I doubt that you are able to show any significant pro-life group which opposes abortion if the woman's life is truly in imminent danger.
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