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Of course "waterboarding" is torture. It's just less tortuous than most torture. It's a more gentile torture than most enemies use. I'd rather under go that, than being "beheaded, having eyes gouged out, fingernails pulled out, ect. We really are more civilized than our enemies. Waterboard me anytime!
You do understand that the US Constitution does not apply to terrorists dont you? There is a reason why Bush did not allow them to enter the country, because the minute they do, the Constitution does apply.
We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
Cuba, is not part of the union, not the people of the united states..
Guantánamo Bay, U.S. naval base, naval air station, and U.S. Marine Corps base near the eastern end of the south coast of Cuba. This 36,000-acre compound fell under American control under the terms of the Platt Amendment of 1901, by which the United States obtained the right to intervene in Cuba and to buy or lease territory for naval stations. A new treaty in 1934 eliminated the right of intervention but reasserted prior stipulations in regard to Guantánamo Bay. The Cuban Communist government of Fidel Castro later denied the validity of the treaties, but the United States retained the base. The site has an excellent deep-water land-locked harbor...(quote)
pghquest, please read the above links before continuing to assert that Guantanamo Bay is part of the sovereign nation of Cuba. Geographically it
is, but there are reasons why we have a base there...our oldest overseas
base. It should be informative that the Supreme Court upheld the writ of habeas corpus for the prisoners, and why....a SCOTUS that leans heavily to the right, I might add.
As for Mancow, he gave one more personal testimonial as to the torturous
nature of waterboarding. An experiment (maybe a dare): Stand in the shower with a washcloth over your face. Stand so that your face is directly in the flow from the showerhead. See how long you can handle it. I
tried it; I'd be curious to hear what some others who'd try it would report.
It scares me that there are Americans that must want us to get hit again....Why won't the Democrats release ALL the memos and information as it relates to what REALLY happened?? Easy, if they did, we would find out that the tactics we used, after exhausting ALL other means, led to information that saved tens of thousands of American lives......Wake up people......
The memo has been widely criticized. Yale law school Dean and former Assistant Secretary for Human Rights Harold Koh called it "perhaps the most clearly erroneous legal opinion I have ever read" which "grossly overreads the president's constitutional power."[11] Former Nixon White House counsel John Dean, whose name was cemented in the national consciousness by his involvement in the Watergate scandal, concludes that the memo is tantamount to evidence of a war crime.[11] On March 9, 2006, after emerging from a closed talk at Harvard Law School sponsored by the student chapter of the Federalist Society, a legal organization, Bybee was confronted by around thirty-five protesters.[12]
In June 2004, the memo was rescinded by Jack Goldsmith, who had taken over OLC in 2003.[10] He called the memo "deeply flawed" and "sloppily reasoned."[10] Nevertheless, Goldsmith has asserted that he "hadn't determined the underlying techniques were illegal."[13] He continues, "I wasn't in the position to make an independent ruling on the other techniques. I certainly didn't think they were unlawful, but I couldn't get an opinion that they were lawful either."[13]
Goldsmith has defended the memo's authors. "I don't impugn the integrity of anyone. I really do believe that everyone, both me and the people I disagreed with, were acting in good faith. And it's quite possible that I made mistakes as well. We were all acting under intense pressure" in the post 9/11 climate.[13] Douglas Kmiec, a law professor at Pepperdine University, has stated that ultimately the memo "caused no long-term legal damage because it was redrafted and is not legally binding."[14] Even John Dean noted that after the memo leaked, "the White House hung Judge Bybee out to dry."[11]
If the police arrested you and charged you with breaking the law (lets say murder), the first thing your defense atty is going to do is determine if they charged you with the proper statute. Likewise, if you are arrested for DUI, and you blew a 0.07, your atty is going to petition to have it thrown out because the law is 0.08. When you go to court, the prosecuter is going to have to say something a little more substantive than "in the officer's opinion, the defendant is guilty." The law is about fact.
In anyone of these fictional situations, are you going to raise your hand and state "I really should go to prison", or are you more likely to brag to your friends about what a great atty you have and how the "pigs" violated your civil rights?
You can scream torture all you want; I have yet to see anybody show with any factual basis what law has been broken. The atty general cleared it before we did it. Fact. Pelosi knew about it. Fact. You fail. Again. Fact.
Wow, you know it when you see it.. They should hire you to work at the border, I'm sure you'll know an illegal when you see one, or you should be a bartender, you'll obviously be able to tell who's legal, my golley, I should hire you to go through my sales receipts before I ship out orders because your so smart you'll be able to tell which ones are fraud before I even ship them out.. Even better, hell, can you tell me how my stocks are going to do, or if GM will go bankrupt before the next 3 weeks? You'll save my investment company a fortune..
Now, now. You know that 'you know it when you see it' isn't the case with everything. And you know I did not imply that.
Some of your posts are torture - at least the way I see them. Does that make you a lawbreaker, or is that just my OPINION?
Can you not take a breath when you read my posts? Do you want to scream out in fear, but can not because of the water filling your mouth and nose? Do you have the feeling that you are drowning and don't know if those giving you this experience will stop to let you breath again? Well then my posts are torture.
If this isn't the case, it's your opinion, which you are certainly entitled to.
Guantánamo Bay, U.S. naval base, naval air station, and U.S. Marine Corps base near the eastern end of the south coast of Cuba. This 36,000-acre compound fell under American control under the terms of the Platt Amendment of 1901, by which the United States obtained the right to intervene in Cuba and to buy or lease territory for naval stations. A new treaty in 1934 eliminated the right of intervention but reasserted prior stipulations in regard to Guantánamo Bay. The Cuban Communist government of Fidel Castro later denied the validity of the treaties, but the United States retained the base. The site has an excellent deep-water land-locked harbor...(quote)
pghquest, please read the above links before continuing to assert that Guantanamo Bay is part of the sovereign nation of Cuba. Geographically it
is, but there are reasons why we have a base there...our oldest overseas
base. It should be informative that the Supreme Court upheld the writ of habeas corpus for the prisoners, and why....a SCOTUS that leans heavily to the right, I might add.
As for Mancow, he gave one more personal testimonial as to the torturous
nature of waterboarding. An experiment (maybe a dare): Stand in the shower with a washcloth over your face. Stand so that your face is directly in the flow from the showerhead. See how long you can handle it. I
tried it; I'd be curious to hear what some others who'd try it would report.
Whats your point? That the Supreme Court has ruled that the Geneva Convention did not apply, and that individuals in captivity in Cuba are entitled to question their imprisonment in our Criminal Court system? I already stated that.. That has NOTHING to do with the US Constitution, if it did, the terrorists would be entitled to ALL RIGHTS americans receive, such as, rights not to be questioned without a lawyer, right to a speedy trial, right to confront witnesses, and they sure in the hell would be afforded the right against being waterboarded..
NONE of these apply to individuals in Cuba.. they ONLY become rights to the terrorists once they are moved from Cuba, into the american prison system..
You are wasting your breath on these guys. When its the Right, its wrong.
PS to the Left: do you remember a recent President arguing about the legal definition of "sex", "is", "are", "the", and "not" during his impeachment trial?
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