Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
No Iraq was a stupid war. Leaving Afghanistan to fester and the Taliban to resurge was stupid. We are at war with Al Qaeda and we do have to win that fight. Iraq wasn't a problem; it is now. Iran wasn't a problem; it is now. Pakistan wasn't a problem; it is now. Afghanistan was a problem; it still is.
Flag burning amendments, as pointed out by the Supreme Court's ruling on flag burning laws, is distinctly unAmerican. What is American is defending free speech.
Iran wasn't a problem? Not much I guess. After all all they do is funnel money and weapons to terrorist orgs.
Iraq wasn't a problem? Not much I guess In fact I agree with you. Not worth our time, money and blood.
Pakistan? Is always a problem. I wish we would stay out of that and let India deal with them instead.
April 26 was recognized as Confederate Memorial Day well up into the 60s. It was never a official day off as far as I recall.
Right, it was an unofficial observance day by custom and tradition, not by an act of the legislature as was the Lee, Davis birthdays and, later, Confederate Heroes Day.
Quote:
You're arguing on one hand that because Texas doesn't grant a day off from work that April 26 doesn't qualify, yet on the other hand the early observances of "Memorial Day" in the South were completely ad hock and most never formally acknowledged, unlike the first official Union event in 1868 which set the date as May 30th. I guess consistence or not arguing out of both sides of your mouth at once isn't much of a priority.
C'mon...you are coming across as a real wahoo here.....
Since your original mention of the Texas holidays (post #118) I gave a simple history of the various Confederate holidays within the state and correcting some (even common) mis-information so related. Which you can look up yourself for verification.
Also, I said above (post #138), the intent of Confederate Heroes Day and Confederate Memorial Day are the same. Where do you come by that lunacy that I said the latter "doesn't count" because it is not an official day off? Within the framework of our discussion, I was just making a distinction as to exact to terminology and official state recognition. All in all it was just a bit of trivia addressing what you brought up to begin with. (BTW -- As it is, my group does observe Confederate Memorial Day on April 26).
As to Memorial Day? Go back and look at what I said in terms of its origins...and what it became when officially recognized by the federal government and the 50 states. The intent was clearly to recognize all fallen Americans from all wars. Which is really what the whole thread topic was about. The seperate Confederate holidays are only incidental, and I made that clear too. To wit and...:
To repeat (as combined from post #119 and 130): But the fact that many of the Southern states have a seperate day to honor the Confederate dead has nothing to do with that the federal holiday now known as Memorial Day and recognized by all 50 states was officially intended to honor all the fallen American servicemen of all wars. And there is no question this has traditionally included Confederates as well.
Memorial Day thus called originally was established by local custom in the Southern states. In the Northern states, it was generally referred to as Decoration Day. Both regions honored their own, but it was not uncommon at all for each to also honor the other. Especially in the South where there were more likely to have been Union soldiers buried than vice-versa.
When what we now know as "Memorial Day" (interesting in itself that the general Southern terminology was used, don't you think?) was made an official federal holiday and adopted by all the states, it was intended to honor all the American fallen in all the wars. And it is admirable and proper.
So I am not sure exactly what your point is here. Not even sure if you are...
I'll inform the justices of the Supreme Court. They will be surprised.
Yeah I remember Kuwait, and that Iraq ceased to be a problem after that. Bush in a alcoholic or drug induced haze and forget that his father solved that problem?
Pakistan a problem because of nukes? India a problem, UK, France, etc all problems? Funny when I was invovled with nuclear weapons programs, we never considered any countries other than the Soviets or China a problem.
The Taliban resurged because we gutted our resources in Afghanistan to deal with Iraq. We even tried to subcontract the capture of OBL, when we had him cornered.
From what i remember Sudan offered osama up to Clinton but in his marijuana induced state maybe he did not understand,or maybe he did not have time because he thought adultry was more important than getting osama.France and these other nations can hardly be compared to fanatical muslim leaders who would give nukes to terrorist.I don't really care what the supreme court says about flag burning no patriot would do it.
Look up the history behind Confederate Heroes Day in Texas. Also, look at the official state almanacs prior to 1973.
Right, it was an unofficial observance day by custom and tradition, not an act of the legislature as was the Lee, Davis birthdays and later, Confederate Heroes Day.
SENATE RESOLUTION NO. 526:
WHEREAS, April is the month in which the Confederate States of America began and ended a four-year struggle for states' rights, individual freedom, and local government control; and
WHEREAS, The State of Texas declared herself to be a free and independent state and subsequently joined the Confederate States of America of which it was a member state from 1861 until 1865; and WHEREAS, The battlefields, monuments, museums, and other historical sites to be found in Texas allow our citizens and visitors to remember, study, and appreciate the men and women of that unique time in the history of Texas and the nation; and
WHEREAS, The flag of the State of Texas was carried by Texas
Confederate soldiers in every major battle of the War Between the States and the state contributed over 115,000 soldiers and sailors to the service of the Confederate States of America; and WHEREAS, During the period of reconciliation, Texas Confederate veterans became instrumental in the continued development of our state and local governments and our institutions of higher learning; and WHEREAS, We honor our past and draw from it the courage, strength, and wisdom to go forward into the future together as Texans and Americans; and WHEREAS, The State of Texas has long recognized her Confederate history and the leaders who made sacrifices on behalf of the Confederate cause; and WHEREAS, The Texans who served in the War Between the States are memorialized in almost every county in the state, and many cities and counties in the State of Texas bear the name of Confederate veterans; and
WHEREAS, It is important for all Texans to reflect upon our state's past and to respect the devotion of her Confederate leaders, soldiers, and citizens to the cause of Southern liberty; and
WHEREAS, In years since the war, the morally abhorrent practice of slavery has in the minds of many Texans become the prime motivation of Southern soldiers, despite the fact that 98 percent of Texas Confederate soldiers never owned a slave and never fought to defend slavery; and WHEREAS, Politically correct revisionists would have Texas children believe that their Confederate ancestors fought for slavery when in fact most Texans joined the Confederate armed forces to defend their homes, their families, and their proud heritage as Texans; and WHEREAS, Confederate Memorial Day in April is a time for all Texans to honor those men and women who died for Texas, and also all the Texans who came afterward and benefitted from their legacy of honor and devotion to our state; Now, therefore, be it RESOLVED, That the Senate of the State of Texas, 76th Legislature, hereby recognize
April as Confederate History and Heritage Month in the State of Texas and encourage all Texas schools and citizens to join in efforts to become more knowledgeable of the role of the Confederate States of America in the history of our country.
I hereby certify that the above Resolution was adopted by the Senate on March 30, 1999.
Jackson, President of the Senate.
What you are quoting is the Resolution passed by the Texas Senate recognizing April as Confederate History Month (as do some other Southern states).
Again though, a specifically so named Confederate Memorial Day was never an official legal holiday in Texas. As the resolution said, and I did too earlier, it was/is often recognized by state and local custom, tradition, and resolution/proclomation. On the other hand, Confederate Heroes Day (which yes, and never argued otherwise, has the same intent and purpose as a Confederate Memorial Day) is listed officially.
Anyway, see again the link I provided as to the history of CHD in Texas and the Jefferson Davis birthday connection.
LATER EDIT: In fact, I didn't even know this. That is, the Jefferson Davis Birthday holiday in Texas pre-dated Robert E. Lee's. From the New York Times of 1907:
I would like to take this opportunity to remind people of the First Confederate Monument, in Romney, Hampshire County, West Virginia, in the Indian Mound Cemetery. It was dedicated in Sept. 26, 1867. Some people believe the monument in Cheraw, SC was the first, but that monument was not inscribed until after the Romney monument. Those sneaky West Virginians waited until the last moment to inscribe "Southern Rights" on the stone when it was in place, and against Federal Law.
Then you sure need to work on your markmanship, because so far you haven't hit diddly-squat.
No, your original point was that those who served the CSA were not American troops. Here is your quote:
They were not American troops. That's who we are suppose to honor on Memorial Day.
My statement was that they were, and that Memorial Day is today one set aside to honor all American troops who served in all wars. Including Confederate.
You couldn't make your case when challenged -- nor refute any counter-points -- so you decided to steer the discussion into a ditch.
1. To say the Southern soldiers were not American troops (which you clearly did) is slanderous in the sense of being a false and malicious statement.
2. I am going by your own words. See below:
3. Again, you said: They were not American troops. That's who we are suppose to honor on Memorial Day. I was the one who -- in reply -- said they were not United States troops (although it makes no difference in this context). That is there for the record as well.
What is "succeed"? Do you mean "secede"? Regardless, I don't know how many times it has to be repeated, but you are just switching your position to suit. Anyway, who was it that claimed the Confederate soldiers served in the United States military (i.e. United States being those northern states which kept the name only by default)? Where are you plucking that from?
You said they were not American troops. If you forget so easily, then go back and read your own junk. In any event, my position (and yeah, other issues related to the WBTS will figure into it), was that Memorial Day is intended to honor all American soldiers in all wars. Including those who fought for the Confederacy.
Talk in circles all you want. In your situation, I don't blame you.
How do you not get that I am not and never was playing your game? You've been refighting the war and changing history in an empty room. I was never there. Any "discussion" about the South or the Civil War that you think was going on is the result of you reading things I never said into my posts so that you could take on another Yankee and show him/her your superior "knowledge". The chip on your shoulder in incredible. You are nothing but a pseudo-intelectual thug, wandering the threads, looking for a fight....or someone to mug.
Last edited by Sagran; 05-27-2009 at 06:59 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
