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View Poll Results: Do you approve or disapprove of homosexual marriages?
Strongly Approve 53 36.81%
Approve 24 16.67%
Somewhat Approve 2 1.39%
Mixed 3 2.08%
Somewhat Disapprove 2 1.39%
Disapprove 11 7.64%
Strongly Disapprove 43 29.86%
Don't Know/Unsure 2 1.39%
No Opinion 4 2.78%
Voters: 144. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-30-2009, 11:12 AM
 
895 posts, read 2,362,817 times
Reputation: 366

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Quote:
Originally Posted by pba View Post
The only reason to get baptized is because you feel the power of God within you and because you believe it's the right thing to do. If one person could have changed your mind then your beliefs do you not run very deep. Sounds like you'd rather ignore the darker parts of the Bible and just focus on the positive stuff. Well, I'm sorry to say, but there are plenty examples of God's punishments of people that are actually very brutal.....if you're going to accept God then you have to accept everything about it and not just the 'nice' parts.

Again, yes, I do have the right to decide how to run other people's lives as that's the basis of living in a democracy. Majority rules as long as what they are voting on falls within certain boundaries established by the higher courts. For now, I have the CA Supreme Court on my side so that's a pretty good start.

Again, we're only talking about one subject here, homosexuality. Sounds to me like you are a very weak minded person who is easily influenced by others. That's too bad because my beliefs are so solid that I'm willing to describe myself as a bigot on the subject....which is basically an unwavering belief in something and the unwillingness to have my opinion changed by others. That's what Faith is all about. The weakmindedness probably comes from your departure from God and your willingness to preach against Him so you'll bringing all of this on yourself.
Um the USA is a republic not an outright democracy. The founding fathers spoke against "majority rules" democracy which is why they invented things like the electoral college and gave power to the supreme court. If the US was majority rules blacks today would still probably not be equal to whites.

Quote:
Sounds to me like you are a very weak minded person who is easily influenced by others
Isn't that what religion is all about? You were brought up influenced by your parents/church to be a christian even though there is absolutely no reason or proof of religion. So that is a bold statement to make.
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Old 05-30-2009, 11:28 AM
pba
 
410 posts, read 915,813 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by NihonKitty View Post
Um the USA is a republic not an outright democracy. The founding fathers spoke against "majority rules" democracy which is why they invented things like the electoral college and gave power to the supreme court. If the US was majority rules blacks today would still probably not be equal to whites.



Isn't that what religion is all about? You were brought up influenced by your parents/church to be a christian even though there is absolutely no reason or proof of religion. So that is a bold statement to make.
You're saying we aren't a 'majority rules' country? I'm talking about voting where it takes one more vote than 50% (most people refer to this as a 'majority') to have your side win whatever is being voted on.

I don't need 'proof' of religeon. It's called Faith. Pure and simple Faith.
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Old 05-30-2009, 12:02 PM
 
Location: Texas
14,975 posts, read 16,428,898 times
Reputation: 4586
Quote:
Originally Posted by pba View Post
You're saying we aren't a 'majority rules' country? I'm talking about voting where it takes one more vote than 50% (most people refer to this as a 'majority') to have your side win whatever is being voted on.
We aren't a direct "majority rule" country. There are provisions in the US Constitution to prevent the majority from forcing its will on the minority.

With that said, many STATE Constitutions do provide for majority rule. Same-sex marriage bans are NOT unconstitutional under the US Constitution and that is the reason we keep having votes on same-sex marriage.
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Old 05-30-2009, 12:03 PM
 
895 posts, read 2,362,817 times
Reputation: 366
Quote:
Originally Posted by pba View Post
You're saying we aren't a 'majority rules' country? I'm talking about voting where it takes one more vote than 50% (most people refer to this as a 'majority') to have your side win whatever is being voted on.

I don't need 'proof' of religeon. It's called Faith. Pure and simple Faith.
Right and faith has no place when it comes to government and rights. There is a seperation of church and state. You can't even prove anything about your faith so why would your bring it into denying rights to other people?

And you dont know the US is against majority rules democracy?? Didnt you learn that in government class? The US republic is all about protecting minority rights against the majority. And protecting smaller state rights against the larger "majorities". If youre talking about voting for public officials than yes plurality (doesnt need to be 50%+) or majority wins. But if youre talking about voting for things like equal rights for blacks/gays etc sure the majority can vote but does that mean it will pass? The US is a republic so even if 90% voted for blacks to be seperate but equal the supreme court can overturn even though the overwhelming majority voted for it.
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Old 05-30-2009, 01:22 PM
pba
 
410 posts, read 915,813 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by afoigrokerkok View Post
We aren't a direct "majority rule" country. There are provisions in the US Constitution to prevent the majority from forcing its will on the minority.

With that said, many STATE Constitutions do provide for majority rule. Same-sex marriage bans are NOT unconstitutional under the US Constitution and that is the reason we keep having votes on same-sex marriage.
Majority rules is not hard to undertand. State Supreme Courts have odd amounts of people so when they vote it's the majority rules. The Fed Supreme Court has an odd amount of people so, again, when they vote, it's majority rules.

We can vote the lower level judges into place by majority rules. The higher level courts are appointed by those that we voted for via majority rules.

So you're argument is that is it's not specifically denied in the Constitution then it's legal and we can't vote against it? Prostitution. There's one. Kidnapping children. There's two. I could go on for quite some time. It's ridiculous to think the Constitution lists all the things you're allowed to do and if it's not listed then it should remain legal.
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Old 05-30-2009, 01:24 PM
 
Location: Texas
14,975 posts, read 16,428,898 times
Reputation: 4586
Quote:
Originally Posted by pba View Post
Majority rules is not hard to undertand. State Supreme Courts have off amounts of people so when they vote it's the majority rules. The Fed Supreme Court has an odd amount of people so, again, when they vote, it's majority rules.

We can vote the lower level judges into place by majority rules. The higher level courts are appointed by those that we voted for via majority rules.

So you're argument is that is it's not specifically denied in the Constitution then it's legal and we can't vote against it? Prostitution. There's one. Kidnapping children. There's two. I could go on for quite some time. It's ridiculous to think the Constitution lists all the things you're allowed to do and if it's not listed then it should remain legal.
Go back and reread my post. I said that state constitutions CAN, in fact, be amended to constitutionally ban same-sex marriage and that is why we keep voting on it.
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Old 05-30-2009, 01:26 PM
pba
 
410 posts, read 915,813 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by NihonKitty View Post
Right and faith has no place when it comes to government and rights. There is a seperation of church and state. You can't even prove anything about your faith so why would your bring it into denying rights to other people?

And you dont know the US is against majority rules democracy?? Didnt you learn that in government class? The US republic is all about protecting minority rights against the majority. And protecting smaller state rights against the larger "majorities". If youre talking about voting for public officials than yes plurality (doesnt need to be 50%+) or majority wins. But if youre talking about voting for things like equal rights for blacks/gays etc sure the majority can vote but does that mean it will pass? The US is a republic so even if 90% voted for blacks to be seperate but equal the supreme court can overturn even though the overwhelming majority voted for it.
Here we go with the uneducated argument of separation of church and state. Do a little research before you open your mouth. The only thing the Constitution or the Amendments say about this is where we all have the right to choose whatever religeon we want. That's it. Nowhere else does it say that there should be any 'separation of church and state'.

Do some quick Google research for yourself and you'll see what I mean.

Read my other post about majority rules. Again, do a little research before you open your mouth.
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Old 05-30-2009, 01:36 PM
pba
 
410 posts, read 915,813 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by afoigrokerkok View Post
Go back and reread my post. I said that state constitutions CAN, in fact, be amended to constitutionally ban same-sex marriage and that is why we keep voting on it.
It's when you say things like 'they are not unconstitutional' that the doublespeak gets annoying to try to follow. Double negatives should be avoided if you're trying to make a point.

If the Supreme Court votes to pass a law that the majority (again, 50% + 1 for those who still don't know what it means) still have options to get this overturned. Vote in other Presidents that will appoint judges with different viewpoints....not that it's easy because the Supreme Court has lifetime appointment which basically means they can serve as long as they would like.

You can eventually hope to bring a new case that the Supreme Court basically decides to ignore the previous decision and go with a new decision instead. It's democracy and majority rules.

The Republic you talk about is also very important. Democracy is just a higher level type of gov't while the Republic defines specific roles. The key here is that ours was built with flexibitlity to be changed from the original meaning. How does it get changed? By voting and once again, majority rules.

My stance is anti-gay marriage and I hold the majority in most states right now. That really can't be so hard for you to understand, can it?
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Old 05-30-2009, 01:39 PM
 
Location: Texas
14,975 posts, read 16,428,898 times
Reputation: 4586
Quote:
Originally Posted by pba View Post
If the Supreme Court votes to pass a law that the majority (again, 50% + 1 for those who still don't know what it means) still have options to get this overturned. Vote in other Presidents that will appoint judges with different viewpoints....not that it's easy because the Supreme Court has lifetime appointment which basically means they can serve as long as they would like.
Ever hear of the electoral college?

We don't elect Presidents by simple majority vote.
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Old 05-30-2009, 01:44 PM
pba
 
410 posts, read 915,813 times
Reputation: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by afoigrokerkok View Post
Ever hear of the electoral college?

We don't elect Presidents by simple majority vote.
Do you know people get into the electoral college? By majority vote! They are elected positions!! Elected by what? Oh yeah, a MAJORITY of the votes in their district.

Sheesh, you should really think these things through a little more before opening your mouth.
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