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Old 06-01-2009, 09:04 PM
 
Location: Maryland about 20 miles NW of DC
6,106 posts, read 5,553,507 times
Reputation: 2460

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Quote:
Originally Posted by I_Love_LI_but View Post
I hope more people come to their senses like you did. However, it may take a personal tragedy involving loss of health insurance to do so while if they had been fighting to change the system all the while, they may have missed that particular bullet. I would only say that I think the left could advocate a national plan as a choice for individuals and employers instead of wanting to dismantle the existing system entirely.

As for the welfare poor, actually I don't think they get better care and nowhere near like that of the rich because of the simple fact that many health care providers will not accept Medicaid because the reimbursements are too low. I think that 99% of dentists, for example, will not take Medicaid. So you may have "free health insurance" while on welfare, but if almost nobody wants to take your plan, what can you do?

When you have funky health insurance you get Dr. Vinny Gumbass.
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:17 PM
 
4,176 posts, read 5,884,678 times
Reputation: 1862
Quote:
Originally Posted by shorebaby View Post
I am in healthcare so you think you have a right to my labor without compensating me for it? Let me tell you the only way to control costs is to reduce spending. the only way to reduce spending is to decrease reimbursement or decrease services. If you decrease reimbursement the best people will leave healthcare. If you ration services people will scream.

By the way I would love to have UAW health care benefits and I think the majority of their members are middle class.

The solution is to give people an incentive to use health care rationally. Right now people who have insurance have no incentive to take care of themselves and the people without insurance use emergency rooms the most costly way to obtain care.
I agree with this. If Healthcare providers (not just Physicians, but hospitals, outpatient centers, etc) are squeezed, they are less likely to stay in business. It may not be possible for them to stay in business. The key to lowering costs if the Government starts a UHC system is to ration services and lower reimbursements, as mentioned. Neither one of these measures is beneficial.
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:35 PM
 
12,436 posts, read 11,137,998 times
Reputation: 3154
It sounds great to give Healthcare to everyone, but it hasn't worked in countries nowhere near the size of ours. It's probably going to be an even bigger disaster here than in the UK, Canada, etc.

I here this crap all the time. Where has it not worked? I guess there is huge demand to go to our form of healthcare in these countries...oh wait they are not. It does and has worked in other countries and contiues to work. Define not work! Lets see everyone has healthcare. Works for me.
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:40 PM
 
8,743 posts, read 10,916,605 times
Reputation: 3392
Quote:
Originally Posted by EinsteinsGhost View Post
Your forgot the Gitmo prisoners. They get it too. Its just not a thing for an average American, even if they would be willing to pay for it (just not for profit).

Calling a single payer system "socialism" is simply a political propaganda. It doesn't do Americans any justice. People are expected to pay for it via taxes, except this time they are not contributing to the profits of corporations, instead just cutting the middle men. Another plus side... we could always use fewer lobbyists that tend to control the government.
Criminals..illegals...Gitmo prisoners...

Everyone except the hard working, tax paying middle class Americans like myself.
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Old 06-01-2009, 09:42 PM
 
12,436 posts, read 11,137,998 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seamusnh View Post
I have good health care. It costs about $12,000 per year (family plan) and my employer pays 80% of the cost. I guess the 150 employees at my company are all rich as none of us are on welfare....
Who pays the 12,000? You, or does the employer pay 80% of the 12,000?
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Old 06-01-2009, 11:24 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,377 posts, read 111,738,661 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotair2 View Post
It sounds great to give Healthcare to everyone, but it hasn't worked in countries nowhere near the size of ours. It's probably going to be an even bigger disaster here than in the UK, Canada, etc.

I here this crap all the time. Where has it not worked? I guess there is huge demand to go to our form of healthcare in these countries...oh wait they are not. It does and has worked in other countries and contiues to work. Define not work! Lets see everyone has healthcare. Works for me.
Most countries with UHC have higher life-expectancies, lower infant/maternal mortiality rates, and better overall health stats than the US does. The size of the US is irrelevant.
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Old 06-02-2009, 07:40 AM
 
Location: London UK & Florida USA
7,921 posts, read 8,345,596 times
Reputation: 2053
Quote:
Originally Posted by hotair2 View Post
It sounds great to give Healthcare to everyone, but it hasn't worked in countries nowhere near the size of ours. It's probably going to be an even bigger disaster here than in the UK, Canada, etc.

I here this crap all the time. Where has it not worked? I guess there is huge demand to go to our form of healthcare in these countries...oh wait they are not. It does and has worked in other countries and contiues to work. Define not work! Lets see everyone has healthcare. Works for me.
A UHC Works and works well. Many countries now have a UHC and they managed to start them up with no problem. The USA is luckier than many of those countries in having 50 States which are far less populated than other countries who now have a UHC. I see so many really stupid objections to a UHC in America, from it will be too expensive to the American coctitution will not allow it to it will be available to gitmo prisoners. Wht can't these objectors just be honest and say they don't want a UHC. The fact that they do not understand or have ever used a UHC seems irrelevant to them.
UHC's give every Citizen and Legal Resident good quality Health Care.
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:40 AM
 
Location: Upstate Manhattan
185 posts, read 612,454 times
Reputation: 99
I know, healthcare is so expensive. I'm currently looking for a good healthcare plan, I'm looking at costs and the actual benefits. I'll hav eto pay out of pocket. I don't understand how anyone who is single for example qualifies for Medicaid. In NY state at least the maximum monthly amount for a single working individual with no kids is $700 something. Want any assistance be sure to work part-time hours and have at least 3 kids. I of course am not saying that many people/families don't need/deserve the services. It would just be nice to look out for the average hard working adult, who doesn't make minimum wage but not a lot of money.
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:43 AM
 
Location: Upstate Manhattan
185 posts, read 612,454 times
Reputation: 99
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro View Post
A UHC Works and works well. Many countries now have a UHC and they managed to start them up with no problem. The USA is luckier than many of those countries in having 50 States which are far less populated than other countries who now have a UHC. I see so many really stupid objections to a UHC in America, from it will be too expensive to the American coctitution will not allow it to it will be available to gitmo prisoners. Wht can't these objectors just be honest and say they don't want a UHC. The fact that they do not understand or have ever used a UHC seems irrelevant to them.
UHC's give every Citizen and Legal Resident good quality Health Care.
Yes, the countries with Universal health care haven't exactly gone completely to hell and all of its Citizens aren't dropping dead. Seriously something has to be done in this country for people who don't have access to healthcare coverage from their employers, and can't afford to cover themselves do to the overwhelming costs. 2,200 dollars for a 6 1/2 ER room visit anyone?
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Old 06-02-2009, 11:53 AM
 
Location: London UK & Florida USA
7,921 posts, read 8,345,596 times
Reputation: 2053
Quote:
Originally Posted by hazeleyes86 View Post
Yes, the countries with Universal health care haven't exactly gone completely to hell and all of its Citizens aren't dropping dead. Seriously something has to be done in this country for people who don't have access to healthcare coverage from their employers, and can't afford to cover themselves do to the overwhelming costs. 2,200 dollars for a 6 1/2 ER room visit anyone?
I live in the USA part of the year and to be honest if i had to just use the America health system i would be worried. Maybe Americans are used to being ripped off by Insurance companies, maybe Americans fear that by giving Health to Everyone makes them Communists, it can't be the fear of being called socialist as their are many socialist traits now sweeping America. Bailing out the big companies for example.
Why do some idiots fight so hard against a uhc system that has been proven to work in every kind of culture. I hope that now Obama has started the ball rolling that it will pick up momentum and a UHC will come to America. Some on here have crystal Balls and cry that UHC will never happen in America..i wonder if they know this weeks lottery numbers too.

You pay fortunes for a health system that is now pretty average. My cousins girlfriend was taken to hospital a few weeks back while holidaying in America. She was taken to what was supposed to be a top hospital. She said she had thought the hospital was no better than the UK hospitals and she didn't think the staff knew what they were doing. She herself is a nurse.
In the case of American healthcare you most certainly don't get what you pay for and if anyone tells you differently then they have absolutely NO knowledge of how a UHC is run.
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