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Don't give up posting the truth, maybe, just maybe. people will eventually learn to seek the truth verses listening to and accepting political propaganda without question.
Casper
Don't give up posting the truth, maybe, just maybe. people will eventually learn to seek the truth verses listening to and accepting political propaganda without question.
Casper
So you just buy into the lies of previous posters without question? Thats pathetic because the $500 billion TARP, wasnt $500 billion, it was $750 billion, of which $350 billion is tied to Obama, and the stimulus wasnt $200 billion, it was $787 billion.
Dont give up ignorance, its the best defense for liberals..
And $400 tax cuts and $8000 tax credits add what result to the deficit? I note how you didnt discuss that.
I don't know why I bother -- it's certainly won't help you any more than the large rock in my garden -- but the Make Work Pay tax credits and the enhanced $8K first-time homebuyer credits are both part of ARRA and are consequently included in the receipts and outlays projections for ARRA refered to earlier.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
Ooh so because the CBO projected were to decline by $360 billion, and they are only going to decline by $300 billion, one must wonder if that would have been $0 decline had tax cuts not taken place.. You can ignore this and just babble on about projections or you can respond to my statement without deflecting to something else.
Your original statement was no more coherent than this paragraph is, as you have once again ventured far too boldly into an area that you simply don't understand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
Of which only HALF of it was spent, the other half was saved for Obama to do what he wished to do with. Yes, Obama holds credit/blame for the other half because spending it was TOTALLY his credit/blame.
And entirely contrary to your original misbeggotten assertion, it is all FY2009 money regardless of who you choose to blame for it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
This is in ADDITION to the $787 Billion Stimulus.
Which -- it apparently must be pointed out again -- is projected to produce a deficit of about $185 billion in the current fiscal year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
Total spending IN EXCESS of federal budgets by Obama so far to date
$350,000,000,000 TARP + $787,000,000,000 stimulus = $1,137,000,000,000 + The tax cuts he passed. OBAMA AND OBAMA ALONE holds the responsibility for this spending!!!
No. All of TARP has not yet been spent and all of ARRA has not yet been spent. Things that are still unspent are not part of spending. TARP outlays and losses are also offset in part by various associated receipts and gains. You don't so much as begin to recognize those.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
There goes your fuzzy math again, pretending that the HUGE deficit from Obama is due to the $183.5 billion he is planning to spend on the war. Only in lala land can you pretend that adding the $183.5 billion war spending onto the budget justifies the TRILLIONS in additional spending.
Blah-blah-blah. The FY2009 deficit was already projected at better than $1.2 trillion when Obama took office, and his inclusion of Iraq/Afghanistan numbers is in the FY2010 budget, his first. It has zero effect on current year numbers. You're just babbling.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
proposals do not = budgets and not even worthy of discussions. But since you claim we're fortunate to have "obamas" stimulus bill passed, hows that working out for the country? Really, have you checked the latest unemployment numbers?
I agree that the Republican-proposed stimulus program was not even worth discussing. What a bunch of hapless one-trick ponies they are. Meanwhile, we are getting more food stamp, unemployment, and state budget support funding out the door every day, and every penny makes us better off than we were the day before. Unemployment as expected continues along the same spiral that has been in operation since December 2007. No one has told you to expect a magic turnaround there. It took even Bush a long time to screw things up this badly. It will take even Obama a while to fix them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
Typical left wing half truth comments in order to support the FAILURES of the current administration. Dont worry though, liberals might continue to believe that Obama holds no blame for the NEW and ADDITIONAL massive spending and deficits that HE directly caused and created.
No, whole truths that you simply don't understand and hence have absolutely no answer for. The underlying data by the way are available at www.bea.gov, but you want be much wanting to go there, as the numbers support all of my statements and none of yours.
Meanwhile, no one claims that Obama is not responsible for the programs he has put into place. The contrary is just another strawman you invent so as to have something to throw your pointless brickbats at. Obama is one among a large number of people who regret that we have to commit such significant volumes of resources to repairing the colossal mess that Bush and the rest of the right-wingers left behind. But repair it, we must, and apparently with nothing more than mindless carping from the right-wing as their contribution to that effort. What a lot of total losers...
PGH, it looks like you still fail to be able to read the budget, judging from your comments Saganista quoted.
$500 billion is budgeted for TARP
$200 billion (roughly - 180?) for the stimulus - remember, the cost of the stimulus is spread over multiple years
Transparency (wars cost, budget tricks) cost $400 billion in the budget
Add that up with the less receipts to get the expected growth in the deficit
It's not voodoo, magic or whatever you think it is.
You'll even be able to see cuts that were made, if you look at the budget (look for the minus signs)
Remember, the deficit grew by 500 billion (1.3 to @1.8), while the clueless claim that the deficit tripled.
That isn't mathematically possible.
I'll explain why.
The reported deficit last year was roughly $450 billion (1.3 trillion in reality).
Triple that - you get 1.35 trillion, an additional $900 billion.
And you would expect adding 900 billion to an existing budget of 3.1 trillion would take you to 4 trillion.
Simple math again.
Instead, the budget was for 3.6 - adding only 0.5 trillion.
Mysterious!
The deficit grew by closer to 400 trillion, as you can't (in reality) claim the wars or budget tricks as new expenses - which is many anti-obama commentators keep doing. And less tax receipts is not new spending.
The stimulus at roughly 200 billion (180?) is the biggest item by far in this budget that you could reasonably lay at Obama's feet, and the stimulus cost is less than 20% of the growth in the deficit.
I don't know why I bother -- it's certainly won't help you any more than the large rock in my garden -- but the Make Work Pay tax credits and the enhanced $8K first-time homebuyer credits are both part of ARRA and are consequently included in the receipts and outlays projections for ARRA refered to earlier..
And BOTH of them add to the deficits
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
Which -- it apparently must be pointed out again -- is projected to produce a deficit of about $185 billion in the current fiscal year
Only relevant if the deficit was = < $185 billion.. Since its not, your trying to lie and pretend that it matters.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
No. All of TARP has not yet been spent and all of ARRA has not yet been spent. Things that are still unspent are not part of spending. TARP outlays and losses are also offset in part by various associated receipts and gains. You don't so much as begin to recognize those.
The fact that it has not yet been spent again holds no relevance since the money has already been allocated. I'm sure your even smart enough to know that if you borrow money and put it in the bank, the fact that you havent spent the funds doesnt mean you dont need to pay interest on whats borrowed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
Blah-blah-blah. The FY2009 deficit was already projected at better than $1.2 trillion when Obama took office, and his inclusion of Iraq/Afghanistan numbers is in the FY2010 budget, his first. It has zero effect on current year numbers. You're just babbling.
First you claim that the war funds hold relevance for the huge deficitns, now your claiming they have "zero" effect. Admit your just making this up as you go along..
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
Meanwhile, we are getting more food stamp, unemployment, and state budget support funding out the door every day, and every penny makes us better off than we were the day before.
Ahh, see here is where you again start to get it wrong, food stamps, unemployment, state budgets are not federal liabilities. There is a reason why we have a seperate layer of government between our local and federal, justifying a federal bailout of each state is rediculous. Lets not even discuss that all of these bailouts make us worse off, not better off than the day before, the concempt would escape you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
No one has told you to expect a magic turnaround there.
translation: NO one made the claim that the stimulus bill would boost the economy, which pretty much defeats the pupose of a "stimulus" bill..
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
It took even Bush a long time to screw things up this badly. It will take even Obama a while to fix them.
More lies, Bush was doing just fine until Democrats took over Congress.. Of course you dont care about issues, everything is "Bush Bush Bush".. Will you still be blaming him next year? Probably..
Quote:
Originally Posted by saganista
Meanwhile, no one claims that Obama is not responsible for the programs he has put into place. The contrary is just another strawman you invent so as to have something to throw your pointless brickbats at. Obama is one among a large number of people who regret that we have to commit such significant volumes of resources to repairing the colossal mess that Bush and the rest of the right-wingers left behind. But repair it, we must, and apparently with nothing more than mindless carping from the right-wing as their contribution to that effort. What a lot of total losers...
No one is claiming that Obama is not responsible for his programs and the debt, but all you've done is make excuse after excuse after excuse. Dont worry, I expect nothing less..
Spending for it is spread over multiple years but funding for it has to be allowcated the year that it was approved because it reduced the ultimate borrowing capability of the government that year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by compJockey
Transparency (wars cost, budget tricks) cost $400 billion in the budget
The proposed funding for the war is $188+/- Billion, not $400 Billion, and moving this into the budget is not in question, but this does not explain the trillions in the red. $188 billion, (or even $400 billion) does not equal TRILLIONS, no matter what kind of fuzzy math you use.
I don't claim to know a lot about the actual numbers, but I will common sense this one. If I am maxed out in credit card debt, should I just keep getting more credit cards and max them out too? When I die, is my credit card debt forgiven or do my kids have to pay them back? If my neighbor had maxed out credit cards and he/she can't make the payments, should all the other neighbors in the neighborhood be responsible for paying them back for him/her?
I honestly don't get the math. So...for people who think all this spending is going to somehow "save" us, please explain in simple terms. I think like the short paragraph above. Apparently, I'm not as smart as some of the people who think this is a good idea. Thanks!
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You can ignore this and just babble on about projections or you can respond to my statement without deflecting to something else.
