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The math shows that he received $1.13 Billion over twelve years, AND gave BACK $411 Million in options = average less than $60 Million a year. Not small granted, but as I previously stated, he's a HUGE stock holder of the company, confirmed by your story..
His compensation is determined through a negotiated employment contract that includes options which are often given very long sunset clauses, so as to maximize his return. He can exercise all or part of his options in any given year. More than likely the stock in play is being held in a trust, probably outside of the US, so that when he does exercise his options he can decide whether or not to repatriate the money, or send it elsewhere to avoid any tax liability. Gotta love tax law!
He's a "HUGE" stock holder as you put it, because he was given that stock through his compensation package. And as I said earlier, the only reason he "gave back" some of his stock is because he was under federal indictment for fraud. So please don't try to make it look like he was an innocent guy just doing the right thing by giving it back. Moreover, he was allowed to keep over $800 million worth of that stock, DESPITE committing the fraud! If this is the guy that you want to hold up as a model corporate executive then I think your argument might be in trouble...
Really? Show me a link about this federal insurance that can be applied for to pay patients' bills who have no insurance.
Proof positive you dont have a fricken clue wtf your talking about. I fell several months ago, broke BOTH wrists, first question they asked me was for insurance, second question they asked was my ability to pay, third, was to get my phone number to have someone from the financial aid department call me to get me to fill out the applications for the insurance. I would never qualify but yes, it exists..
His pay was $20,000 a week, and total compensation came to $11M, for 3 weeks worth of work due to signing bonuses and his golden parachute, but are you now claiming it was his fault the company went under? Really? You think he caused the company to go bankrupt in 3 weeks
His compensation is determined through a negotiated employment contract that includes options which are often given very long sunset clauses, so as to maximize his return. He can exercise all or part of his options in any given year. More than likely the stock in play is being held in a trust, probably outside of the US, so that when he does exercise his options he can decide whether or not to repatriate the money, or send it elsewhere to avoid any tax liability. Gotta love tax law!
You dont have a fricken clue do you? The options are taxed BEFORE money can be sent to another country because the options are earned HERE..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spot
He's a "HUGE" stock holder as you put it, because he was given that stock through his compensation package. And as I said earlier, the only reason he "gave back" some of his stock is because he was under federal indictment for fraud. So please don't try to make it look like he was an innocent guy just doing the right thing by giving it back. Moreover, he was allowed to keep over $800 million worth of that stock, DESPITE committing the fraud! If this is the guy that you want to hold up as a model corporate executive then I think your argument might be in trouble...
He has a HUGE amount of stock because he did not take his stock, sell them, and then move his money to other countries, which you previously accused them of doing. It was his CHOICE to keep the stocks, thereby becoming a stock holder, or sell them, thereby collecting cash..
Options backdating was only an issue because the stock ROSE in value, jees, that must be good ha?
ooh and btw, where exactly do you think money would come from for a UHC plan? RICH PEOPLE like him!!!
His compensation is determined through a negotiated employment contract that includes options which are often given very long sunset clauses, so as to maximize his return. He can exercise all or part of his options in any given year. More than likely the stock in play is being held in a trust, probably outside of the US, so that when he does exercise his options he can decide whether or not to repatriate the money, or send it elsewhere to avoid any tax liability. Gotta love tax law!
He's a "HUGE" stock holder as you put it, because he was given that stock through his compensation package. And as I said earlier, the only reason he "gave back" some of his stock is because he was under federal indictment for fraud. So please don't try to make it look like he was an innocent guy just doing the right thing by giving it back. Moreover, he was allowed to keep over $800 million worth of that stock, DESPITE committing the fraud! If this is the guy that you want to hold up as a model corporate executive then I think your argument might be in trouble...
He was one of the founders of the consolidated entity. They earned $10 billion in profits in 2006, and you are mad because they paid him a few million. Go figure.
Okay, here's a WSJ article that clearly states he received options worth over $1 Billion in addition to his salary. Combined, it totals almost 1.6 Billion. This is an incontrovertible fact.
Of course, his compensation package only became news because he was indicted for fraudulently trying to change the dates on his options so he could earn even more. Apparently at over $1.6 BILLION this guy felt under-compensated.
Remember that these guys aren't paid "annually" in the same way you and I are. They are paid primarily through options packages as part employment contracts that allow them to practice tax avoidance techniques that would make most accountants blush. AIG executives for example created a company in Panama called the Star International Corporation to offshore their stock options in order to avoid income taxes altogether. The AIG method has actually become the industry model for compensating senior executives in case you were interested.
At AIG, the real mess is far from over - Jubak's Journal - MSN Money (http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/P113991.asp - broken link)
Isn't it ironic that at the same time these guys are begging for a taxpayer bailout they are busy dodging personal income taxes? Of course it's all legal right?... sure it is... Just tell your employer that you would like 80% of your earnings funneled into a Panamanian shell company so that you can avoid taxes. Good luck with that!
United Healthcare's earnings from 2000 - 2005 were up. Like everyone else, they were riding the Wall Street bubble. It had nothing to do with the brilliant leadership of their executives, as demonstrated by the fact that they are currently completely in the tank. In fact, what little money they are making is because of increased enrollment in medicare. It's exquisitely ironic that it appears to be the "government run health care" that is propping them up in hard times.
He was one of the founders of the consolidated entity. They earned $10 billion in profits in 2006, and you are mad because they paid him a few million. Go figure.
As one of the founders, I'd say he was entitled to every penny. Those who think he shouldnt be paid for "little bit of work" should ask Obama to give back some of the millions he received for writing a book. I mean really, write a book, get paid $2M, that sounds unfair and he should give it back.
You dont have a fricken clue do you? The options are taxed BEFORE money can be sent to another country because the options are earned HERE..
Really? That's not what I learned in law school or my masters. If you really believe that there aren't well-established mechanisms for holding the shares assigned in options outside of the US, then I am sorry, but you are mistaken. You should really learn something about this before you accuse others of being clueless.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
He has a HUGE amount of stock because he did not take his stock, sell them, and then move his money to other countries, which you previously accused them of doing. It was his CHOICE to keep the stocks, thereby becoming a stock holder, or sell them, thereby collecting cash..
Options backdating was only an issue because the stock ROSE in value, jees, that must be good ha?
Fraud is fraud. And predating/postdating options is illegal. Whether or not you make money at it is irrelevant. If the guy did nothing wrong, why do you think he gave back hundreds of millions of dollars worth of stock?
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
ooh and btw, where exactly do you think money would come from for a UHC plan? RICH PEOPLE like him!!!
Rich people like me will pay our fair share too. And that's how it's suppose to work.
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If this is the guy that you want to hold up as a model corporate executive then I think your argument might be in trouble...
