Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 07-13-2009, 12:34 PM
 
Location: SW MO
23,593 posts, read 37,462,837 times
Reputation: 29337

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl View Post
Then why were you whining?
I'm not. I'm laughing at those who didn't take care of themselves and think we should do it for them -- those and others who support that socialist ideal.

Laughing, I tell you. Laughing! See?

But I'm marginally worried that Obama make take you seriously and that's anti-American.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-13-2009, 12:35 PM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,271,474 times
Reputation: 11416
Quote:
Originally Posted by WalterK View Post
You're right, that is their personal choice. I think due to lack of convience. They do all have 100K cars and nicer homes than I, though not bigger.
Then it's all about choices.
They choose to not to live on a lake, or river and be responsible for a larger plot of land.
That's all it is, it has nothing to do with their income or what you have that is better than what they can have if they choose.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 12:36 PM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,271,474 times
Reputation: 11416
Yeah, cur, everyone who works for the military is anti-american.
I get it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 12:37 PM
 
Location: SW MO
23,593 posts, read 37,462,837 times
Reputation: 29337
Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl View Post
Then it's all about choices.
They choose to not to live on a lake, or river and be responsible for a larger plot of land.
That's all it is, it has nothing to do with their income or what you have that is better than what they can have if they choose.
Be still my heart. You might just get it after all.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 12:39 PM
 
Location: SW MO
23,593 posts, read 37,462,837 times
Reputation: 29337
Quote:
Originally Posted by chielgirl View Post
Yeah, cur, everyone who works for the military is anti-american.
I get it.
LOL! Destroy them from the inside, right!

Spent a few years working for them myself.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 12:46 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
7,085 posts, read 12,050,618 times
Reputation: 4125
I have a few friends in Europe, and it's always startling the comparisons. All the countries are different, but I think Sweden is the most pronounced about it (and the person I know there and I talk about economics a great deal).

The big differences is taxes, you pay almost 50% income taxes and "Luxury goods" require massive sales tax, some over 100%. It's a real financial disincentive to really work hard for money, including entrepreneurship. We sent him a computer and his kids game boys, with him paying us back, because the cost of all of them together and the shipping was less then 75% of just the computer there. The taxes pay a great deal for social welfare, you are never destitute there, you always have some sort of job or money coming in unless you drop out of society. Health care is always the big crux, while it's all paid by the government it's not the latest and greatest technology or drugs (most expensive chemo/hemophilia drugs aren't covered)...plus some specialties have very long waits (Neuro and Spine, what I work in, can be over 6 months).

Work is much different for him. People do get more vacations and free time, which is often counter productive to a business. I know his office shuts down for certain times because such few people are there, he talks about how a good number shut down in the month of December. It's so hard to fire people there as well you have people there till they drop that could care less if they are doing the job, let alone how well. Also for that reason, many employers are reluctant to hire more people unless they really must.

I think there is room for improvement in the US, but I think I would pick the system over any European country in relation. This is just my opinion as with anything else, but I feel my decision is well founded.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 01:00 PM
 
Location: Earth
24,620 posts, read 28,271,474 times
Reputation: 11416
Europe is a continent.
Please be clear about what country you're speaking of; this is not the way all of Europe operates.

I buy regularly electronics in Germany cheaper than I can in the states.
There's a 16% tax.
Taxes are already included in the price, so there's no sticker shock like you have in the US.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 01:00 PM
 
Location: Texas
989 posts, read 2,497,762 times
Reputation: 698
Quote:
Originally Posted by subsound View Post
I have a few friends in Europe, and it's always startling the comparisons. All the countries are different, but I think Sweden is the most pronounced about it (and the person I know there and I talk about economics a great deal).

The big differences is taxes, you pay almost 50% income taxes and "Luxury goods" require massive sales tax, some over 100%. It's a real financial disincentive to really work hard for money, including entrepreneurship. We sent him a computer and his kids game boys, with him paying us back, because the cost of all of them together and the shipping was less then 75% of just the computer there. The taxes pay a great deal for social welfare, you are never destitute there, you always have some sort of job or money coming in unless you drop out of society. Health care is always the big crux, while it's all paid by the government it's not the latest and greatest technology or drugs (most expensive chemo/hemophilia drugs aren't covered)...plus some specialties have very long waits (Neuro and Spine, what I work in, can be over 6 months).

Work is much different for him. People do get more vacations and free time, which is often counter productive to a business. I know his office shuts down for certain times because such few people are there, he talks about how a good number shut down in the month of December. It's so hard to fire people there as well you have people there till they drop that could care less if they are doing the job, let alone how well. Also for that reason, many employers are reluctant to hire more people unless they really must.

I think there is room for improvement in the US, but I think I would pick the system over any European country in relation. This is just my opinion as with anything else, but I feel my decision is well founded.
A work colleague of mine wanted to send his 1999 Honda accord to a friend in Austria as a gift. He felt bad that his friend's family with two working adults and young children had to make do with just one car, so in lieu of trading the old one in he just decided to offer to ship it over to his friend.

Well, his friend had to decline the generous gift because he could not afford the hundreds of euros of annual taxes and fees associated with having a second vehicle.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 06:55 PM
 
Location: Land of 10000 Lakes +
5,554 posts, read 6,737,720 times
Reputation: 8575
Quote:
Originally Posted by WalterK View Post
The same could have been said of the American Indians (although life was certainly not easy, they were content with their level of achievement), and that didn't turn out well. I guess it comes down to two completely different ideals.

I say, why stop progress? We should always be reaching, advancing; no matter how good life is it could be better. Even if this life style causes extreme competition, stress, and many will fail.

Others say that if you find something that works and people don't have to be stress over living life, then just live it out.

I think the latter is extremely selfish as a species, and over all losers.
I don't agree with this last statement at all. In fact, I think just the contrary. I don't think it's selfish to have a community which shares traditions as the American Indians have had and who live by their values common as long as they don't harm anyone. I think competition and capitalism can be very exploitative, causing many to lose out unnecessarily.

I don't think your view of progress is truly progress within oneself and of any spiritual value which is what really gets you through life when the going gets tough. All the things you refer to are external which makes you dependent on outside sources to be content. If you lose those, you have nothing. And in our society, it's been well proven that everyone leaves a so-called "loser" instead of coming together as a community to offer help when in need.

As far as the American Indian plight not turning out well, it was because they were victims of invaders, capitalists and individuals. Fortunately, the Danes did not have to undergo that which our Native Americans did, and they are much better off.

Last edited by Aylalou; 07-13-2009 at 07:04 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-13-2009, 07:17 PM
 
26,680 posts, read 28,659,127 times
Reputation: 7943
In most quality of life studies, the U.S. comes in below most European countries. I have no doubt that life in places like Norway and Sweden is more peaceful and comfortable than it is in the U.S. We have much less of a safety net if things go bad for us in the U.S.

Quality-of-Life Index - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The U.S. is also usually below many European countries in terms of happiness:

First Ever World Map of Happiness Produced

Yes, we have it good in this country, but we have plenty of room to do better.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:41 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top