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Old 07-17-2009, 07:56 AM
 
1,591 posts, read 3,553,113 times
Reputation: 1176

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Quote:
Originally Posted by twista6002 View Post
Say whaaa?

Ever hear of the Great Depression?
Dumb argument. We got out of that one because we were the only country with the ability to produce on a massive scale (remember, Europe's economy had been decimated by a little war known as WWII???) Russia was also busy going the wrong path at the time, not thinking as capitalists but instead as communists (the path our country may be headed on). China, India, and Brazil were largely agrarian nations and were out of the running. Now those countries have industrialized, have lower wages, and do not regulate themselves nearly as much as we do. If we are to succeed, we must compete against those countries -- we can't spend our way out of this!
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Old 07-17-2009, 09:30 AM
 
Location: The Great State of Texas, Finally!
5,476 posts, read 12,247,018 times
Reputation: 2825
Quote:
Originally Posted by twista6002 View Post
Say whaaa?

Ever hear of the Great Depression?
Keynsian economics looks good on the surface, but what you fail to realize is that the govt cannot inject money into the economy without first removing money from the economy. After all, where does the govt get the money it needs to stimulate the economy? It borrows it. Which means that any money it puts in the economy's right pocket, gets taken out from the economy's left pocket. Keynsian economics doesn't boost income. It redistributes it. Herbert Hoover did the whole tax the upper crust, increase govt spending, expand govt intervention in private companies, and in 4 years, he increased the debt by about 4%. In 1929 there was a positive GDP; in 1932 at the end of Hoover's term, negative GDP. Growth went down, unemployment went up. Roosevelt followed the same approach: increased the top tax rate to 79%, Govt spending increased to 106% between 1933 and 1940, unemployment was at 17.2% and overall output did not get back to the 1929 levels until WWII. Keynsian economics did NOT get us out of the Great Depression. WWII did because we we producing tangibles and manufacturing, plus many who were unemployed were drafted into the war.

Keynsian economics were also attempted by Japan, a country which experienced the "lost decade" because of this. The only thing that went up with Japan's "stimulus" was it's debt, which even surpassed Italy's.

We have history as our guide. Revisionist history only makes people feel good but it isn't rooted in facts.

Have a nice day.
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Old 07-17-2009, 09:34 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,972 posts, read 22,157,422 times
Reputation: 13803
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gottasay View Post
Dumb argument. We got out of that one because we were the only country with the ability to produce on a massive scale (remember, Europe's economy had been decimated by a little war known as WWII???) Russia was also busy going the wrong path at the time, not thinking as capitalists but instead as communists (the path our country may be headed on). China, India, and Brazil were largely agrarian nations and were out of the running. Now those countries have industrialized, have lower wages, and do not regulate themselves nearly as much as we do. If we are to succeed, we must compete against those countries -- we can't spend our way out of this!
When you are the only game in town, because the manufacturing capacity of the rest of the world was destroyed in WWII, its a no brainer that we prospered, government spending had diddly to do with it.
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Old 07-17-2009, 09:36 AM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,531 posts, read 24,701,378 times
Reputation: 9980
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunny-Days90 View Post
Joe Biden is dumb as dirt.

And his personal financial life is also a mess, so how can someone with his financial problems know what is right or wrong.

Liberals are economy killing machines. They think they can buy us out of the hole they dug us into.

Hey liberals, its called jobs, people have to have money to spend and so far Obama and the Looney Tunes congress are in the hole on jobs.

Tax and Spend Left Wing Loons are destroying this country with their foolish ways.

Joe Biden, what a total fool he is. And I thought Obama was an embarrassment to all other who have been President before him, Stupid Joe takes the cake as far as VP's go for sure.

Joe back in the secret bunker Joe and hide.
Apparently you are in the top 1%
If you mean by his personal finances that he hasn't taken billions in kickbacks like most of the congress, I guess your right. He lives on his salary and his wifes, I guess a good NeoCon would call that stupid. So if you go to the Home Depot on Kirkwood Highway and find yourself standing in line next to him, tell him that.
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Old 07-17-2009, 09:37 AM
 
5,165 posts, read 6,053,665 times
Reputation: 1072
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
When you are the only game in town, because the manufacturing capacity of the rest of the world was destroyed in WWII, its a no brainer that we prospered, government spending had diddly to do with it.
Oh please, that is no answer. Europe could have very easily competed with US after WWII

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Old 07-17-2009, 09:39 AM
 
5,165 posts, read 6,053,665 times
Reputation: 1072
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
When you are the only game in town, because the manufacturing capacity of the rest of the world was destroyed in WWII, its a no brainer that we prospered, government spending had diddly to do with it.
Gosh, Japan must have provided incredible competition for the U.S. after WWII:

http://timesonline.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2009/03/25/nagasaki_afterbomb.jpg (broken link)
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Old 07-17-2009, 09:54 AM
 
873 posts, read 1,804,693 times
Reputation: 480
Drink more liquor so you won't become an alcoholic!
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Old 07-17-2009, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Chicagoland
41,325 posts, read 44,950,814 times
Reputation: 7118
Quote:
Keynsian economics looks good on the surface, but what you fail to realize is that the govt cannot inject money into the economy without first removing money from the economy. After all, where does the govt get the money it needs to stimulate the economy? It borrows it. Which means that any money it puts in the economy's right pocket, gets taken out from the economy's left pocket. Keynsian economics doesn't boost income. It redistributes it. Herbert Hoover did the whole tax the upper crust, increase govt spending, expand govt intervention in private companies, and in 4 years, he increased the debt by about 4%. In 1929 there was a positive GDP; in 1932 at the end of Hoover's term, negative GDP. Growth went down, unemployment went up. Roosevelt followed the same approach: increased the top tax rate to 79%, Govt spending increased to 106% between 1933 and 1940, unemployment was at 17.2% and overall output did not get back to the 1929 levels until WWII. Keynsian economics did NOT get us out of the Great Depression. WWII did because we we producing tangibles and manufacturing, plus many who were unemployed were drafted into the war.

Keynsian economics were also attempted by Japan, a country which experienced the "lost decade" because of this. The only thing that went up with Japan's "stimulus" was it's debt, which even surpassed Italy's.

We have history as our guide. Revisionist history only makes people feel good but it isn't rooted in facts.

Have a nice day.
Excellent post, but I'm afraid it will sail right over his head.
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Old 07-17-2009, 11:35 AM
 
Location: Highland, CA (formerly Newark, NJ)
6,183 posts, read 6,076,346 times
Reputation: 2150
Quote:
Originally Posted by coastalrap View Post
The money was already in the pockets of the people. Who do you think grows the economy, creates wealth and jobs? Clue, it's not the government.

What you are saying is that the people are not smart enough to spend their money the right way and we need the government to take our money and do it for us.
The thing is, the number of Americans with money in their pockets had steadily been declining. And what I'm saying is the few people that still had money weren't going to spend money in an economy that was moving closer to failure.
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Old 07-17-2009, 11:36 AM
 
Location: Highland, CA (formerly Newark, NJ)
6,183 posts, read 6,076,346 times
Reputation: 2150
Quote:
Originally Posted by 60Clowns View Post
Yeah, I have to agree. Further proof of the media's all-out bias is their serious treatment of Biden. Never has there been a politician so ripe for ridicule that this pompous bloviating self-important plagiarizing rug-wearing gaffe machine.
Does the name George W. Bush ring a bell to you?
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