Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Well, that's enough time for all the blather to go by, and it has: some good, much bad, andd a few like geeoro who announce they will recite FACTS and then fabricate announcements from thin air like "the guy refused to stop drinking" and use such falsehoods as an excuse to let him die.
So, we get to the nub of the matter:
How many out there, would like the Government to have the exclusive power to decide who gets lifesaving treatments, and who does not?
If this guy has lots of private hospitals and donation foundations to go to for a transplant, then he has lots off chances to live, depending on any of dozens (or hundreds) of people each making a decision.
But if he has to depend on Government as certain people of the southpaw persuasion would prefer, then he has ONE (count them, ONE) chance to get his transplant. And the decision will be made by some government bureaucrat, who as likely as not will bear a strong resemblence to geeoro with his tendence to fabricate false stories and use them as excuses to let the guy die, just to further his own agenda.
So, let's have a show of hands. How many here would like private doctors and donation centers making decisions on whether to give this guy the transplant he needs to save his life?
And how many would like to leave the decision in the hands of leftists like geeoro and his ilk, with no appeal, no second chance, and no other hope?
------------------------------------------
P.S. SouthCity09, I'll PM you an address when you can send me that $20.
Last edited by Little-Acorn; 07-20-2009 at 10:39 PM..
Of course they are. Hence that I not only mentioned that liver transplants are very hard to come by in my previous post, but I also cited evidence showing that the UK has a much better health care system than we do and that the poster shouldn't be looking for UHC horror stories to scare people away from something that we desperately need in the US: health care reform.
We badly need reform here, that's for sure. Our free market / for profit system has failed, badly...now we need to try something else, before the problem escalates any further. Other countries manage to cover 100% of their citizens for a fraction of the cost. While their hospitals may not look like five star hotels, they generally get the job done, despite the waiting lists for certain procedures, blown way out of proportion by those who wish to propagate fear, to prevent any change from happening.
Well, that's enough time for all the blather to go by, and it has: some good, much bad, andd a few like geeoro who announce they will recite FACTS and then fabricate announcements from thin air like "the guy refused to stop drinking" and use such falsehoods as an excuse to let him die.
So, we get to the nub of the matter:
How many out there, would like the Government to have the exclusive power to decide who gets lifesaving treatments, and who does not?
If this guy has lots of private hospitals and donation foundations to go to for a transplant, then he has lots off chances to live, depending on any of dozens (or hundreds) of people each making a decision.
But if he has to depend on Government as certain people of the southpaw persuasion would prefer, then he has ONE (count them, ONE) chance to get his transplant. And the decision will be made by some government bureaucrat, who as likely as not will bear a strong resemblence to geeoro with his tendence to fabricate false stories and use them as excuses to let him die.
So, let's have a show of hands. How many here would like private doctors and donation centers making decisions on whether to give this guy the transplant he needs to save his life?
And how many would like to leave the decision in the hands of leftists like geeoro and his ilk, with no appeal, no second chance, and no other hope?
------------------------------------------
P.S. SouthCity09, I'll PM you an address when you can send me your $20.
I bolded the part of your post that clearly indicates that you have no clue as to how UHC works in other countries, i.e. you do not deal with bureaucrats, you deal with doctors, just like here.
I agree with you that NO healthcare system is perfect. Unfortunately Livers cannot be ordered in like a spare part for a car and tough decissions have to be made as to who will be given a transplant.
This is pretty much what I said in the second sentance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
Gary was begged to give up drinking by his family for many years, he just ignored them. If he had shown a real commitment to stopping drinking, he would probably have gotten the Liver.
I don't doubt that if he really showed a commitment to stop drinking that he would have got the liver. However, I still think that if there was a liver available, he should have gotten it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
Too many on here read sensational stories like this and the new crop of stories about Canadians hating their UHC and believe them.
I think that they are just trying to use UHC horror stories to scare us out of the health care reform that we desperately need in the US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by geeoro
There is a huge difference between waiting to have a operation and not even having the chance of getting a operation as is the case for millions of Americans.
I completely understand this which is why I support single-payer health care.
I bolded the part of your post that clearly indicates that you have no clue as to how UHC works in other countries, i.e. you do not deal with bureaucrats, you deal with doctors, just like here.
Well, that's enough time for all the blather to go by, and it has: some good, much bad, andd a few like geeoro who announce they will recite FACTS and then fabricate announcements from thin air like "the guy refused to stop drinking" and use such falsehoods as an excuse to let him die. Give me a break...Falsehoods? If what i say from my own personal experience upsets your view of a UHC that you have obviously got from biased news reporting...... Too bad,..... so sad! BTW..exactly what do YOU know about Gary? He lives a few miles from me and i knew of this story long before it hit the press. He has openly said he cannot give up drinking..... Hey a scoop for you.
So, we get to the nub of the matter:
How many out there, would like the Government to have the exclusive power to decide who gets lifesaving treatments, and who does not? I have used a UHC all my life and guess what??????? The Govt doesn't decide on your health care but the Doctors do. It is in the USA that your Doctor is told by third parties ( insurance companies) what health care you can or can't have
If this guy has lots of private hospitals and donation foundations to go to for a transplant, then he has lots off chances to live, depending on any of dozens (or hundreds) of people each making a decision. With a UHC you have the full national resources of the HUGE national health service plus you can use private health companies if you so wish. This multiplies your chances of a donor way beyond your options.
But if he has to depend on Government as certain people of the southpaw persuasion would prefer, then he has ONE (count them, ONE) chance to get his transplant. And the decision will be made by some government bureaucrat, who as likely as not will bear a strong resemblence to geeoro with his tendence to fabricate false stories and use them as excuses to let him die. Read above. Now show me where my stories are falsehoods. If you are going to make accusations...back them up or "get off the pot"
So, let's have a show of hands. How many here would like private doctors and donation centers making decisions on whether to give this guy the transplant he needs to save his life? Did you forget the hands up for the HUGE resources of the UHC and the HUGE donor banks that they would set up?
And how many would like to leave the decision in the hands of leftists like geeoro and his ilk, with no appeal, no second chance, and no other hope? Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha...damn you are funny. Because i have used a UHC and have the experience and knowledge of how a UHC works, unlike yourself, doesn't make me a leftist..ooops i forgot that people of your "ilk" always have to use the political claptrap to try to prove a point. Nice try but NOOOO Banana. Your post has cheered me up no end.. You ever thought of writing for comedy shows...Hillarious.
------------------------------------------
P.S. SouthCity09, I'll PM you an address when you can send me your $20.
Lmao.... When you understand a UHC then get back to me.
Are you going to answer this, or are you going to continue to waste time and dodge the issue?
"So you think this poor man would have somehow been miraculously "saved" here in the United States? "
The insurance companies are queing up to give transplants to people who will cost them a fortune in treatments for complications due to drinking and not taking anti rejection drugs or even looking after themselves properly...NO way.
Are you going to answer this, or are you going to continue to waste time and dodge the issue?
"So you think this poor man would have somehow been miraculously "saved" here in the United States? "
Yikes you are dense. What difference does it make. Isn't the purpose of UHC to improve the system? Your question is designed to say our system is no better than theirs. Maybe not. But why in Gods name would we trade one system with it's set of problems for a system with the same set of problems.
And for the record 70% of Americans disagree with you. Check out the Gallup poll I linked all over this thread.
"One reason this inconsistency may exist is that Americans are quite happy with their health plans. Eighty-three percent of Americans rate the quality of healthcare they receive as excellent or good, while only 15% say theirs is poor. Slightly less, 70%, say their healthcare coverage is excellent or good. These ratings have been fairly stable in the seven years in which Gallup's Healthcare survey has been conducted."
And people look around, and find that there are no longer any alternatives, because private practitioners have been unable to compete with tax-money-subsidized "Universal Health Care" that penalizes people for going outside the system, and have gone out of business?
The headline is wrong. It should have read "Man Commits Suicide By Drinking Himself to Death; Liver Transplant Would Not Have Mattered"
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
