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When I see the recalcitrance of so many people on here and their absolute inability to accept basic facts (temps are rising, oceans are rising, glaciers are melting), I seriously worry about our species ability to survive. Easter Island all over again. The flat-earthers will be the doom of us, our children, and our grandchildren.
If there wasn't a history of so many on the right to ignore the environment maybe people like yourself would have a little more credibility. But for years conservatives fought against the Clean Air Act, the Clean Water Act, CERCLA, NEPA, Endangered Species Act. They denied there was a problem with acid rain. They closed their eyes to hole in the ozone layer. They argued that all the pollution from automobiles wasn't a problem.
And why? Because they were hardheaded selfish people who didn't want to open their eyes to see that our actions have a detrimental effect on the earth's environment. Instead, they passed it off on natural processes or cycles. Some of them claimed that it wasn't a problem at all and everything was a ruse, part of some large political conspiracy.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
If there wasn't a history of so many on the right to ignore the environment maybe people like yourself would have a little more credibility. But for years conservatives fought against the Clean Air Act, the Clean Water Act, CERCLA, NEPA, Endangered Species Act. They denied there was a problem with acid rain. They closed their eyes to hole in the ozone layer. They argued that all the pollution from automobiles wasn't a problem.
And why? Because they were hardheaded selfish people who didn't want to open their eyes to see that our actions have a detrimental effect on the earth's environment. Instead, they passed it off on natural processes or cycles. Some of them claimed that it wasn't a problem at all and everything was a ruse, part of some large political conspiracy.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
I really don't get this. I know I've been kinda 'cuttin' up' here in my last few posts, but seriously, if we know evolution is right and we know that things inprove over time...then isn't messing with the natural process more dangerous than the threat of global warming? What if that endangered species we protect is a predator that could eliminate the next transitional species that we need to make it up on the next rung of the evolutionary ladder.
Do you guys believe what you believe, or don't you??
Seriously, I know that sounds ludicrous (sp?), but I wonder how you deal with those issues. I've kinda squeezed them down into the condensed version...but you get the jest of it, I'm sure. Well....most of you do...hehehe
EDIT: Please understand I'm not suggesting that the earth isn't worth preserving, Im involved in more than one aspect of that, but I really sruggle understanding how the 'other side' deals with possibility that the evolutionary process probably (since there's no intellignece needed for it) doesn't need us messing with it.
If there wasn't a history of so many on the right to ignore the environment maybe people like yourself would have a little more credibility. But for years conservatives fought against the Clean Air Act, the Clean Water Act, CERCLA, NEPA, Endangered Species Act. They denied there was a problem with acid rain. They closed their eyes to hole in the ozone layer. They argued that all the pollution from automobiles wasn't a problem.
And why? Because they were hardheaded selfish people who didn't want to open their eyes to see that our actions have a detrimental effect on the earth's environment. Instead, they passed it off on natural processes or cycles. Some of them claimed that it wasn't a problem at all and everything was a ruse, part of some large political conspiracy.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
No irwin the real reason we denied alot of these things are problems is because they arent! We understand that the environmental movement is the new home for socialists and there fore you need these things to be true so that you can implement your big government solutions!
No irwin the real reason we denied alot of these things are problems is because they arent! We understand that the environmental movement is the new home for socialists and there fore you need these things to be true so that you can implement your big government solutions!
that just destroyed any credibility you might have had...
I really don't get this. I know I've been kinda 'cuttin' up' here in my last few posts, but seriously, if we know evolution is right and we know that things inprove over time...then isn't messing with the natural process more dangerous than the threat of global warming? What if that endangered species we protect is a predator that could eliminate the next transitional species that we need to make it up on the next rung of the evolutionary ladder.
Do you guys believe what you believe, or don't you??
Seriously, I know that sounds ludicrous (sp?), but I wonder how you deal with those issues. I've kinda squeezed them down into the condensed version...but you get the jest of it, I'm sure. Well....most of you do...hehehe
EDIT: Please understand I'm not suggesting that the earth isn't worth preserving, Im involved in more than one aspect of that, but I really sruggle understanding how the 'other side' deals with possibility that the evolutionary process probably (since there's no intellignece needed for it) doesn't need us messing with it.
Well first off evolution doesn't make animals "better" evolution involves adaptations that allow an animal to be more successful in a particular environment. If the entire earth became a desert, cactus-like plants would thrive while trees like maples and pines would probably die out. Doesn't make cactus a "better" plant.
Two, we are protecting endangered animals that are such because of our actions. Wolves are endangered and protected not because they couldn't adapt to their natural environment but because we almost killed them off by over hunting! The bison didn't almost die out because they couldn't adapt, they almost died out because we shot them almost to extinction! The bald eagle, our national symbol, almost disappeared because we poisoned them with DDT. Laws to prevent these very unnatural effects on animals is a good thing. This is also how we should think of global warming.
Finally, our actions and changes to the environment does not negatively effect all animals. Some animals thrive in our artificial world we have created. The problem is, many of them also have negative implications for the health of the human environment. Rats, wild dogs, roaches, coyotes, mosquitoes, etc do very well in human environments. The problem is that many more animals are not able to adapt to such drastic alterations in the environment. So, we are seeing a reductions in the diversity of life on earth. Global warming is only going to increase that threat.
No irwin the real reason we denied alot of these things are problems is because they arent! We understand that the environmental movement is the new home for socialists and there fore you need these things to be true so that you can implement your big government solutions!
Lake Erie was polluted. Automobiles do ruin our air (look at LA). Many species are becoming extinct. Acid rain is a problem. The ozone layer was deteriorating. And yes, global warming is happening.
These are REAL problems. If you weren't listening to Rush all the time maybe you would realize this.
that just destroyed any credibility you might have had...
Well, we know I had none with your crowd, look if you dont understand my statement then you are not putting yourself in a very intelligent position , just keep on believing, Algore is countin on ya!
Lake Erie was polluted. Automobiles do ruin our air (look at LA). Many species are becoming extinct. Acid rain is a problem. The ozone layer was deteriorating. And yes, global warming is happening.
These are REAL problems. If you weren't listening to Rush all the time maybe you would realize this.
What does listening to Rush have to do with anything, I love 2112!
Well, we know I had none with your crowd, look if you dont understand my statement then you are not putting yourself in a very intelligent position
I would have said that it was this statement...
No irwin the real reason we denied alot of these things are problems is because they arent! We understand that the environmental movement is the new home for socialists and there fore you need these things to be true so that you can implement your big government solutions!
...that put someone in a not very intelligent position. Denial of fact, political unsophistication, and a conspiracy theory all in one???
Quote:
Originally Posted by silas777
just keep on believing, Algore is countin on ya!
Do things become untrue because Al Gore says them? If so, see above. If not, maybe you'd want to roll out a little more from your arsenal?
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