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Old 08-12-2009, 11:42 AM
 
13,631 posts, read 20,722,659 times
Reputation: 7640

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Quote:
Originally Posted by city414 View Post
stop asking stupid questions:Civil libertarians claim that Free Speech Zones are used as a form of censorship and public relations management to conceal the existence of popular opposition from the mass public and elected officials
Apparently you have no answer. I suggest you refrain from mindless hyperbole.
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Old 08-12-2009, 11:45 AM
 
Location: NorthTexas
634 posts, read 1,556,160 times
Reputation: 327
Guns and violence do not solve problems, it creates them. I believe in self defense but the military cannot solve political problems, neither can civilians out shooting each other change the problems of our society.

Keep talking, keep an open mind and accept that you will NEVER get everything you want. Also accept the FACT that there are other solutions besides violence.
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Old 08-12-2009, 11:45 AM
 
Location: NY
2,011 posts, read 3,871,777 times
Reputation: 918
And the surprise is? With a racist socialist in the White House what do you expect? So far America is a Republic but with this horror in charge, it will be The Peoples Republik of Amerika when he's done.
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Old 08-12-2009, 11:50 AM
 
Location: New Jersey
1,878 posts, read 2,061,149 times
Reputation: 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by dorock99 View Post
Have you ever read a post from me RobertGibbs???

I'm a small government person, but i will not fight along side racist and stupid ignorant individuals.

My point is that you'll find many people, that will be in my same position.

Actually i'd beat most small government people with high level educations are not going to be fighting at all.

For me to actually go out and shoot someone this situation would have to get much much much worse and be bordering on the destruction of the US. Both of which i highly doubt will happen. The birther types would have to start killing a lot of innocent American citizens before i would feel obligated to get involved.

I'll re-state what i just said i would not fight along side a birther no matter what they believe. They have no morals or true values in my opinion and are the worst breed of individuals we have in this country. (Note they are not alone in my opinion, but they are the focus for this segment)

However, if you're a small government type of libertarian you're naturally inclined to peaceful demonstration when you are outraged at government. The educated small government people would obey the law and follow through on the right to "peaceful" protest. I'm not going to engage in violence, because someone does not agree with my view.

As far as government is concerned, if you someone believe that unseating this administration is going to magically change what goes on in Washington over night you're sorely mistaken.

Any talk of revolution at such a critical point would be stupid. It is economic suicide and would put this country back in the third world.

What state do you live in btw?

What steps need to be taken is to challenge the federal government on States rights issues etc. More power needs to go back to the states. If i were starting the "revolution" that would be my first goal.

Taking things over by force?? Seriously dude this isn't the 18th century. Massive uprising can be quickly ended. I like the attitude of government should fear their citizens, but with the technology,t hat governments and have and the control they have an uprising in America could lead other countries to have uprising and I'm pretty sure world wide governments will put those to rest very quickly with as much force as necessary.

The "Patriot Act" laid the foundation to a police state. You should have been yelling about that before it was ever allowed to get through congress. I pointed this out to many of my friends, but they were scared of the Meany terrorist, they may bomb us again blah blah bs....If they took the time to read the document we suffer from our foreign policy and we experience blow back, so if we changed our foreign policy, guess what probably would not have happened. However, they exploited the 9/11 attacks to slip us into a police state, should individuals like yourself ever decide to get rowdy. Trust me my friend if you decide that you are going to take this country over by force the outcome for you will not be pretty.

I agree it should never be this way, but then we should just get rid of government? I mean what's next? What system do you propose we now move to in America for governing such a large diverse group of individuals?
First of all, I have to say I agree with alot of what you said, but I didn't say anything where violence is the only option. It very well might come to that because anything is possible. The premise of all of this is that America is not immune to things that go on in other countries. Civil unrest could very well get out of control as our way of life get's lower and lower due to government control and suppression. Everything you see going on in Washington right now, is a precursor and a "foot in the door" for that type of control and suppression. The American people will not accept that. There is a silent majority out there that is starting to wake up, and you along with everyone else in this country will hear them loud and clear soon. Governing a large group of diverse individuals has nothing to do with what type of system is in place. We have a democratic capitalist system, we should keep that system. Tweak what needs to be tweaked, but follow the Constitution.
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Old 08-12-2009, 11:51 AM
 
Location: New Jersey
1,878 posts, read 2,061,149 times
Reputation: 326
Quote:
Originally Posted by city414 View Post
stop asking stupid questions:Civil libertarians claim that Free Speech Zones are used as a form of censorship and public relations management to conceal the existence of popular opposition from the mass public and elected officials
I've never heard of any of that. I think you're maijng things up to be bigger than they really are here.
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Old 08-12-2009, 12:11 PM
 
Location: Jonquil City (aka Smyrna) Georgia- by Atlanta
16,259 posts, read 24,713,689 times
Reputation: 3587
Quote:
Originally Posted by ViewFromThePeak View Post
It's not the right wing kooks the government should be worried about. It's the hoardes of people who'd enlist hearing about their cousin, sister/bother, parents, or kids die at the hands of the government.

Just like how Bush helped to radicalize moderate muslims by bombing civilians, Obama can do the same to moderate Americans by doing as you suggest. Just wayyyyyyy too many of us to stop.
"moderate" muslims??? The words do not even go together. Bush did not radicalize anybody. They were already radical religous nutcases- sorta like some of the ones over here. They think they have the right to use guns to enforce their view of God on everybody else- sorta like the ones over here!
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Old 08-12-2009, 12:15 PM
 
Location: Georgia
201 posts, read 239,573 times
Reputation: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevK View Post
This country is a democracy. You lost the last election. We won. If you wish to deal with it, you can try to win elections in 2010 and 2012. But for now winners=keepers and losers=weepers. You can try to convince the American voters to put you back in power again. Good luck with that. But for now we are running the show and we are going to do what we want to do just like Bush did when you ran the show.
You bawl and cry at being "demonized" not recalling how YOU people treated US over the WAR? I guess you forgot the assualts and threats to the lives of people who dared oppose you stupid war in Iraq? So do us a favour and go run over some Dixie Chicks records or something!

I lost? I was not running for office so how did i lose? I did not vote for mcamnesty either so yeah i did not lose son. Again as usual you did not answer my question. I bet people who were against bush you were all for them huh? Now the shoe is on the other foot and you dont like it. Well tough. Moderator cut: Inappropriate Content
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Old 08-12-2009, 12:16 PM
 
1,043 posts, read 1,289,836 times
Reputation: 296
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobertGibbs View Post
First of all, I have to say I agree with alot of what you said, but I didn't say anything where violence is the only option. It very well might come to that because anything is possible. The premise of all of this is that America is not immune to things that go on in other countries. Civil unrest could very well get out of control as our way of life get's lower and lower due to government control and suppression. Everything you see going on in Washington right now, is a precursor and a "foot in the door" for that type of control and suppression. The American people will not accept that. There is a silent majority out there that is starting to wake up, and you along with everyone else in this country will hear them loud and clear soon. Governing a large group of diverse individuals has nothing to do with what type of system is in place. We have a democratic capitalist system, we should keep that system. Tweak what needs to be tweaked, but follow the Constitution.

RobertGibbs, nothing has changed in Washington, that's my point. The only thing that changed was our access to information and our ability to actually hold the people who claim to serve us accountable. The free flowing access to information is what changed.

Nothing has ever changed in Washington since the founding of this country and it became the capital city.

Our Founding Fathers were rich propertied men, that created laws as a powerful wealthy minority, because they felt they were doing the right thing for the majority.

What is different? What has changed?

I may not agree with President Obama's goal to nationalize healthcare, but i do believe his intentions and the intentions of most congress people are good and in most cases very sincere. However, i disagree with the expansion of government, so i don't disagree with his good intentions, i just disagree with who should be responsible for carrying out the good intentions. I do not like being forced or coiecred into doing something, that i do not like or may not agree with, but for the past 80 years we've all made a number of sacrifices for the good of others.

Social Security 1937

Civil Rights 1965

Medicare 1966

Nationalized Health care 2009?

I do not agree with how the responsibility for doing good is forced upon other people. Yes, it is right and just to provide for older individuals in their later years who cannot afford to provide for themselves. However, instead of waiting for their older years let's try our best to educate them in their younger years and provide incentives for them to save for a rainy day. Let's not burden others in the general population for the few, that do not save for a rainy day. They were informed and knowledgeable of the consequences.

Anyway, i digress point of the matter is nothing has changed. It has never been about the people for the people by the people. Politicians have been running the same game since the constitution was created. You can look throughout history and the same tactic is used to control the masses.

DIVIDE AND CONQUER!

What governments are experiencing now is this time tested theory is not working, because people are breaking down race, gender, ethnic, and other barriers, and starting to see themselves as not so different from the people they disagree with. The puppet masters in Washington and around the World are getting worried. The access to information has made all of this possible. An educated populist is a dangerous populist to those in charge.

Reminds me of dividing and conquering my younger siblings when i had to babysit them. The smarter they got and the more they aligned themselves with each other the harder it was for me to control them.

This is a big fear by any and all government or those in power. If we cannot divide and conquer how will we control the masses?????

If they are starting to loose faith in religion and all these other fear based creations to control them what is next?

We will see our access to information disappear in America, but we will always have the rights in the constitution, but without the access to the information, it is going to be much harder to hold these politicians feet to flames. It was hell of a lot easier to be President in the 1800's and 1900's. The general populist was stupid and in most cases extremely stupid, because they severely lacked access to information.

My generation isn't that stupid and we keep getting smarter and smarter. Just look at what buffoons the conservative are making elderly individuals out to be? I mean it is crazy. They are a good example of what happens when a large population is left with inferior education or no education at all. The same old fear tactic tricks are working on these individuals, it is sad to watch (funny at times, but mostly sad). They're being used, they're pawns, and they don't even realize it. However, that's not to say to some extent the other side would use them as well, it is really sad. The same old tricks are not going to work forever. I think if you really wanted a revolution get rid of the support for either the democrats or the republicans. Drop you party affiliation and stand strong on only the issues that concern you. Become a voter that only votes on the issues and not some dumb$$s party platform.
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Old 08-12-2009, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Georgia
201 posts, read 239,573 times
Reputation: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by ViewFromThePeak View Post
Suuuuuure the government is not powerless.

You're forgetting about China going cold turkey on funding a counter-revolution as well as the hundreds of thousands of patriots who'd frag their commanding officers and join the civilians along with their stolen equipment. Oh, and the numbers of revolutionaries that would explode exponentially should the government decide to do such a foolish act. We outnumber them.

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Old 08-12-2009, 12:20 PM
 
Location: Georgia
201 posts, read 239,573 times
Reputation: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by KevK View Post
Only the wildest dreams of David Koresh, Randy Weaver, Tim McVeigh and Eric Rudolph. All but one of them now DEAD and the 1 left breathing probably wishes he was dead being locked in a cell 23 hours a day unable to see sunlight!

Jeez, wrong again. Randy Weaver and Eric Rudolph are still both alive. Try doing some research first.
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