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And you've polled everybody? I have not been asked. Besides, do you condone the idea of selling lies and misinformation and get a referendum before the truth comes out?
And have you been asked? Do you agree with every move your congresscritter approves of? If not, do you do anything about it? Or do you just close your eyes and hope?
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How about proposing a debate at a national level instead, televised for all to see. The opponents get to bring every single element from the bill to the table, and discuss with the proponents, sort of like presidential debates but no "skipping" or allowance for circumventing the question via distraction. To the point, discussing every point in the bill. But that would make too much sense, won't it?
I would approve such a system, with the provision that the parties actually do answer the questions, not try to divert attention to one of their own talking points. This applies to both sides.
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When you elect people to office, you elect them on the basis of their platform, hoping that they will do just what you voted for. These people may lean towards their party leadership but then, they do so because they share their principles, as do the people who formed a majority. We get to vote on set time table. If the congress person is not listening to the people he/she represents, will be voted out. Thats how our political system was designed to work.
No, I vote for them for their stated ideals and what they promise to attempt while in office. Doesn't matter which party. I expect them to be able to think for themselves and to speak for themselves. Generally, if they merely follow the party line they are not doing this and need to be removed from office. IMO.
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And how is that different from what is in the US constitution? You've a voice via votes, and contact your congress person on your disagreement/sharing ideas. You don't pull everybody out to vote on every issue this nation faces, big or small.
On small issues, no, a vote need not be taken as long as input is sought. On an issue the magnitude of health care with its percentage of the national wealth involved, I see no problem with it coming up for a vote. Since it is so critical, how can you leave it in the hands of political hacks and be comfortable with it?
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Or, am I wrong in understanding this piece of the US constitution?
Part of the problem is that you only act on your understanding which is not necessarily correct.
What ISN'T a rush in your mind? When your house is ablaze and you call the fire department, do you expect them to balk at your insistence that they arrive earlier than sometime next week? Exactly how much time do those of you who paid no attention at all to the already many past months of this debate need in order to get sufficiently caught up? Do you have any actual intention of using whatever time you would demand for the purpose of getting sufficiently caught up, or are you all actually just trying to stall for the sake of stalling?
Meanwhile, there are FY2010 authorization and appropriation bills to be worked out yet this Fall. Nothing will be bettered in either effort by allowing the two processes to crash into each other.
Do you expect to be taken seriously? Do you have a performance plan at work? Would it contain any target dates or milestones? Would you make this argument to your boss while expecting to be retained in your position?
LOL. There are more than 150 Republican amendments included in the HELP portion of the health care bill. There is meanwhile no argument at all coming from one side of the public debate. Merely lies. There isn't common ground to be found between lies and the truth of the matter.
So basically what you are saying is your way is the only way. Nothing but what you want is worthy of consideration and no timeline except what the democrats in congress is acceptable.
Way to go to gain the will of the people. Sounds a bit like a dictatorship.
So basically what you are saying is your way is the only way. Nothing but what you want is worthy of consideration and no timeline except what the democrats in congress is acceptable.
Way to go to gain the will of the people. Sounds a bit like a dictatorship.
I'm not sure, but it seems that you are also saying that your way is the only way. Your interpretation of events is the only interpretation. Your version of what's right is the only possible version. You're right, sounds a bit like a dictatorship.
Just for context, if you as a lobbyist were to go to a lawmaker with the greatest idea in the history of the world, do you know what he or she would say to you? Here's what: "Wow! Great idea! Put it into legislative language!"
i don't think that any citizen thinks that these politicians are writing these 1,000 plus page bills by themselves.
I'm not sure, but it seems that you are also saying that your way is the only way. Your interpretation of events is the only interpretation. Your version of what's right is the only possible version. You're right, sounds a bit like a dictatorship.
No, what I am saying is that there should be discussion and a common meeting of the minds. If that is bad, it is no worse than one side cramming their agenda down the throats of everyone.
No, what I am saying is that there should be discussion and a common meeting of the minds. If that is bad, it is no worse than one side cramming their agenda down the throats of everyone.
Why do so many fear discussion?
We don't fear discussion. We've been discussing things, and doing so rather reasonably. But you have made repeated blanket accusations that the people who disagree with you are the ones failing to compromise. And yet I haven't seen any signs of compromise on your behalf. It's not meant as an attack on you, but it seems a fair observation, no?
Which is extremely difficult to do when they don't consult their constituents and try to avoid doing so (rushing a bill through congress, sometimes without even reading it).
Get with the program. The vast majority of bills isn't even voted on. They pass under unanimous consent.
Meanwhile, those in Congress, particularly on the House side, hear thousands of times a day from their constituents. They maintain one or more offices in their home districts, spend practically every waking hour of most House recesses touring around and talking to folks in those districts, and devote a very significant portion of their staff and office budgets to the matter of constituent services. This is what YOU call "avoiding".
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Originally Posted by Predos
Want to bet that the town halls and conversations partaken of there are ignored by our congresscritters?
Even if it were the case that a townhall conversation consisted of exchanges with two genteel and well-informed spokespersons for different but still worthwhile points of view, one of those in the end would have to be ignored. In the event of there being one such person on one side, and a gaggle of clueless screaming harpies and meemies ranting away on the other, why the choice of which side to ignore should be quite the simple one.
Get with the program. The vast majority of bills isn't even voted on. They pass under unanimous consent.
Meanwhile, those in Congress, particularly on the House side, hear thousands of times a day from their constituents.
The various pieces of legislation before the Congress regarding reforming health care / health insurance, are some of the largest structural changes that the Congress has EVER heard / considered. The legislation, if passed, will literally impact every Man, Woman and Child in this nation.
These bills will NOT be passed or even considered for passage by unanimous consent.
These bills MUST be read, in their totality, by every member of Congress - and it is becoming increasingly obvious who has not taken the time to read these bills. And I dare say that some who are ignorant today about the bills may not return to Congress after their terms are up.
The American people are asking straight forward, direct, honest questions about these bills - and the Members of Congress are unable, in any number of times, incapable or unwilling to answer the questions. The American people have every right to then ask what they, the MOC's are trying to hide. Or, at the very least, questioning there representatives desire to really represent their constituents.
IMO, I don't think ANY of the bills are going to pass this session.
Technology is spawning a tremendous interest in exactly what laws our legislators are passing, and how our legislators determine their positions on various issues. I think that this trend of increased interest, even passionate interest, is going to have a profound impact on our government, and on our society.
Yes, profound impact might turn out to be the case, but the question of whether for better or worse would remain. Technology (if it is the gremlin) has not seemingly spurred very much interest at all in "exactly what laws our legislators are passing". Instead, it has spurred rabid interest in opposing the provisions of entirely imaginary laws that no lawmaker has proposed or would ever vote for. Dealing with the problems that we confront as a society will be difficult enough. Prospects only darken if we are expected to deal with random hordes of hyper-ventilating delusional people at the same time.
So basically what you are saying is your way is the only way. Nothing but what you want is worthy of consideration and no timeline except what the democrats in congress is acceptable. Way to go to gain the will of the people. Sounds a bit like a dictatorship.
Resort to straw men much? You whine over there being target dates, and when it's pointed out that target dates are a normal, if not ubiquitous, part of project planning at every level of society, you wander off into whiney dictatorship talk. If you can't do better than that, maybe it's time to adopt the old railroad-crossing strategy -- stop, look, and listen.
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