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Wal-Mart does this already by encouraging employees to apply for government cheese. I thought liberals were opposed to this idea? Guess not so much if it helps their agenda.
I think it's great that Obama is going for public option. He's betting all or nothing for '10, and it's likely a losing battle so if he fails, the country prospers.
Funny thing is about Obam is was he was billed as this incredibly intelligent man.
Yet, he can't even get dems to vote for his hope and change.
All the guy had to do was offer government paid for healthcare for people that are at a certain income level. This way they could go to a doctor and get prescriptions and what not. He could have had that passed in a heart beat. And it would be relatively cheap by govt standards.
Instead he says how evil private health insurance is and then turns around and says he isn't going to touch it. If it is so bad and all these people are being denied coverage where is the law enforcement? Why aren't these DAs doing their jobs and locking these people up for defrauding the clients? I'd be all for that. Everyone would.
If insurance companies did what the retards on the left said they did then these insurance execs would have been in jail a long time ago. Fact is, dems are liars.
HR 3200 (the proposed healthcare legislation) written by democrats does away with that. On pages 284-288 it assigns a government official to every hospital in the country.
No, no, and no - no page numbers. If you look at the bill (the actual bill, as seen on THOMAS or OpenCongress), there are no page numbers.
Give a proper citation - give the section number - otherwise, you're just making this stuff up.
No, no, and no - no page numbers. If you look at the bill (the actual bill, as seen on THOMAS or OpenCongress), there are no page numbers.
Give a proper citation - give the section number - otherwise, you're just making this stuff up.
Grow up buddy. I have zero reason to make this stuff up.
And if you view the printed version of this bill, the actual bill is right in front of me, it is assigend page numbers. Generally speaking, websites don't have page numbers.
Anyway, page numbers aren't what is important. And I said in my other post "page 26 Section C." Yet, you tell me I am making stuff up for not citing section numbers. I think you are making stuff up. So there. (I'm sticking my tongue out at you. LOLs.)
Fact: Because of Republican vision and leadership anyone in this country can get free healthcare. This law was passed 23 years ago. It covers everyone. Legals, illegals, minorities, gays. It's a straight up fact. It's not open for debate.
Fact: Obamacare lets a government official decide who gets admitted to a hospital at any given time and for any given reason. It is completley up to this person. Doesn't matter if they have insurance privately or publicly. That is exactly what it says. It's a straight up fact. It's not open for debate.
So what do you want? The Republican law already in place that gives free healthcare to everyone. Or the Democrat version. That lets one person decide who dies? And it's all up to that one person. Doesn't even say they have to be a doctor. Just a govt employee. Looking to control costs no doubt. That what this bill does. And you can't even fight it in court. They specifically said that too. Doesn't matter if there is a page number on there.
Like I said, I'm no Republican but this is the biggest no-brainer in the history of earth. Republicans accomplished 23 years ago what Obama now says he wants to do now. This is why democrats are retards.
If you reply to this I demand you put a page number and section number on your post. Otherwise you are just making stuff up.
This way they can discontinue their insurance and let their employees go on the "public" plan.
You think companies won't do this all over America ? We'll end up with ONLY the public option in the end.
Why can't people go for private plan? Y'all never cease to amuse me.
Either way, though, I would love to see health insurance detached from employment and one less burden for employers to deal with. It will be a winning situation for the people and businesses.
No wonder small business associations are for public option.
Why can't people go for private plan? Y'all never cease to amuse me.
Either way, though, I would love to see health insurance detached from employment and one less burden for employers to deal with. It will be a winning situation for the people and businesses.
No wonder small business associations are for public option.
Bingo. If employers stopped paying for insurance prices would go down. You can't inject a third-party into a two-party deal and reduce costs. It always raises costs.
And people won't go for a private plan for one reason. The government arbitrarily decides what is "acceptable" insurance for someone to carry. If they decide that your private insurance is "unacceptable" you must pay an 8% surcharge on your taxes. So you can keep your private insurance. But you wont be able to use and your taxes go up. The second a government official decides it will be that way. And you can't fight it in court either. It is written in the House Bill. That is exactly what it says. It is in the "Applicable Insurance Plans" section.
Basically, you can go for a private plan. It is completely legal. It will just cost you 8% more a year in taxes and you can only use it if the govt lets you. Great deal there. Everyone will be happy about that.
But, the government has no intentions of getting everyone on the public plan. They even said so.
Bingo. If employers stopped paying for insurance prices would go down. You can't inject a third-party into a two-party deal and reduce costs. It always raises costs.
Wrong. But you're probably more comfortable having fewer choices than more.
Quote:
And people won't go for a private plan for one reason. The government arbitrarily decides what is "acceptable" insurance for someone to carry...
What you call arbitrary is called regulation in real world. In this case, setting a minimum standard for all insurance providers, and that will include public option as well. If you hate government regulations, then I might as well go argue with my dining room table.
Quote:
If they decide that your private insurance is "unacceptable" you must pay an 8% surcharge on your taxes. So you can keep your private insurance. But you wont be able to use and your taxes go up. The second a government official decides it will be that way. And you can't fight it in court either. It is written in the House Bill. That is exactly what it says. It is in the "Applicable Insurance Plans" section.
Provide a link to this issue you've seen and we will discuss it by the sentence.
Quote:
But, the government has no intentions of getting everyone on the public plan. They even said so.
True. Love the alarmist tone in the way you added that last sentence though.
I meant to say businesses SHOULDN'T have to pick up the tab. This is the #1 reason why my business left the Chamber of Commerce this year. That organization has no common sense.
They should pick up SOME or even HALF but ALL of us should pay into the system. ALL of us. Just like Social Security.
Why "should' business be obligated to pay for their employees health insurance? We are not paying into a "societal system". Our premiums go to a private company. IMHO business is burdened enough.
Wrong. But you're probably more comfortable having fewer choices than more.
What you call arbitrary is called regulation in real world. In this case, setting a minimum standard for all insurance providers, and that will include public option as well. If you hate government regulations, then I might as well go argue with my dining room table.
Provide a link to this issue you've seen and we will discuss it by the sentence.
True. Love the alarmist tone in the way you added that last sentence though.
Yeah you're right. That why we have so few choices with auto and home insurance. LOLs. It's the exact same companies that do health insurance. So it only makes sense thay would also offer more choices in health care. If they were allowed. There are 40 million employers in this country. There are 300 million people. It only makes sense that 300 million will get more choices than 40 million.
In a group plan they have to set rates to cover the people that are most likely to use the insurance. The sickest of the sick if you will. If everyone could buy individually then healty people wouldn't have to pay for sick people. And was there a health insurance "crises" in this country before employers got involved? Before govt got involved? Sure wasn't.
Why should I have to pay higher premiums so someone can go to drug rehab? I don't do drugs. Therefore it safe to assume I will never need to go to drug rehab. State of Tennessee requires that health insurance providers allow people to go to drug rehab. Twice if they need it. And I gotta pay for it in higher premiums. Where is the fairness in that? Why can't I opt out of the drug rehab part? What if I sign a statement that if I go to rehab I will pay for it myself? Then my ins. premiums would come down. But, you're right an individual negoitiating with the ins company is always more expensive than the govt doing it. They want me to pay for rehab just in case I decide to start smoking crack. LOLs. Anyway, drugs are expensive. If someone can afford to pick up some herion they ought to be able to afford drug rehab.
Govt regulation is arbitrary. Bill Clinton made an arbitrary decision to fund stem cell research. George Bush made an arbitrary decision not to. Obama has made an arbitrary decision to push this bill through. All govt decisions are arbitrary. Any govt regulation can change at any time. That is what makes them arbitrary. A contract between an individual and ins company is negoitiable before anyone agrees to it. But I like govt deciding exactly what kind of ins I need. What is "acceptable" today can be "unacceptable" the next. That is the way govt regulation works. It's been that in every govt on the planet for the past 5000 years. No reason to think this bill is somehow immune to that. And everytime they change soc security it benefits the govt and screws the public. Higher taxes. Wait till you're 67.5 years old instead of 65. What will be different about healthcare? Nothing.
In case you haven't noticed minumum standards are already set on insurance companies.
And if these ins. companies are so evil like the Dems claim why not sick the DAs on them for fraud? Thats what DAs do. They enforce the law. If an ins. company denies a claim they should be prosecuted for fraud. But, you never hear about that do you? So, the Dems are eithing liars or are retarded or can't figure out the proper function of a DAs office. Probably a little of each.
I don't need to provide a link. It is the House Bill that I am talking about. It is a matter of public record. You can find it. I even referenced the bill number, page numbers and section numbers in an earlier post. On this thread. I don't feel like doing it again.
And there is nothing alarmist about my statements. If you make people pay an 8% surcharge on their private health insurance and then deny them access to a hospital when they want to use said insurance they are going to the govt plan. But it technically it is voluntary. And under this bill they can do that. Nothing alarmist about it. It is written in there. Plain as day. And you can't fight it in court either. If they deny you hospital admittance I guess you die. I'm not saying they will do that. I'm saying that under this bill they can. And you can't do a damn thing about it. Change we can believe in. Change. Change. Change. Vote for me becuase I'm not George Bush. LOLs. I swear that's why people voted for Obama. Would have matters who the Dems put up there. Dems are so filled with hatred they would've voted satan as long as he was full of hate for white male southerners. (By the way, I'm exagerating to make a point. I know you libs take everything sooooooo seriously. But I really believe you would've voted for anyone as long as they hated republicans)
Like I said way back in 1986 Ronald Reagan signed a bill into law that anyone within the borders of the United States will be given medical care at any hospital in the country. (Don't tell anyone but it even covers blacks and Mexicans. What would the neighbors think? Ronald Reagan helping blacks and Mexicans at the expense of the evil, greedy capitalists that are effing us with medical care.) That is a fact. It's public record. If this bill is passed then that law is no longer applicable. A government official decides who gets admitted. That is also a fact and a matter of public record. Hopefully, we won't get this bill passed.
I would hate to see what is gonna happen when Republicans are in charge again. Those racists hate mongers will just tell all the blacks and Mexicans to go home and die. LOLS.
Last edited by NorthPoleMarathoner; 08-22-2009 at 11:56 AM..
I'm afraid that it will turn into one massive medicaid system and our taxes will go through the roof.
No, it won't. A single-payer, Medicare-For-All system would be MUCH more less expensive than what we have now. Did you know that the average MONTHLY health insurance premium for a family of four is between $1200-2000/month, depending on where you live?
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