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Old 08-28-2009, 02:43 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
17,521 posts, read 22,855,077 times
Reputation: 9860

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In Mesa Arizona a """Doctor""" was telling his elderly patients that they would be denied care if Obama's Plan passes. The conduct of Medical """Professionals""" has been despicable. People should understand that Physicians are perfectly willing to allow them to suffer in order to win.
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Old 08-28-2009, 02:44 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
7,090 posts, read 11,384,969 times
Reputation: 4120
Let's see, how many people know how much these procedures cost and charge now?

I work in a hospital, the fees compared to costs on these procedures are a gold mine for offices (why you see so many imaging and cath centers around). Doctors order tests just generate to cash, and this will bring it back into line. You can't complain about over billing and then complain when people do something about it. Complain about the other procedures where Medicare pays 10% under cost of care, not like anyone here would know those MS-DRG's.
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Old 08-28-2009, 03:16 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 13,918,699 times
Reputation: 3544
Quote:
Originally Posted by subsound View Post
Let's see, how many people know how much these procedures cost and charge now?

I work in a hospital, the fees compared to costs on these procedures are a gold mine for offices (why you see so many imaging and cath centers around). Doctors order tests just generate to cash, and this will bring it back into line. You can't complain about over billing and then complain when people do something about it. Complain about the other procedures where Medicare pays 10% under cost of care, not like anyone here would know those MS-DRG's.
It's just a 10% difference between the cost of care and what Medicare pays? Interesting.......

Doctors’ Pay, a Key to Health Care Reform - Room for Debate Blog - NYTimes.com

I personally like:
Quote:
There are a variety of bad ways of paying doctors, but no particularly good ones. Fee-for-service health care rewards the overprovision of care; capitation (a set monthly fee per patient) rewards underprovision; and salaries reward just showing up. The minority of physicians (and hospital administrators) who are motivated mostly by money will find a way to game an incentive system rather than do the hard work of providing excellent care.
Even paying doctors based on quality measures (using data from medical records that the doctors themselves create) can be fudged. For example, if you pay doctors more for care of patients with diabetes with extra incentives for controlling blood sugar, some doctors will neglect to properly instruct patients to fast before their morning blood tests, falsely diagnosing them as ill. These false diabetics will appear to have superb outcomes since they weren’t sick to begin with.
At the same time, most of the myriad details of care and small kindnesses that make for good doctoring would inevitably go unrewarded, making their neglect essential to a doctor’s financial success.
Close
A public plan would be forced to emulate the bad behavior of private insurance competitors, or fail in the marketplace.
The Medicare payment system illustrates the false hope of financial savings or improved quality through manipulating financial incentives. The system, which pays health care providers based on “diagnosis-related group,” altered hospitals’ incentives, rewarding short hospital stays instead of long ones. But hospitals quickly adapted, and while Medicare patients’ length of stay plummeted, costs continued to skyrocket.
Financial incentives are not necessary for cost control, and are expensive to administer. A single payer system like Canada’s -– in which individuals choose their doctors and other health care providers, but the providers bill one agency for their services — limits entrepreneurial rewards and penalties, covers everyone, and saves much on bureaucracy and profits.
Many American doctors now support a single payer approach because it would improve health and remove the crushing paperwork burden that private insurers impose. Paperwork consumes 31 percent of U.S. health spending, nearly double that of Canada. Our nation wastes $400 billion annually on insurance overhead and useless bureaucracy, money that single-payer reform could shift to patient care. That’s enough to cover all of the uninsured, and to eliminate copayments and deductibles for everyone else. A single payer system would allow doctors to return to the patient-centered care that motivated us to go to medical school in the first place.
In contrast, the Senate Democrats’ proposal to require the purchase of coverage would leave private insurers in charge, and hence sharply increase costs while leaving millions uninsured, or covered by skimpy policies. In 2007, illness and medical bills contributed to 62 percent of personal bankruptcies; most of the medically bankrupt were middle-class families with private insurance. Copayments, deductibles, and loopholes that let insurers deny claims leave millions of Americans in financial ruin. The individual mandate now popular in Congress would merely force the uninsured to buy defective policies – boosting revenues for insurers but not protecting patients.
Unfortunately, adding a public plan option would not correct these flaws. The bureaucratic savings would be minuscule. Moreover, a public plan would be forced to either emulate the bad behavior of its private insurance competitors, or fail in the marketplace — swamped by private insurers that dumped sick, expensive patients onto the public. This kind of tinkering around the edges of our insurance company-dominated system won’t fix it.

Insurers Hit Back At Doctor Charges - NPR Health Blog : NPR
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Old 08-28-2009, 03:49 PM
 
620 posts, read 1,222,829 times
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Originally Posted by PurpleLove08 View Post
They have that right.
There will also be other doctors out there who will care more about the patient than their pocketbook.
Why should doctors be free from cuts like any other profession?
They need to learn to adjust like anyone else.

I personally don't think Medicare payments should be cut, it would be nice if they could stay the same and for seniors that make over a certain amount will have to pay say a $20-60 co-pay whenever they see a cardiologist.

I guess no patients have EVER suffered when their insurance company refused to pay for a visit to a cardiologist or refused to pay for their open heart surgery? Let's no paint the government as the big bad wolf here.
I dont disagree with you....these are well qualified physicians I speak of and care about their patients but they care about $$$$ at least as much. My point was that they would rather take care of those patients that can either pay cash or who have insurance plans that meet their charges rather than take less money from medicare etc. It is definately greed but if this attitude catches on...it could cause some patient care issues.
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Old 08-28-2009, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Florida
22,632 posts, read 23,257,513 times
Reputation: 26722
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jareb View Post
I dont disagree with you....these are well qualified physicians I speak of and care about their patients but they care about $$$$ at least as much. My point was that they would rather take care of those patients that can either pay cash or who have insurance plans that meet their charges rather than take less money from medicare etc. It is definately greed but if this attitude catches on...it could cause some patient care issues.
Would it be greed if you didn't want your level of earning to drop?
Would you switch jobs if you were faced with cuts so you could maintain the pay you're accustomed to?
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Old 08-28-2009, 04:17 PM
 
Location: DFW - Coppell / Las Colinas
38,267 posts, read 42,917,516 times
Reputation: 47600
Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
Would it be greed if you didn't want your level of earning to drop?
Would you switch jobs if you were faced with cuts so you could maintain the pay you're accustomed to?
I suspect many people define greed as the level right above their personal income level. The desire to do better for your family and yourself is what makes the world spin.
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Old 08-28-2009, 04:55 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 13,918,699 times
Reputation: 3544
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jareb View Post
I dont disagree with you....these are well qualified physicians I speak of and care about their patients but they care about $$$$ at least as much. My point was that they would rather take care of those patients that can either pay cash or who have insurance plans that meet their charges rather than take less money from medicare etc. It is definately greed but if this attitude catches on...it could cause some patient care issues.
My thing is if a bunch of people are on the public option, it would seem better, IMO, to just accept people on the public option.
If I have 100 patients on the public option which gives me less money but only have about 70 on private insurance and they only give me 10% more than than those on the public option, I wouldn't mind seeing all 170 of them.

I have read stories of some doctors going to cash only and it seems like a good idea. However a lot of the articles acknowledge that cash-only would be slow to catch on to the rest of the medical community.

I don't see why those on the public option wouldn't be asked to pay some money in cash to make up the difference between what their insurance pays and what the actual cost is. I've seen a few of the bills from my doctor and insurance paid $100 while I paid $20. Seems fair. I don't see why it couldn't be any different with those on the public option.
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Old 08-29-2009, 12:18 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 13,918,699 times
Reputation: 3544
Quote:
Originally Posted by old_cold View Post
Iguess you don't know that Medicare is an 80/20 plan.
Out-of-pocket is 20% of whatever a provider charges
I'm sure they can change that or doctors can try to make it where they will accept Medicare patients but they have to pay more out of pocket if they want to see a certain doctor or whatever.

Just an idea.
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Old 08-29-2009, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,106 posts, read 37,101,158 times
Reputation: 4924
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerLily24 View Post
Of course they are worried. More preventative care means less need for oncologists and cardiologists. Protecting their little fiefdoms sounds more like.
Preventative care is all well and good. But, in reality, this is not going to help those that are qualified for Medicare now. And that is the point.

Those that rely on Medicare will not be able to get the care they need NOW to be able to live.
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Old 08-29-2009, 01:09 PM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,106 posts, read 37,101,158 times
Reputation: 4924
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boompa View Post
In Mesa Arizona a """Doctor""" was telling his elderly patients that they would be denied care if Obama's Plan passes. The conduct of Medical """Professionals""" has been despicable. People should understand that Physicians are perfectly willing to allow them to suffer in order to win.
Its been debunked.

You are now slandering others
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