Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
"Liberal relativism," what does that mean? This appears to me to be about right wing hypocrisy as well as their stumbling confusion over the definition of socialism.
Its convenient to pawn off anybody that doesn't get on board with the socialist agenda as "right wing". Further, its a stupid tactic to try to prove the ignornace of people who don't agree with you for fear of debating and defending on the merits of the concept alone.
Liberal relativism is when somebody trys to justify something by relating it to something else that is in no way related.
Or, in this case, "they did it, so that makes it right".
You want to discuss socialism, and defend it based on the literal definition, lets do it. The governments involvement in General Motors and the subsequent bailout of the company with strings attached to control production is about as "socialist" as it gets. Debate me on that, not your percieved ignornace on my part.
Do you feel the GOP abuses this word, picking a choosing what they deem "Socialist" as it fits their needs?
Their hero Bush oversaw the largest expansion of Medicare/Medicaid in history. Did they call him a "Socialist"? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
Did they march in the street and call Bush a "Socialist" when he bailed Wall Street out to the tune of BILLIONS? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
All of them will be using the Medicare when they reach the appropriate age. Why aren't they marching in the street and complaining about that? Do they write up signs and cry "Socialism" in the street over Medicare? Of course not. In fact the GOP is doing their best to strengthen that program.
Do they march in front of their local VA and scream "Socialists" as those who served our country walk (or wheel) in for medical care? Of course they don't.
Do they go to public schools all across this country and scream at their children's teachers for "indoctrinating their children" with "Socialism"? Of course they don't.
Do they march in front of libraries and scream "Socialists" to those who can check a free book or movie out? Of course they don't.
Do they scream "Socialist" while Fireman, Policemen, and other emergency personnel make their way into work each day? Of course they don't.
Do they write letters of protest about national parks they will never visit or roads they will never get to drive on? Of course they don't.
Do they scream at their parents, grandparents, great aunts and uncles when they go to pick up their social security check each month? Do they cut these people out of their life because they are free loading "Socialists"? Of course they don't.
Did they march in the streets after no bid contracts were awarded to Halliburton AFTER they were found guilty of fleecing the American tax payer? Of course not.
Are they willfully ignorant in regards to this word, embarrassingly so, assigning it to those they do not like? Of course they are.
1. Bush was a liberal socialist. Obama is just more of a socialist.
2. Medicare won't be around when I retire. It is just another tax for me
3. The Vets EARNED thier healthcare. Deadbeats did not
4. Do I tell my partents that social security is for dead beats? Yes- they are liberals so they think it is okay. I don't.
5. Did I scream about national parks and roads? No they are national resources and a means of conducting commerce, not a blank check to dead beats. Both are useful. Dead beats are not useful for anything but consumption.
6. March in the streets? I have a bad knee. I don't march for anything.
7. Ignorant? The average IQ of a republican is higher than the average democrat. Democrats must be VERY IGNORANT.
Pay for all the crap you want yourself. You libs are greedy and selfish and demand that others pay for everything you want, while shirking your fiscal responsibility.
I did read the OP and, while I agree with most of his points, I do have to agree with those who have called the 'poll' biased. There is no answer in the poll for those who disagree with him. And the answers he does supply can be seen as rather inflammatory.
This is what I dislike about most so-called 'political discussion' - everyone seems to see things from only their own side and refuse to even try to understand the other person's viewpoint. And that is why there never seems to be any kind of compromise, whether it be between politicians or those who post to forums such as C-D.
Last edited by MsMcQ LV; 09-03-2009 at 11:33 AM..
Reason: small spelling error
Do you feel the GOP abuses this word, picking a choosing what they deem "Socialist" as it fits their needs?
Their hero Bush oversaw the largest expansion of Medicare/Medicaid in history. Did they call him a "Socialist"? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
Did they march in the street and call Bush a "Socialist" when he bailed Wall Street out to the tune of BILLIONS? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
Right on,
they don't hate socialism, they love "corporate socialism" (giving our tax money to the rich)
What they hate is poor Americans, the best example of that is the way many of them talked about Americans that were victims of Hurricane Katrina as if they were worth less than rat without legs.
Do you feel the GOP abuses this word, picking a choosing what they deem "Socialist" as it fits their needs?
Their hero Bush oversaw the largest expansion of Medicare/Medicaid in history. Did they call him a "Socialist"? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
Not me I must have been those republicans and conservatives who actually know the difference. Bush was a socialist thru and thru.
Did they march in the street and call Bush a "Socialist" when he bailed Wall Street out to the tune of BILLIONS? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
I did and complained about it for weeks on CD hmmm I wonder what stupid neocon came up with this idea.
All of them will be using the Medicare when they reach the appropriate age. Why aren't they marching in the street and complaining about that? Do they write up signs and cry "Socialism" in the street over Medicare? Of course not. In fact the GOP is doing their best to strengthen that program.
Medicare and Medicade are socialism along with the idea of Social Security of course I think most conseratives know that and complain about it often. Which is why we dont want govenrment running healthcare :-)
Do they march in front of their local VA and scream "Socialists" as those who served our country walk (or wheel) in for medical care? Of course they don't. No we dont because those people actually did a job of which we pay them to do and is considered a defense cost. Which is in the constitution on defending the country. I may not agree if we are defending our country or someone elses but I know that soldier didnt make that **** poor policy. PS the local government VA medical care run by the government SUCKS. Another reason to fight against government run healthcare.
Do they go to public schools all across this country and scream at their children's teachers for "indoctrinating their children" with "Socialism"? Of course they don't.
I do often and complain that the teachers unions and public schools are often a place to teach our children on all the left socialist ideas. I also question the costs in public schools the education and why we need the FEDERAL department of education.
Do they march in front of libraries and scream "Socialists" to those who can check a free book or movie out? Of course they don't.
Hmm you know the internet has just as many resources of which we pay for and deliver many of the same services. Of course a library is local in most cases and funded in many different WAYS not just taxes.
Do they scream "Socialist" while Fireman, Policemen, and other emergency personnel make their way into work each day? Of course they don't.
Most fireman and emergency personnel are voluteer :-)
Policemen get paid via local taxes.. I dont see us complaining about policemen in washington do you?
Do they write letters of protest about national parks they will never visit or roads they will never get to drive on? Of course they don't.
I do protest the cost in some of these "projects for roads" considering they use their buddies for the deals and jack the prices up. Then again most of roads in nj and pa are paid via all the tolls I pay to ride them :-)
Again a local state tax and or local tax of which I control much better then I can in washington.
Do they scream at their parents, grandparents, great aunts and uncles when they go to pick up their social security check each month? Do they cut these people out of their life because they are free loading "Socialists"? Of course they don't.
Well I do find it funny how they need me to run this system or its broke, they need people working so they can make more people dependant on it. I also find it interesting that they tax people on the security check. hmmmm that is odd dont you think. So a tax, on a tax on a tax :-) Only washington could come up with that one and people thank them for it.
Did they march in the streets after no bid contracts were awarded to Halliburton AFTER they were found guilty of fleecing the American tax payer? Of course not.
I dont know didnt bill clinton use Halliburton as well hmmm something about them being the best at the job I think was the deciding factor. Of course since I dont believe in nation building even if in IRAQ or somila I kinda think I wouldnt even be talking to Haliburton.
Are they willfully ignorant in regards to this word, embarrassingly so, assigning it to those they do not like? Of course they are.
I use socialism to describe big government of which we have from Bush, to Clinton to Bush and now on to Obama I see nothing new here and often like represent the facts. SO while many conservaties are stupid and defend the R next to a name I look at the constitution and call you all socialist pigs. From the Liberals socialist and the neocon right.
Last edited by LibertyandJusticeforAll; 09-03-2009 at 12:20 PM..
Do you feel the GOP abuses this word, picking a choosing what they deem "Socialist" as it fits their needs?
Their hero Bush oversaw the largest expansion of Medicare/Medicaid in history. Did they call him a "Socialist"? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
Did they march in the street and call Bush a "Socialist" when he bailed Wall Street out to the tune of BILLIONS? Of course not. Rather they applauded him.
All of them will be using the Medicare when they reach the appropriate age. Why aren't they marching in the street and complaining about that? Do they write up signs and cry "Socialism" in the street over Medicare? Of course not. In fact the GOP is doing their best to strengthen that program.
Do they march in front of their local VA and scream "Socialists" as those who served our country walk (or wheel) in for medical care? Of course they don't.
Do they go to public schools all across this country and scream at their children's teachers for "indoctrinating their children" with "Socialism"? Of course they don't.
Do they march in front of libraries and scream "Socialists" to those who can check a free book or movie out? Of course they don't.
Do they scream "Socialist" while Fireman, Policemen, and other emergency personnel make their way into work each day? Of course they don't.
Do they write letters of protest about national parks they will never visit or roads they will never get to drive on? Of course they don't.
Do they scream at their parents, grandparents, great aunts and uncles when they go to pick up their social security check each month? Do they cut these people out of their life because they are free loading "Socialists"? Of course they don't.
Did they march in the streets after no bid contracts were awarded to Halliburton AFTER they were found guilty of fleecing the American tax payer? Of course not.
Are they willfully ignorant in regards to this word, embarrassingly so, assigning it to those they do not like? Of course they are.
I wanted to vote in your poll but the choices seemed a bit restricted to me. In fact, they were so restricted that I am sure you meant only your friends from the left should vote so I avoided that part of your poll.
Its convenient to pawn off anybody that doesn't get on board with the socialist agenda as "right wing". Further, its a stupid tactic to try to prove the ignornace of people who don't agree with you for fear of debating and defending on the merits of the concept alone.
Liberal relativism is when somebody trys to justify something by relating it to something else that is in no way related.
Or, in this case, "they did it, so that makes it right".
You want to discuss socialism, and defend it based on the literal definition, lets do it. The governments involvement in General Motors and the subsequent bailout of the company with strings attached to control production is about as "socialist" as it gets. Debate me on that, not your percieved ignornace on my part.
Funny, GM is going public next year and the govt is divesting all its shares.
I think your interpretation is wrong - the OP isnt saying "and so that makes it okay," s/he's pointing out the hypocrisy of those who scream "Socialist!"
No idea what you mean in your first two sentences -- you misunderstood, I guess.
Funny, GM is going public next year and the govt is divesting all its shares.
That is in the future. Are you dismissing what happened in the past like it doesn't count ? We lost billions with GM and now the government has a majority stake. That is the here and NOW.
That is in the future. Are you dismissing what happened in the past like it doesn't count ? We lost billions with GM and now the government has a majority stake. That is the here and NOW.
Would you prefer GM have kept hemorrhaging cash - their 2008 2nd Q earnings were -$1.5B -- "let the US auto industry fail" wasnt a possibility. They've been turned around with blinding speed, the government WILL SELL ITS MAJORITY STAKE piece by piece as the prices become righter and righter. How much less socialist can you be?
Would you prefer GM have kept hemorrhaging cash - their 2008 2nd Q earnings were -$1.5B -- "let the US auto industry fail" wasnt a possibility. They've been turned around with blinding speed, the government WILL SELL ITS MAJORITY STAKE piece by piece as the prices become righter and righter. How much less socialist can you be?
GM is not THE industry. They should have let GM go down and back up Ford instead with some help to Toyota and Honda who have mfg plants in the US and employ US citizens. IMHO..the GM deal was a UAW move with government, not a business deal at all. A businessman knows when to cut their losses and run.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
