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You are not understanding what I said. I am saying that the range of phenotypes in the African American population is the same as the range of phenotypes in the Dominican population. The same phenotypic spectrum. We never got into proportions. You are distorting what I said.
You explained in detail? You gave no detail whatsoever.
Yes, I explained in detail why the 'phenotypic spectrum' of an American minority group (African Americans) is not the same as that of the people of another country (DR). Going by your vague definition, than you must believe they also display the same phenotypic spectrum as all of Africa, LatinAmerica and even Europe.
Yes, I explained in detail why the 'phenotypic spectrum' of an American minority group (African Americans) is not the same as that of the people of another country (DR). Going by your vague definition, than you must believe they also display the same phenotypic spectrum as all of Africa, LatinAmerica and even Europe.
You did no such thing. You told me that Dominicans, Cubans and PR were triracial, etc.......and I countered by saying that the same thing could be said about many African Americans. You said absolutely nothing to refute that point. You just talked around it.
That has been disputed, but even if it is true, he was born in the DR, raised in the DR and is totally Dominican in terms of culture and heritage. There are many Dominicans of Haitian ancestry, and many not of Haitian ancestry, who are just as African in appearance as he is.
You're spinning here, no where do I question his 'Dominicaness'. He is accepted as a Dominican by Dominicans in general. I gave a more detailed background on him to illustrate how his Haitian ancestry was used as a point of attack by his political enemies. And no where do I even imply anything about the existence of Dominicans of Haitian ancestry and wether or not there are Dominicans just as 'African' in appearance who're not of Haitian ancestry. Read carefully what you quote instead of replying to statments never made.
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You can call me racecentric all you want. In America as an African descendant that is how we are socialized, as you have by now found out. If I am racecentric, you are clueless about race.
No, this is your own personal Afrocentric idealogy. You don't speak for all of the New World Afrodiasporic people and you seem a bit disconnected from your Cuban culure. And I disagree, I am very well aware of the role social race plays here in the USA, I just don't make it my point of reference for everything and anything. I've traveled all over the USA and nowhere do either African Americans or white Americans apply their black/white lables upon me. And I am no where near white. NJ has the 2nd largest Cuban community and I deal with a ton of recent Cuban arrivals, none self-identify along racial/color lines in the USA. Their pattern of self-identification are along similar lines as their Spanish Caribbean brethren.
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I know that. Of course, race has nothing to do with that........How is DR Pena Gomez's "adopted" land? He was born in the Dominican Republic. You're one of those guys who doesn't think Dominico-Haitians actually exist? I understand......really I do.
Haitians and Dominicans are nationalities, not 'races'. If you took off your race obsessed glasses for a second you will see that Dominicans see Johnny Ventura as a Dominican and Haitian president Preval as a Haitian regardless if both are 'black'. Gomez's parents fled to Haiti and left him in DR where he was adopted by a Domincian family. The rest of your post is you injecting your own emotionally charged accusations on things I never stated.
You tried to make him sometype of example of how supposedly his 'color' held him back and I pretty much debunked that theory.
If Tito Trinidad walked down the street in the vast majority of American cities and towns, and nobody knew that he was Tito Trinidad, they would see a black guy walking down the street. They would not know he was Puerto Rican, that his language was Spanish, or that he was Tito Trinidad, who could beat everybody's behind. Same thing with many Dominicans. Especially guys like David Ortiz and other baseball players you like to point to as exceptions.
What? Please post proof of where I even imply the underlined. If you don't have anything to counter, refrain from making things up.
Regarding your Tito Trinidad example, what does it matter what some segment of the US population label him as? I know that if a Dominican who looks lik David Ortiz was walking down a random town in say Kansas they will see just a black guy.
My family moved to North Carolina, so far the various member have been confused for:
Arab, East Indian, Mexican and African American. What is your point? That the general American public has a stereotypical image of a Latino being sometype of mestizo looking or pseudo-Italian looking person? We know this.
You did no such thing. You told me that Dominicans, Cubans and PR were triracial, etc.......and I countered by saying that the same thing could be said about many African Americans. You said absolutely nothing to refute that point. You just talked around it.
If you're arguing that African Americans display the same "phenotypic spectrum" as Dominicans because they're also tri-racial then let us drop this conversation right now. I will not even further pursue this.
You're spinning here, no where do I question his 'Dominicaness'.
Bull. You went out of your way to state that he was, and I quote, "100% of Haitian ancestry. You did not call him Dominican.
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He is accepted as a Dominican by Dominicans in general. I gave a more detailed background on him to illustrate how his Haitian ancestry was used as a point of attack by his political enemies. And no where do I even imply anything about the existence of Dominicans of Haitian ancestry and wether or not there are Dominicans just as 'African' in appearance who're not of Haitian ancestry. Read carefully what you quote instead of replying to statments never made.
Sure. You do the same.
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No, this is your own personal Afrocentric idealogy. You don't speak for all of the New World Afrodiasporic people and you seem a bit disconnected from your Cuban culure.
Not disconnected at all. There are many in the Afro-Atlantic world who speak Spanish who are quite conscious of Africa and its impact on said world. I happen to be one of them. My relatives are involved in Afro-Cuban culture as it evolved in Baracoa, Guantanamo and Santiago. I was raised to be proud of this culture. I was also born and raised in America, and that has an impact as well.
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And I disagree, I am very well aware of the role social race plays here in the USA, I just don't make it my point of reference for everything and anything. I've traveled all over the USA and nowhere do either African Americans or white Americans apply their black/white lables upon me.
To your knowledge.......
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And I am no where near white. NJ has the 2nd largest Cuban community and I deal with a ton of recent Cuban arrivals, none self-identify along racial/color lines in the USA. Their pattern of self-identification are along similar lines as their Spanish Caribbean brethren.
I know lots of Cubans who do. They call themselves Cuban, and they call themselves black. Lots of them are related to me. Whether that is along USA racial/color lines is up for interpretation.
The history of Cuban immigration to the US has always been one where race has been a factor. In Tampa and, to a lesser extent, New Orleans, when Cubans established social clubs, they were segregated by race. Hell, Cuba itself was segregated by race to a degree that reflected American influence on the island and in its culture.
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Haitians and Dominicans are nationalities, not 'races'.
Did I ever state differently?
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If you took off your race obsessed glasses for a second you will see that Dominicans see Johnny Ventura as a Dominican and Haitian president Preval as a Haitian regardless if both are 'black'. Gomez's parents fled to Haiti and left him in DR where he was adopted by a Domincian family. The rest of your post is you injecting your own emotionally charged accusations on things I never stated.
You tried to make him sometype of example of how supposedly his 'color' held him back and I pretty much debunked that theory.
His color was used against him. I never said it held him back. Of course, during that whole controversy there were light Dominicans who said that the country was not ready for that type of President. Sound familiar? Being from a race-obsessed country means that opens one's eyes to many things. You are just as race-obsessed as I am. You just don't want to see it.
If you're arguing that African Americans display the same "phenotypic spectrum" as Dominicans because they're also tri-racial then let us drop this conversation right now. I will not even further pursue this.
You never pursued it to begin with. You talked around my points, told me I didn't know what I was talking about, and then you dismissed my argument without even really addressing it.
What? Please post proof of where I even imply the underlined. If you don't have anything to counter, refrain from making things up.
OK. You didn't say this?
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But to say they show the same phenotypic spectrum as Dominican is grossly inaccurate. Either you are not very familiar with Dominicans, or you have a view influenced by random pictures and baseball players.
You didn't say this? Why would you say my view would be influenced by baseball players? You mean they don't represent the Dominican population?
Or this?
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Originally Posted by SuperMario OMG but how can they be Dominican? They're white!
And we all know that Dominicans are black
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I agree with your sarcasm. For some reason (usually people that are not exposed to a large enough segment of Dominican diversity) love to make stereotypical generalizaionts. I've seen this happen on other forums. They will post a million pics of Sammy Sosa or David Oritiz as poster boys of "the Dominican look", lmao.
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Regarding your Tito Trinidad example, what does it matter what some segment of the US population label him as? I know that if a Dominican who looks lik David Ortiz was walking down a random town in say Kansas they will see just a black guy.
The following is a quote you made where you said the opposite.
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When the general public sees Puerto Rican boxer Tito Trinidad, they see a Puerto Rican, they see a Latino, and they see someone who has obvious Afro ancestry. The same for any individual Dominican.
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My family moved to North Carolina, so far the various member have been confused for:
Arab, East Indian, Mexican and African American. What is your point? That the general American public has a stereotypical image of a Latino being sometype of mestizo looking or pseudo-Italian looking person? We know this.
You made a point about one specific man - Tito Trinidad - who is Latino and who is black. You said people would see him as Latino. My point is that most Americans would not see him as such.
I personaly dink most of u r wring
tru der is some self hate since trujillo
but im a darker skinned dominican and my family is from villa altagracia
thats in the mountains of the dominican republic
and during the carnavals we dress up as african and taino huntersa and dance around in the streets
and you got palo and many other african traditions
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What? Please post proof of where I even imply the underlined. If you don't have anything to counter, refrain from making things up.
