Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 09-29-2009, 12:46 AM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,767,183 times
Reputation: 12341

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
His opposition struck when Zelaya was planning to arrange an opinion poll (yes, he was screwing around), which in itself would not have been against the law, but his opposition says he was trying to change the constitution. So, there are two sides to the story. Well, he did not change the constitution, so the coup was somewhat premature, was it not? Perhaps they should have waited until a crime had been committed. I can almost guarantee it that the upcoming elections will be a joke and the country will end up with another dictator.

Let's face it: the proposed poll was nothing but an excuse to oust the guy and take control of the country. There is nothing unclear about that.

I don't support the guy, but I find it silly that the hard-right in US are so eager to support the coupies ONLY to disagree with Obama. If Obama has supported the coupies, the hard-right would have supported Zelaya. It is beyond ridiculous, and now the coupies already put a ban on freedom of speech, and the far-right still supports them.
I couldn't have said it any better... a rep will just have to wait.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 09-29-2009, 05:21 AM
 
Location: Florida
77,012 posts, read 47,481,489 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chevy268 View Post
The Honduran Constitution states that a person may serve one term a president and then never serve as president again; furthermore, the Honduran Constitution may not be amended.
Right. So, when Zelaya said he wanted to run an opinon poll, they said he was trying to amed the constitution. Well, he was not. He wanted to run a poll. They used it as an excuse to toss him out. Get it?

You need to ask the right questions: Why did they do it in sush rush and under such silly excuse? Why didn't they do it if Zelaya had actually tried to run again? That would have been a clear violation. Why didn't they wait for him to actually try to amend the constitution? Because all they needed was some excuse, any excuse, and they found it in the fact that he wanted ro run the poll.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-29-2009, 06:44 AM
 
8,058 posts, read 3,929,455 times
Reputation: 5343
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Right. So, when Zelaya said he wanted to run an opinon poll, they said he was trying to amed the constitution. Well, he was not. He wanted to run a poll. They used it as an excuse to toss him out. Get it?

You need to ask the right questions: Why did they do it in sush rush and under such silly excuse? Why didn't they do it if Zelaya had actually tried to run again? That would have been a clear violation. Why didn't they wait for him to actually try to amend the constitution? Because all they needed was some excuse, any excuse, and they found it in the fact that he wanted ro run the poll.

That "innocent little poll", issued by presidential decree, was in direct contravention to a previous court order against Zelaya to cease and desist.

The "rush" was in response to Zelaya's three separate decrees on the matter and his attempts to use the military to further his agenda.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-29-2009, 07:44 AM
 
Location: Florida
77,012 posts, read 47,481,489 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultor View Post
That "innocent little poll", issued by presidential decree, was in direct contravention to a previous court order against Zelaya to cease and desist.

The "rush" was in response to Zelaya's three separate decrees on the matter and his attempts to use the military to further his agenda.
He asked the military for logistical assistance running the poll.

Again, they tossed him out because they wanted to seize power. The poll issue was just an excuse. The court nominated one of their own judges to occupy the office of the president. Come one now.

Also, they threw him out of the country, which is in violation of the unconstitutional. According to Honduran constitution no Honduran citizen can be thrown out of the country. So, these guys pretend to be the guardians of the constitution, when the truth is they trampled on the constitution on the very same day they said they were protecting it.

Well, it is what it is. I fear Honduras is becoming a dictatorship, but I hope I am wrong.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-29-2009, 09:29 AM
 
42,732 posts, read 29,808,044 times
Reputation: 14345
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
He asked the military for logistical assistance running the poll.

Again, they tossed him out because they wanted to seize power. The poll issue was just an excuse. The court nominated one of their own judges to occupy the office of the president. Come one now.

Also, they threw him out of the country, which is in violation of the unconstitutional. According to Honduran constitution no Honduran citizen can be thrown out of the country. So, these guys pretend to be the guardians of the constitution, when the truth is they trampled on the constitution on the very same day they said they were protecting it.

Well, it is what it is. I fear Honduras is becoming a dictatorship, but I hope I am wrong.
I think as well, that you have to consider what other things Zelaya did that caused the political powers to turn on Zelaya. The doctors he brought in to treat the poor, the other reforms he tried to implement that would help the poor in his country. People in our country often bemoan the growing divide between the wealthy and the not-wealthy in the United States. Honduras is an example of when that divide grows even more extreme. The people in the legislature, the people in the judiciary, are the wealthy people in Honduras. Zelaya's efforts at reform were strongly resisted by the wealthy.

He was breaking the law by his insistence on getting a poll to see if people were interested in amending the Constitution. The law in Honduras is that political movements have to come from the people. But the current power structure is so imbalanced, that it's virtually impossible for such political movements to start at a grassroots level. Which is exactly the way the people in power want things to be. That's not a democracy.

I don't think Zelaya was going about changing things in the right way. But he was the victim of a coup. And the point of the coup wasn't to put the current temporary President in power, it was to maintain control of the government by the people who are currently in control. The "democracy" in Honduras has been corrupted. The next election won't reflect the will of the people, it will reflect the will of the existing government. Honduras isn't on a path of a long-term democracy, it's on the path of an unstable society that will make it vulnerable to a military dictatorship. The instability is a danger to neighboring countries, and is one of the reasons those countries have been supportive of Zelaya. Because they fear the instability could spread, especially in a time when the entire global economy is so fragile.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 09-29-2009, 09:44 AM
 
Location: Florida
77,012 posts, read 47,481,489 times
Reputation: 14806
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC at the Ridge View Post
I don't think Zelaya was going about changing things in the right way. But he was the victim of a coup. And the point of the coup wasn't to put the current temporary President in power, it was to maintain control of the government by the people who are currently in control. The "democracy" in Honduras has been corrupted. The next election won't reflect the will of the people, it will reflect the will of the existing government. Honduras isn't on a path of a long-term democracy, it's on the path of an unstable society that will make it vulnerable to a military dictatorship. The instability is a danger to neighboring countries, and is one of the reasons those countries have been supportive of Zelaya. Because they fear the instability could spread, especially in a time when the entire global economy is so fragile.
The elections will put the opposition in power, and we will see another dictator in Honduras. That is my prediction. The coupies have already earned the condemnation of the entire free world (except the anti-Obama crowd in US), and I don't see how that is going to help the people of Honduras. Trade with Honduras will be reduced. The new dictator will probably do something even more stupid and the western world and the rest of central American will put sanctions on Honduras and the people will pay the price. There is nothing new about this. The only thing that is new, is that a large segment of Americans support the coup and sadly only because they want to oppose the US president in everything he does.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-29-2009, 12:14 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,956 posts, read 24,675,783 times
Reputation: 9728
I just heard on the news that the illegitimate new government of Honduras has sued Brazil before some international court for allowing Zelaya to remain in the Brazilian embassy, now, that is funny somehow
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-29-2009, 12:23 PM
 
Location: Dallas, TX
31,767 posts, read 28,767,183 times
Reputation: 12341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
I just heard on the news that the illegitimate new government of Honduras has sued Brazil before some international court for allowing Zelaya to remain in the Brazilian embassy, now, that is funny somehow
Well, the illegitimate and dictatorial government of Honduras is legitimate enough for some republican congressmen to defy a US policy against coup:

Republican Politicians in Honduras (http://www.boston.com/news/world/latinamerica/articles/2009/10/02/republicans_visit_honduras_despite_us_coup_policy/ - broken link)

Well, I've had the page bookmarked for a while. Only a matter of time, before these idiots are put in their rightful place, along with their sheeple.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-29-2009, 12:32 PM
 
20,421 posts, read 12,338,684 times
Reputation: 10207
Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW View Post
I wonder what or whose investment we are trying to protect in Honduras? Or is this just a preemptive strike against the spread of populist governments in South America?
If by "we" you mean the United States, you have some things wrong. Our wonderful President is backing Zelaya. Zelaya isnt a populist he is a communist dictator in the Hugo Chavez vein. The man was rightfully kicked out of office and it boggles the mind why Obama has sided with this rat at all.

The sitting president has stated he will not/cannot run for re-election as that is against their constitution. That is the reason why they ousted Zelaya.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 10-29-2009, 12:37 PM
 
20,421 posts, read 12,338,684 times
Reputation: 10207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber View Post
Right. So, when Zelaya said he wanted to run an opinon poll, they said he was trying to amed the constitution. Well, he was not. He wanted to run a poll. They used it as an excuse to toss him out. Get it?

You need to ask the right questions: Why did they do it in sush rush and under such silly excuse? Why didn't they do it if Zelaya had actually tried to run again? That would have been a clear violation. Why didn't they wait for him to actually try to amend the constitution? Because all they needed was some excuse, any excuse, and they found it in the fact that he wanted ro run the poll.
You dont think that his buddying up with Hugo Chavez had anything to do wiht the feeling in Honduras that led to his ouster?

Remember that members of Zelya's own party are supportive of the action.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:40 PM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top