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Celebrate all you want - in your home, in your private schools, in your churches - anyplace that is private property. Government-owned property is the wrong place for religious symbols.
agreed. however if this is the case then all religious symbols of any kind should not be on any government owned property. no holidays of any kind. Not in schools either, i believe they did take out christmas and thanksgiving and other holidays out of most schools, and call them fall parties -winter parties etc. and this is good for those who dont celebrate or are from another faith. imo. however i also believe that certain groups be kept out of our school system as well.
I'm sorry but this is an ignorant and stupid post. Christmas is imposed on our country more than any other holliday. I don't see schools closing for Ramadan, Diwali or Yom Kippur. I don't see Ramadan cartoons on television. I don't have a problem with this and Christmas is as much an American holliday that a person of any faith can celebrate. I love Christmas. That being said, I think it's quite ignorant and insensitive to accuse people of other faiths for putting down Christmas when the reality is they have tolerated it for decades. Try putting yourselves in their position. Imagine if you raise your child to be Buddhist, Hindu, Muslim or Jewish in a country that celebrates Christmas on a national scale. They almost have to buy a Christmas tree and provide their kids gifts just so they can fit in with the other kids.
My parents have bought me and my sister presents because we could fit in as well. My uncle on the other hand does not and his kids are always left out.
"Christmas" is a imposed and fraud holiday in my opinion.
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Originally Posted by dcsldcd
We all take notice that the cowardly liberals only attack Christian symbols. Try that crap with muslims.
What the hell are you blabbering about?
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Originally Posted by azriverfan.
I just know if large pictures of Ganesh were plastered on walls in downtown Phoenix during Diwali, I know a few Evangelical groups and good ole boys would have a problem with that and would probably protest violently: "Dayam, whad da heyell is this elephant dude with all these arms plastered all over ma city. These people can go back to Iraq or wherever theyre from"
Yes, I was talking about Mahabharat in class and some Christians got offended. But then went on to talk about Jesus. So it was all offensive when I talked about Mahabharata but not when he talk about Jesus?
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Originally Posted by AnUnidentifiedMale
The idea that there's a "war on Christmas" is brought to you by the same crowd that believes government-run health care leads to death panels and that Barack Obama is not really an American citizen.
The extreme right wing loonies.
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Originally Posted by USNRET04
As a Christian myself, technically there is nothing in the Bible that says anything about Christmas. It is a man made holiday.
It is believed from New Testament writings that Jesus was born sometime in the winter months. Man picked December 25.
No where does Jesus tell us to celebrate his birth. We are though instructed to remember his death, burial and resurection (BTW, there is no mention of Easter either).
The celebration of the life and death of Jesus is not meant to be only two days a year.
Yes, a man made holiday which was stolen from the Pagans. There is no proof or anything that leads us to believe that Jesus Christ was born on December 25th.
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Originally Posted by Randomdude
The only religious holiday recognized by the feds is Christmas Day. So in effect, Christianity is imposed on us all by the feds. We cannot bank on Christmas Day, we get no mail on Christmas Day, and basically the world shuts down for Christmas Day.
If a Jewish person wants to take off Yom Kippur, thats a vacation day from work, or an absence from school.
I agree. One hundred percent. I am an in the door atheist and my parents celebrate Diwali and such. We have to take the day off and consider it a PA day or sick day.
I do firmly believe the government should NOT recognize "Christmas".
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Originally Posted by natalayjones
Good post...I was always taught that the days we celebrate Christmas and Easter were picked by man. The whole thread probably belongs in the religious forums
They were picked by man and stolen from Pagans.
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Originally Posted by Peggy Anne
I don't like when the Pagans are criticized by the christians for celebrating Solstice. The Holiday season goes beyond Dec 25th, and who knows if JC was even born then ? Whatever. I say enjoy the holidays, live, and let live.
Which is very ironic because Christians are celebrating the Winter Solstice pretty much since "Christmas" was stolen from the Winter Solstice.
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Originally Posted by Randomstudent
What if there are celebrants who are not Christian? Pagans have been celebrating Yule Dec. 21-23 for centuries before Jesus was even born and the entire idea of a Christmas (Yule) tree comes from Paganism. In our case there really is no hypocrisy, there just the simple fact that early Christians decided it would be easier to convert us if they meshed their holidays with ours.
Exactly. Imagine if Muslims came along and tried to mesh their holiday with "Christmas". I know many Christians would be offended. Mainly everything that comes with the "Christmas" specials involved Pagan and Wiccan things.
Early Christians just wanted everyone to convert so the stole the holidays.
I'm already seeing the 'Keep the Christ in Christmas' magnets on cars in my area. I will not be celebrating Christmas, but will be celebrating the Solstice with my crazy Pagan uncle and his circle.
Whenever I see someone who has the whole "Keep the Christ in Christmas" sticker, I roll my eyes and wish to tell them to look up the origins of "Christmas".
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Originally Posted by natalayjones
I actually remember this when I working retail in high school (late 90's - early 2000's - wow that was almost 10 years ago...maybe I'm not as young as I thought ) and we had meetings reminding us to NEVER say "merry christmas" even if the customer says it to you...we had to say "happy holidays"
I fail to see how this offends some Christians. Saying "Happy Holidays" also includes "Christmas" as well.
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Originally Posted by roysoldboy
What was wrong with Christmas Break like it was for the whole 20 years I went to school and the 28 that I taught? The PC cadre got hold of it and they just had to see that kind of thing as nasty because it might hurt the feelings of Muslims, Jews, or atheists. All those years it worked and then PC got here.
What us wrong with Winter recess? Schools are closed for a week not just "Christmas".
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Originally Posted by sailordave
OK, I'm offended by Black History month and MLK day. Keep your holiday to yourselves. The second it starts getting in my face then it becomes a problem.
None of those holidays are religious.
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Originally Posted by Mike from back east
Black History Month and MLK day are NOT religious holidays, don't confuse the issue. If these two bother you, then you should be equally offended by ST. Patrick's Day and Columbus Day. But it seems only BLACK celebrations bother you. Why is that?
Agreed.
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Originally Posted by Atilla
Why do you say that. Aren't you the guy that likes to celebrate gay pride. That is in fact your own personal form of religion isn't it? You stay in the closet and we will stay in the churches.
You athiests, morally bankrupt and spiritually dead. Leave Christians alone. Teach your own children your zombie ways. Leave Christians alone.
When the devil is saved there will be no jobs for the preachers. Until then, bring baby jesus to the town square and praise him on high. Merry Christmas, Merry Christmas and joy to the world. If the athiests and gays can sing gay to the world, we should be able to sing joy to the world.
God bless baby Jesus and God bless America and free her from the shackles of athiestic self destruction.
Christians are left alone. I don't know what you are talking about. Atheists are morally bankrupt? How do you know? Zombie ways? For real?
Atheistic self destruction? LOL
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Originally Posted by Mike from back east
I really hope that it's not anti-christian vandalism, that would be sad. Seems that no matter what anyone puts out, including halloween stuff, it gets smacked around by young fools.
Yes. Vandalism on Christian religions symbols is NOT cool. And that goes for any religion.
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Originally Posted by sailordave
It's not the holiday they object to, it's the religion they object to.
Wrong again. It is the holiday I object too since it was stolen from the Pagans. The religion I have no problem with whatsoever.
Please post all anti-Christmas conduct and hate on this thread.
It's starting:
Why can't non-Christians just let the Christians have their holiday in peace? Why do so many people have hate? Does anyone make demands of Jews on Yom Kippur? Muslims on Ramadan?
Memo to bigots: Let us celebrate our holiday. Christmas involves Jesus Christ by definition.
Speaking as an atheist, you can celebrate holiday any way you want. It matters NOT too me but read up on your historical facts, most of what we celebrate comes from pagan celebrations NOT christianity. Use your favorite search engine and put in the words origins and christmas, it will be eye opening for you. Do the same for easter as well.
Why do you say that. Aren't you the guy that likes to celebrate gay pride. That is in fact your own personal form of religion isn't it? You stay in the closet and we will stay in the churches.
You athiests, morally bankrupt and spiritually dead. Leave Christians alone. Teach your own children your zombie ways. Leave Christians alone.
When the devil is saved there will be no jobs for the preachers. Until then, bring baby jesus to the town square and praise him on high. Merry Christmas, Merry Christmas and joy to the world. If the athiests and gays can sing gay to the world, we should be able to sing joy to the world.
God bless baby Jesus and God bless America and free her from the shackles of athiestic self destruction.
Fact, Athiests make up a disproportionatly small number of people in the US prison system. Combined, Athiests make up less than one percent of the prison population (0.2%).
So I would think your "morally bankrupt" comments if I were you.
And considering the thousands of churches and websites, hundreds of Christian publications, tens of TV and radio channels, and the compelete and utter lack of any laws impinging on your right to be a Christian and worship as a Christian, you might want to rethink your "Leave Christians Alone" statement to, considering you are advocating pushing your relgiion onto everyone else.
In this Nation, you simply have NO right to impose your religion onto each and every other citizen through our government and laws.
BTW, mind supplying a definitional source showing "gay" is a religion? I would really like to see that one.
I'm sorry but this is an ignorant and stupid post. Christmas is imposed on our country more than any other holliday. I don't see schools closing for Ramadan, Diwali or Yom Kippur.
In post #132, I was simply responding that I knew schools were closing for Jewish Holidays.
I understand the confusion now. I should have been more specific. Perhaps I didn't clarify it well enough but that statement meant "I don't see a generally accepted tradition of schools closing for Ramadan, Diwali or Yom Kippur in the United States" I wasn't intending to state that no school in existence ever closed for a Jewish holiday. I knew some schools made exceptions but I was responding to the OP who I personally felt made a ridiculous point since non-Christians if any could cite their religions have been attacked.
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The rest of my posts have been in response to your subsequent posts. I never felt that we were that far off, which is why I wrote that I thought you were misreading my posts.
I don't have first hand knowledge on the other situations. I do know that at the company I work for the Hindu employees are not expected to work during Diwali.
I think we agree. I don't want to deny anyone their holiday. I'm not offended by Christians celebrating Christmas or even imposing their holiday on non-Christians. What offends me is that Christians have a double standard and will often not show the same tolerance toward other faiths. Well, I should preface this. Liberal Christians particularly non-Evangelicals are tolerant but in the South and Evangelical pockets outside the South show little tolerance toward other faiths.
What is really amusing and unfortunate is how our society doesn't acknowledge our true belief system.. agnosticism. I bet if you did a survey, the majority of Americans would acknowledge they are spiritual and that they believe in a higher power but are not truly religious with regard to their beliefs regardless if they technically attend a church or temple. Most of the Christians I know do not think people of other faiths are going to hell. Likewise, the same applies to Hindus, Muslims, Jews etc. The only people who I know that are truly religious are fundamentalists regardless of their faith. People don't like to use the word agnostic because it sounds too much like aetheist but the truth is they are agnostic.
Dec. 25th is a Federal Holiday, not a National Holiday. It is was also first enacted in 1870...
The initial enactment also applied only to federal workers in Washington, DC. The holiday was not established for federal workers elsewhere until 1885. The history of Christmas in this country generally parallels and is about as old as that of baseball.
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Originally Posted by AxisMundi
Claiming that Christmas being a Federal Holiday indicates some inherent "Christian" nature of this Nation is akin to attempting to use our current Motto and Pledge. All three were put in place well after the last of our Founders were dust.
The last signer of the Declaration of Independence to die was Charles Carroll of Maryland. He died on November 14, 1832 at the age of 95. The last delegate to the Constitutional Convention of 1787 to die was perhaps its most important -- James Madison of Virginia. He died on June 28, 1836, at the age of 85.
None of the founders would find anything that was familiar to them in a present day celebration of Christmas. And the history of Christmas of course long predates that of the current Motto and Pledge, each of which was a hysterical reaction to the Red Scare of the 1950's.
I suspect when Jesus comes calling, it will be a bit more significant than about who is on someone else's cross.
I suspect that when Jesus comes calling, whoever is telling me about it will be making it up. His contemporary followers were of the conviction that Jesus would be calling again within their lifetimes. If the message had been "I'll be back! But you've got at least 2,000 years to get ready." things might have gone a bit differently...
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) and we had meetings reminding us to NEVER say "merry christmas" even if the customer says it to you...we had to say "happy holidays"
