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Old 10-27-2009, 12:19 PM
 
Location: Southern Oregon
3,040 posts, read 5,001,605 times
Reputation: 3422

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
PurpleLove08, that US News article is dynamite!

Terryj, what is the difference between a VAT tax and a GST tax? I've experienced the GST in Canada.

The difference between a VAT and a GST. VAT taxes the manufacture at different periods in production depending on the value added to the product, but these additional cost will be habded down to the consumer. A GST taxes the end product upon sale of the product.

Under a VAT system we could see the cost of goods climb higher and higher and this cost is pasted down to the individual, this could cause goods produced to slow way down, unable to sale the product do to higher cost. These taxes could drive the cost of a car from 25,000 to 30,000, it all depends on what the congress think is VALUE. I think that Nancy even thinks that air in the tire has some value.

Under a GST prices for the manufacture would not go up, due to the tax only being applied on the sale of the end product. A car may sale for 25,000 and you pay the GST on 25,000

 
Old 10-27-2009, 07:55 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,759,995 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terryj View Post
The difference between a VAT and a GST. VAT taxes the manufacture at different periods in production depending on the value added to the product, but these additional cost will be habded down to the consumer. A GST taxes the end product upon sale of the product.

Under a VAT system we could see the cost of goods climb higher and higher and this cost is pasted down to the individual, this could cause goods produced to slow way down, unable to sale the product do to higher cost. These taxes could drive the cost of a car from 25,000 to 30,000, it all depends on what the congress think is VALUE. I think that Nancy even thinks that air in the tire has some value.

Under a GST prices for the manufacture would not go up, due to the tax only being applied on the sale of the end product. A car may sale for 25,000 and you pay the GST on 25,000
Thank you very much. That was very informative.
 
Old 10-27-2009, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Illinois Delta
5,767 posts, read 5,015,185 times
Reputation: 2063
Quote:
Originally Posted by PurpleLove08 View Post
WATCH MONEY-DRIVEN MEDICINE - HERE (http://www.moneydrivenmedicine.org/watch-in/watch-now - broken link)

The book is even better.
I recommend it for anyone, right or left of the center.
************************************************** *******
The surgeon is right...health care has become a business, and some entities do not function well under that paradigm. The same push has been made to turn education into a business, and it hasn't worked well either. Both were part of a classical liberal arts education based on the Roman model of education, and they are exactly that: arts. And since I can feel knees jerking, the word "liberal" is used in its original context: broad-minded, inquisitive, and free to pursue new discoveries.
The last job I had in health care, our surgical floor alone pulled in $250,000 per month; now a single coronary bypass can cost that much.
It was a corporation hospital, and the closest alternative was 60 miles
away...not much choice in terms of jobs. It has been gratifying to see the wage increase for nurses...long overdue.
 
Old 10-27-2009, 08:38 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 14,787,921 times
Reputation: 3550
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evenstar51 View Post
************************************************** *******
The surgeon is right...health care has become a business, and some entities do not function well under that paradigm. The same push has been made to turn education into a business, and it hasn't worked well either. Both were part of a classical liberal arts education based on the Roman model of education, and they are exactly that: arts. And since I can feel knees jerking, the word "liberal" is used in its original context: broad-minded, inquisitive, and free to pursue new discoveries.
The last job I had in health care, our surgical floor alone pulled in $250,000 per month; now a single coronary bypass can cost that much.
It was a corporation hospital, and the closest alternative was 60 miles
away...not much choice in terms of jobs. It has been gratifying to see the wage increase for nurses...long overdue.
When I read the book, I was pretty disgusted.
Doctors and nurses demanding money up front when a man's mouth was bleeding and he could barely talk. [He had been beaten up]

What happened to the Hippocratic Oath?

Were they really going to be THAT hard up for the money?
 
Old 10-27-2009, 08:55 PM
 
Location: Illinois Delta
5,767 posts, read 5,015,185 times
Reputation: 2063
Quote:
Originally Posted by PurpleLove08 View Post
When I read the book, I was pretty disgusted.
Doctors and nurses demanding money up front when a man's mouth was bleeding and he could barely talk. [He had been beaten up]

What happened to the Hippocratic Oath?

Were they really going to be THAT hard up for the money?
************************************************** *********
They were, and are, raking it in. The job I mentioned? It was $5 for a box of Kleenex. A sanitary napkin? $1.25 each! I was flabbergasted at the astronomical mark-up. I had a patient who developed an infection after giving birth...her baby was in the nursery and she couldn't visit it. I walked into her room to hang a new IV bag and she was struggling to get
out of the hospital gown, IV, etc. She was sobbing, and finally told me that the business office had just called her and wanted to know when she planned to begin making payments. I was in that office so darn fast, asking who'd called. One women said she'd done it, and I told her she'd
better check and be sure she wasn't calling one of my patients in a similar
situation in the future. I got applause from the people waiting there, and
the OB-GYN told administration that he wasn't happy about it himself. It's
a disgrace that people are treated so poorly; being run as a business puts
the hospital on the assembly-line model...keep 'em comin'!
 
Old 10-27-2009, 09:01 PM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 14,787,921 times
Reputation: 3550
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evenstar51 View Post
************************************************** *********
They were, and are, raking it in. The job I mentioned? It was $5 for a box of Kleenex. A sanitary napkin? $1.25 each! I was flabbergasted at the astronomical mark-up. I had a patient who developed an infection after giving birth...her baby was in the nursery and she couldn't visit it. I walked into her room to hang a new IV bag and she was struggling to get
out of the hospital gown, IV, etc. She was sobbing, and finally told me that the business office had just called her and wanted to know when she planned to begin making payments. I was in that office so darn fast, asking who'd called. One women said she'd done it, and I told her she'd
better check and be sure she wasn't calling one of my patients in a similar
situation in the future. I got applause from the people waiting there, and
the OB-GYN told administration that he wasn't happy about it himself. It's
a disgrace that people are treated so poorly; being run as a business puts
the hospital on the assembly-line model...keep 'em comin'!
Yeah the author who wrote Money Driven Medicine said many doctors don't like the current system. They feel powerless.

Some don't care if their pay goes down in a new system, they just want to be able to practice medicine and care for their patients without their being this middle man in the room.

As the doc in the video said, "The insurance companies are always in the room with you."

I still can't believe they called her and asked her that. Could they not wait until a week after she left or something. Good grief.
 
Old 10-27-2009, 09:29 PM
 
Location: Illinois Delta
5,767 posts, read 5,015,185 times
Reputation: 2063
Quote:
Originally Posted by PurpleLove08 View Post
Yeah the author who wrote Money Driven Medicine said many doctors don't like the current system. They feel powerless.

Some don't care if their pay goes down in a new system, they just want to be able to practice medicine and care for their patients without their being this middle man in the room.

As the doc in the video said, "The insurance companies are always in the room with you."

I still can't believe they called her and asked her that. Could they not wait until a week after she left or something. Good grief.
************************************************** ********
They have no shame. As if she wasn't stressed out anyway! That was a Hospital Corporation of America facility, BTW...started by the Frist family.
 
Old 10-28-2009, 06:25 AM
 
Location: between Ath,GR & Mia,FL...
2,574 posts, read 2,488,111 times
Reputation: 327
Hippocratic oath is ancient history...

BTW,in anc Greece ( & Rome ) ,all healthcare was private...
 
Old 10-28-2009, 08:56 AM
 
Location: Chicago, IL
8,998 posts, read 14,787,921 times
Reputation: 3550
Quote:
Originally Posted by harrymiafl View Post
Hippocratic oath is ancient history...

BTW,in anc Greece ( & Rome ) ,all healthcare was private...
As far as I know, every doctor has to take the Hippocratic oath.

Health care in many countries is private, it's just public funds are used in other developed nations to pay for private care. There is nothing wrong with that.
 
Old 10-28-2009, 09:39 AM
 
Location: Pinal County, Arizona
25,100 posts, read 39,261,360 times
Reputation: 4937
Taking the Hippocratic Oath does not equate to Physicians having to work for free.
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