Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The technical definition of terrorism that emerged from the 70s to now is that it is an act of random violence against a group of civilians; this definition is strict in order to distinguish acts of terrorism from acts of war. Since this happened on a base, I'm not sure it qualifies as terrorism. In a posting the other day on this thread, I said that if this doesn't qualify as a "going postal" type of crime, than maybe it actually is its own category. In that case, we'd have to make arguments about what to call it. I still think it falls into the "going postal" category even if religious beliefs had something to do with the crime--religion is not a part of the definition of terrorism. I think it is more similar to someone snapping at their workplace than it is similar to anything else.
Random act, like going postal???
This was no random act for Major Hasan, he planned his attack. This was not some act of revenge by a frustrated former employee over losing his job. He chose the place and time to murder as many soldiers as possible, in order to aid the Muslim fighters in Afghanistan, in the name of Islam.
Just because he does not wear white robes or attend al Quaeda meetings, does not mean his attack was any less a terrorist attack then the pieces of crap that murder women and children, and blow up truck bombs in Iraq, Afghanistan or New York City.
The "random" part of any of this was in who got killed. Just as long as he could kill as many soldiers as possible, it did not matter if a pregnant women and her baby died that day. "God is great!!"
Location: The Land Mass Between NOLA and Mobile, AL
1,796 posts, read 1,662,111 times
Reputation: 1411
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha
Random act, like going postal???
This was no random act for Major Hasan, he planned his attack. This was not some act of revenge by a frustrated former employee over losing his job. He chose the place and time to murder as many soldiers as possible, in order to aid the Muslim fighters in Afghanistan, in the name of Islam.
Just because he does not wear white robes or attend al Quaeda meetings, does not mean his attack was any less a terrorist attack then the pieces of crap that murder women and children, and blow up truck bombs in Iraq, Afghanistan or New York City.
The "random" part of any of this was in who got killed. Just as long as he could kill as many soldiers as possible, it did not matter if a pregnant women and her baby died that day. "God is great!!"
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, I'm just saying that if we call this guy a terrorist, then we have to call the people who target abortion doctors terrorists, too. I'm saying this is random because I have not seen any evidence that this guy on Thursday did anything different from what the guy in FL did on Friday. They both went into their places of work and began shooting people. Both are equally tragic. The fact that the Thursday shooter may have said God is great in Arabic doesn't seem to me to be a defining quality. Does that really matter? Do the family members of the Ft. Hood victims experience their grief in a fundamentally different way than the families of the Florida shooting victims? I would bet not, though I could be wrong.
This is what I imagine in either case. A cop pulls up and parks on my street. He or she knocks on my door. I open it. He or she tells me that the unthinkable has happened. My loved one--husband, son, daughter, sister, wife--is gone, and I never got the chance to say goodbye. Let's just say, for the sake of argument, that the person who was erased was my lover. What I'm left thinking about, right then in that moment as I try to absorb the enormity of what has happened along with the fact that my life will never be the same, is that I will never, ever, feel that person's warm skin again. It may have been true that last night he warmed some oil in his hands and then lovingly rubbed my back with it, but that is never, ever going to happen again. That is the experiential reality I am left with. At that point, I could care less what the person's motives are who stole my love, my life, from me.
It is with this in mind, this thoughtful appreciation of other people's suffering, that I am trying to talk to people about their definitions of terrorism. If religious motivations count in one case, then they must count in all cases. I am willing to go there just so long as the definition is applied uniformly. If we agree that religious motivations are a criterion in our shared definition of what constitutes terrorism, then we also must agree that that same definition must apply to people who shoot up abortion clinics, or to people that bomb four little black girls out of a baptist church, for that matter. Solytaire and I have been talking and basically agreeing about these things for several days. Since Thursday, actually, Solytaire and I have been having this discussion. It just seems to me that other people here, and I don't mean everyone, haven't been entirely honest about what they are talking about when they talk about terrorism. It seems to me that some people want to call acts of violence that are committed by Muslims one thing while calling acts of violence committed by Christians or atheists another thing. *That* is the thing that I am arguing against, and I think, though I don't know for sure, that Solytaire would agree with me on that. I'll wait to hear from Solytaire him or herself. (Sorry Soly, don't know if you're a boy or a girl ).
Where to start first in dealing with your inaccuratcies?
First this police officer was protecting no one from a burglar.
I think it's good to tell people not to jump to conclusions, that's how people make asses of themselves when have you witnessed positive outcomes when people jump to conclusions?
The President mis-spoke I hope he has learned from it.
Speaking of jumping to conclusions and asses exactly at what point did you jump to the conclusion that Gates was hysterical or uncooperative?
Your post seems a bit hysterical, meds up to date?
Gates was hysterical and extremely uncooperative. He was looking for a fight. This neighborhood had experienced many burglaries, including break-ins to the very house at which the police arrived. The president mis-spoke, and his only reaction was, "lets have a beer together, so I can join forces with Gates one on one and confront you in person." Regardless, weather the incident is reported from the point of view of the witness next door who saw the incident, or from Gates himself, Gates along with B. Hussein were at fault. B. Hussein had no business in the matter in the first place, he should be focused on the issues a president should be focused on.
I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you, I'm just saying that if we call this guy a terrorist, then we have to call the people who target abortion doctors terrorists, too. I'm saying this is random because I have not seen any evidence that this guy on Thursday did anything different from what the guy in FL did on Friday. They both went into their places of work and began shooting people. Both are equally tragic. The fact that the Thursday shooter may have said God is great in Arabic doesn't seem to me to be a defining quality. Does that really matter? Do the family members of the Ft. Hood victims experience their grief in a fundamentally different way than the families of the Florida shooting victims? I would bet not, though I could be wrong.
This is what I imagine in either case. A cop pulls up and parks on my street. He or she knocks on my door. I open it. He or she tells me that the unthinkable has happened. My loved one--husband, son, daughter, sister, wife--is gone, and I never got the chance to say goodbye. Let's just say, for the sake of argument, that the person who was erased was my lover. What I'm left thinking about, right then in that moment as I try to absorb the enormity of what has happened along with the fact that my life will never be the same, is that I will never, ever, feel that person's warm skin again. It may have been true that last night he warmed some oil in his hands and then lovingly rubbed my back with it, but that is never, ever going to happen again. That is the experiential reality I am left with. At that point, I could care less what the person's motives are who stole my love, my life, from me.
It is with this in mind, this thoughtful appreciation of other people's suffering, that I am trying to talk to people about their definitions of terrorism. If religious motivations count in one case, then they must count in all cases. I am willing to go there just so long as the definition is applied uniformly. If we agree that religious motivations are a criterion in our shared definition of what constitutes terrorism, then we also must agree that that same definition must apply to people who shoot up abortion clinics, or to people that bomb four little black girls out of a baptist church, for that matter. Solytaire and I have been talking and basically agreeing about these things for several days. Since Thursday, actually, Solytaire and I have been having this discussion. It just seems to me that other people here, and I don't mean everyone, haven't been entirely honest about what they are talking about when they talk about terrorism. It seems to me that some people want to call acts of violence that are committed by Muslims one thing while calling acts of violence committed by Christians or atheists another thing. *That* is the thing that I am arguing against, and I think, though I don't know for sure, that Solytaire would agree with me on that. I'll wait to hear from Solytaire him or herself. (Sorry Soly, don't know if you're a boy or a girl ).
Oh I agree with every bit of it. It sounds only logical. How anyone possibly dispute the fact that terrorism is terrorism is beyond me. And I am a proponent of applying our definitions of what is or is not a terrorist universally and indiscriminately. And because I think the motives behind terrorist attacks are absolutely fundamental to the definition of terrorism, if not the defining aspect of terrorism, then I find it perfectly rational to factor whether ideology, (be it political or religious) into the classification of what is terrorism and what isnt.
And may we let the record show --- that I am in fact a male..lol
We don't know if there were attempts and I'm sure we will know eventually.
One unarmed soldier logically cannot take down an armed man, however; if there were 300 soldiers in that room and, all are field ready to deploy to Iraq, one would think training would kick in at some point. Two of the Army's mottos; "Always prepared" and "Ready for Anything" stick in my mind. Again, I am not being insensitive, just a bit troubled over the odds of 1 against 300. Thanx for replying to my post.
oh good grief
these 300 soliders were at home and do not carry weapons
they were ambushed by this scumb bag
and many ran into the range of fire to help their buddies
many were wounded and still helped
our military are the bravest of the brave and this ass hole did all he could to kill as many as he could
There are actually people attempting to, it seems to me, justify this "Major's" actions. This is a sad, sad, state of affairs to show what this country is becoming. In the name of "Political Correctness" this killer was allowed to stay in the military even AFTER he began his anti-American diatribes. We wouldn't want to "offend" CAIR and these other level headed, even handed, political hate groups. What the hell is going on??? Someone is to blame in addition to this fanatical lunatic....the military who knew, the FBI who has been investigating for 6 months......someone should have done something........His cousin who keeps being interviewed all over the place was "SO CLOSE" to him that he hadn't spoken to him in over FIVE months and was not even aware he was scheduled to be deployed!!!! I do have empathy for the family, but I can't believe anything they are saying because it is contrary to things the "Major" has posted, stated, and now acted upon!!! Facts are facts......
oh good grief
these 300 soliders were at home and do not carry weapons
they were ambushed by this scumb bag
and many ran into the range of fire to help their buddies
many were wounded and still helped
our military are the bravest of the brave and this ass hole did all he could to kill as many as he could
All of them were brave except for one gutless coward terrorist.
There should armed MP all over every single military base in America and if anyone like this scumbag walks in in white clothing take them down in seconds period, no questions asked.
Time for a change, arm our troops (MP's) at all military bases so this wont happen like this again.
Lets see if ObamAcorn finally makes a good decision and arms the military to protect us against the enemy within.
All of them were brave except for one gutless coward terrorist.
There should armed MP all over every single military base in America and if anyone like this scumbag walks in in white clothing take them down in seconds period, no questions asked.
Time for a change, arm our troops (MP's) at all military bases so this wont happen like this again.
Lets see if ObamAcorn finally makes a good decision and arms the military to protect us against the enemy within.
And their training effectively keeps them from acting outside their training.
Group lobotomy.
Then, there was the shock effect of the shooter's possibly casual actions - by the time 10 soldiers said WTF, they were dead.
Sgt. Munley, on the other hand, acted as an individual, instinctually to the situation, bypassing her "training protocols".
She acted more as a warrior than a soldier. Kool!
Too bad she wasn't at Columbine. She might have fatally wounded Michael Moore's movie.
I'm glad she bypassed the rules of engagement.
if these men and women had been armed that son of a ***** would have had about a hundred holes in his sorry ass instead of 13 dead
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
).
when have you witnessed positive outcomes when people jump to conclusions?
