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Old 11-12-2009, 01:27 PM
 
Location: OB
2,404 posts, read 3,946,937 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
Kamakazi's back in WWII were not considered "terrorists" then or now.
I am glad we finally agree pad. Islamic Fundamentalists are the enemy.

Last edited by mossomo; 11-12-2009 at 01:37 PM..
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:27 PM
 
Location: Sango, TN
24,868 posts, read 24,377,473 times
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Some psychos just kill people.

My definition of terrorism is an elaborate attack, planned out by multiple individuals.

Hassan may have contacted others, but he planned this on his own. Just another psycho killing innocent people.
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:30 PM
 
20,454 posts, read 12,373,731 times
Reputation: 10250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Some psychos just kill people.

My definition of terrorism is an elaborate attack, planned out by multiple individuals.

Hassan may have contacted others, but he planned this on his own. Just another psycho killing innocent people.
So you arent even willing to admit that his action was based on his understanding of Islam?
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:31 PM
 
13,186 posts, read 14,972,499 times
Reputation: 4555
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Some psychos just kill people.

My definition of terrorism is an elaborate attack, planned out by multiple individuals.

Hassan may have contacted others, but he planned this on his own. Just another psycho killing innocent people.
So the US invasion of Iraq was a terrorist attack going by your definition?
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:35 PM
 
Location: Southcentral Kansas
44,882 posts, read 33,253,825 times
Reputation: 4269
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Some psychos just kill people.

My definition of terrorism is an elaborate attack, planned out by multiple individuals.

Hassan may have contacted others, but he planned this on his own. Just another psycho killing innocent people.
How elaborate are the human bomb attacks of Palestinians in Israeli restaurants or any other places where people gather? Someone gives them the explosives and the harness to carry them and puts their finger on the detonator, I guess, but he still pulls the trigger. Hasan had been listening to a militant imam and had been in contact with, or tried to contact, al Qaeda people. I don't know who told him how to do it or when to do it and I don't know that anyone else told him when. I do know that his finger pulled the trigger, he reloaded and started firing again at least three times. He just did the same thing that the bomber does when he "pulls the trigger". One is considered a terrorist and the other is considered crazy. That is Pelosi.
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:35 PM
 
13,186 posts, read 14,972,499 times
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If what Hasan did was Muslim "terrorism".

Then what this guy did was Christian "terrorism".

To argue otherwise is a double standard.

Tennessee Church Gunman Hoped Attack Would Provoke More Like It - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:36 PM
 
42,732 posts, read 29,861,612 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roysoldboy View Post
My point is that we consider those who strap on explosives and kill everything around them to be terrorists. Yet so many want to defend this man who didn't use the "normal" terrorist method and so many are wanting him to be the real victim here. It is the choice of killing weapon that is causing so many people to want to NOT consider him a terrorist.
This is something that has been repeated over and over. Somehow, someone on the right thinks that unless people call this man a terrorist, then they are making him the victim. That's illogical.

He's a murderer. Not a victim. He might be a terrorist, but we don't know.

Why don't we know, because we don't yet know what his motivation was.

Terrorism is about coercion. It's violence with a political agenda. The threat isn't in the violence itself (which of course is tragic), but in the understanding that such violence will continue unless the people being attacked modify their behavior in some way.

We generally equate terrorists with attacks on civilians, but in this case the attack was on soldiers. However, unarmed soldiers far away from the battlefield and more in a civilian position than a combat situation.

IF Hasan opened fire to further a political agenda, if he hoped his attack would persuade authorities to change its behavior, say to withdraw from Afghanistan, then it might meet the standard that he was trying to coerce the US Government and was therefore an act of terrorism.

If, however, Hasan opened fire to vent his personal anger, his personal frustration, even to indulge his personal religious beliefs, then it fails to be an act of terrorism.
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:38 PM
 
199 posts, read 216,648 times
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Quote:

ter⋅ror⋅ism

 /ˈtɛrəˌrɪzəm/ show spelled pronunciation [ter-uh-riz-uhm] show ipa use terrorism in a sentence

see web results for terrorism

see images of terrorism

–noun 1. The use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, esp. For political purposes.
2. The state of fear and submission produced by terrorism or terrorization.
3. A terroristic method of governing or of resisting a government.
By this definition, Hasan was not a terrorist, he was a psychopath.

However, this definition can be applied to America quite nicely. Here's a long list to back it up.

Quote:
Argentina - 1890 - Troops sent to Buenos Aires to protect business interests.

Chile - 1891 - Marines sent to Chile and clashed with nationalist rebels.

Haiti - 1891 - American troops suppress a revolt by Black workers on United States-claimed Navassa Island.

Hawaii - 1893 - Navy sent to Hawaii to overthrow the independent kingdom - Hawaii annexed by the United States.

Nicaragua - 1894 - Troops occupied Bluefields, a city on the Caribbean Sea, for a month.

China - 1894-95 - Navy, Army, and Marines landed during the Sino-Japanese War.

Korea - 1894-96 - Troops kept in Seoul during the war.

Panama - 1895 - Army, Navy, and Marines landed in the port city of Corinto.

China - 1894-1900 - Troops occupied China during the Boxer Rebellion.

Philippines - 1898-1910 - Navy and Army troops landed after the Philippines fell during the Spanish-American War; 600,000 Filipinos were killed.

Cuba - 1898-1902 - Troops seized Cuba in the Spanish-American War; the United States still maintains troops at Guantanamo Bay today.

Puerto Rico - 1898 - present - Troops seized Puerto Rico in the Spanish-American War and still occupy Puerto Rico today.

Nicaragua - 1898 - Marines landed at the port of San Juan del Sur.

Samoa - 1899 - Troops landed as a result over the battle for succession to the throne.

Panama - 1901-14 - Navy supported the revolution when Panama claimed independence from Colombia. American troops have occupied the Canal Zone since 1901 when construction for the canal began.

Honduras - 1903 - Marines landed to intervene during a revolution.

Dominican Rep 1903-04 - Troops landed to protect American interests during a revolution.

Korea - 1904-05 - Marines landed during the Russo-Japanese War.

Cuba - 1906-09 - Troops landed during an election.

Nicaragua - 1907 - Troops landed and a protectorate was set up.

Honduras - 1907 - Marines landed during Honduras’ war with Nicaragua.

Panama - 1908 - Marines sent in during Panama’s election.

Nicaragua - 1910 - Marines landed for a second time in Bluefields and Corinto.

Honduras - 1911 - Troops sent in to protect American interests during Honduras’ civil war.

China - 1911-41 - Navy and troops sent to China during continuous flare-ups.

Cuba - 1912 - Troops sent in to protect American interests in Havana.

Panama - 1912 - Marines landed during Panama’s election.

Honduras - 1912 - Troops sent in to protect American interests.

Nicaragua - 1912-33 - Troops occupied Nicaragua and fought guerrillas during its 20-year civil war.

Mexico - 1913 - Navy evacuated Americans during revolution.

Dominican Rep 1914 - Navy fought with rebels over Santo Domingo.

Mexico - 1914-18 - Navy and troops sent in to intervene against nationalists.

Haiti - 1914-34 - Troops occupied Haiti after a revolution and occupied Haiti for 19 years.

Dominican Rep 1916-24 - Marines occupied the Dominican Republic for eight years.

Cuba - 1917-33 - Troops landed and occupied Cuba for 16 years; Cuba became an economic protectorate.

World War I - 1917-18 - Navy and Army sent to Europe to fight the Axis powers.

Russia - 1918-22 - Navy and troops sent to eastern Russia after the Bolshevik Revolution; Army made five landings.

Honduras - 1919 - Marines sent during Honduras’ national elections.

Guatemala - 1920 - Troops occupied Guatemala for two weeks during a union strike.

Turkey - 1922 - Troops fought nationalists in Smyrna.

China - 1922-27 - Navy and Army troops deployed during a nationalist revolt.

Honduras - 1924-25 - Troops landed twice during a national election.

Panama - 1925 - Troops sent in to put down a general strike.

China - 1927-34 - Marines sent in and stationed for seven years throughout China.

El Salvador - 1932 - Naval warships deployed during the FMLN revolt under Marti.

World War II - 1941-45 - Military fought the Axis powers: Japan, Germany, and Italy.

Yugoslavia - 1946 - Navy deployed off the coast of Yugoslavia in response to the downing of an American plane.

Uruguay - 1947 - Bombers deployed as a show of military force.

Greece - 1947-49 - United States operations insured a victory for the far right in national “elections.”

Germany - 1948 - Military deployed in response to the Berlin blockade; the Berlin airlift lasts 444 days.

Philippines - 1948-54 - The CIA directed a civil war against the Filipino Huk revolt.

Puerto Rico - 1950 - Military helped crush an independence rebellion in Ponce.

Korean War - 1951-53 - Military sent in during the war.

Iran - 1953 - The CIA orchestrated the overthrow of democratically elected Mossadegh and restored the Shah to power.

Vietnam - 1954 - The United States offered weapons to the French in the battle against Ho Chi Minh and the Viet Minh.

Guatemala - 1954 - The CIA overthrew the democratically elected Arbenz and placed Colonel Armas in power.

Egypt - 1956 - Marines deployed to evacuate foreigners after Nasser nationalized the Suez Canal.

Lebanon - 1958 - Navy supported an Army occupation of Lebanon during its civil war.

Panama - 1958 - Troops landed after Panamanians demonstrations threatened the Canal Zone.

Vietnam - 1950s-75 - Vietnam War.

Cuba - 1961 - The CIA-directed Bay of Pigs invasions failed to overthrow the Castro government.

Cuba - 1962 - The Navy quarantines Cuba during the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Laos - 1962 - Military occupied Laos during its civil war against the Pathet Lao guerrillas.

Panama - 1964 - Troops sent in and Panamanians shot while protesting the United States presence in the Canal Zone.

Indonesia - 1965 - The CIA orchestrated a military coup.

Dominican Rep- 1965-66 - Troops deployed during a national election.

Guatemala - 1966-67 - Green Berets sent in.

Cambodia - 1969-75 - Military sent in after the Vietnam War expanded into Cambodia.

Oman - 1970 - Marines landed to direct a possible invasion into Iran.

Laos - 1971-75 - Americans carpet-bomb the countryside during Laos’ civil war.

Chile - 1973 - The CIA orchestrated a coup, killing President Allende who had been popularly elected. The CIA helped to establish a military regime under General Pinochet.

Cambodia - 1975 - Twenty-eight Americans killed in an effort to retrieve the crew of the Mayaquez, which had been seized.

Angola - 1976-92 - The CIA backed South African rebels fighting against Marxist Angola.

Iran - 1980 - Americans aborted a rescue attempt to liberate 52 hostages seized in the Teheran embassy.

Libya - 1981 - American fighters shoot down two Libyan fighters.

El Salvador - 1981-92 - The CIA, troops, and advisers aid in El Salvador’s war against the FMLN.

Nicaragua - 1981-90 - The CIA and NSC directed the Contra War against the Sandinistas.

Lebanon - 1982-84 - Marines occupied Beirut during Lebanon’s civil war; 241 were killed in the American barracks and Reagan “redeployed” the troops to the Mediterranean.

Honduras - 1983-89 - Troops sent in to build bases near the Honduran border.

Grenada - 1983-84 - American invasion overthrew the Maurice Bishop government.

Iran - 1984 - American fighters shot down two Iranian planes over the Persian Gulf.

Libya - 1986 - American fighters hit targets in and around the capital city of Tripoli.

Bolivia - 1986 - The Army assisted government troops on raids of cocaine areas.

Iran - 1987-88 - The United States intervened on the side of Iraq during the Iran-Iraq War.

Libya - 1989 - Navy shot down two more Libyan jets.

Virgin Islands - 1989 - Troops landed during unrest among Virgin Island peoples.

Philippines - 1989 - Air Force provided air cover for government during coup.

Panama - 1989-90 - 27,000 Americans landed in overthrow of President Noriega; over 2,000 Panama civilians were killed.

Liberia - 1990 - Troops entered Liberia to evacuate foreigners during civil war.

Saudi Arabia - 1990-91 - American troops sent to Saudi Arabia, which was a staging area in the war against Iraq.

Kuwait - 1991 - Troops sent into Kuwait to turn back Saddam Hussein.

Somalia - 1992-94 - Troops occupied Somalia during civil war.

Bosnia - 1993-95 - Air Force jets bombed “no-fly zone” during civil war in Yugoslavia.

Haiti - 1994-96 - American troops and Navy provided a blockade against Haiti’s military government. The CIA restored Aristide to power.

Zaire - 1996-97 - Marines sent into Rwanda Hutus’ refugee camps in the area where the Congo revolution began.

Albania - 1997 - Troops deployed during evacuation of foreigners.

Sudan - 1998 - American missiles destroyed a pharmaceutical complex where alleged nerve gas components were manufactured.

Afghanistan - 1998 - Missiles launched towards alleged Afghan terrorist training camps.

Yugoslavia - 1999 - Bombings and missile attacks Carried out by the United States in conjunction with NATO in the 11 week war against Milosevic.

Iraq - 1998-2001 - Missiles launched into Baghdad and other large Iraq cities for four days. American jets enforced “no-fly zone” and continued to hit Iraqi targets since December 1998.
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:38 PM
 
Location: deafened by howls of 'racism!!!'
52,708 posts, read 34,525,339 times
Reputation: 29284
Quote:
Originally Posted by Memphis1979 View Post
Some psychos just kill people.

My definition of terrorism is an elaborate attack, planned out by multiple individuals.

Hassan may have contacted others, but he planned this on his own. Just another psycho killing innocent people.
why the 'planned out by multiple individuals' criteria? never heard of that one before.

was tim mcveigh a terrorist?
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:43 PM
 
Location: Apple Valley Calif
7,474 posts, read 22,875,208 times
Reputation: 5682
Quote:
Originally Posted by padcrasher View Post
So the killing of US soldiers and support personnel by an individual who has sided with the enemy is now terrorism?

The so called "terrorist" hit a military target and killed only military members and support staff.

So is it terrorism when when we kill enemy combatants in Afghanistan?

Right wingers want it both ways. They want to discount the man could have been mentally ill so they can brand him as working for the enemy.

Fine, then if he was working for the enemy then it's not "terrorism" .....It's war.
...and they allow you to use a computer....A very sad state of affairs..
No test required...
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