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Old 11-18-2009, 05:13 AM
 
12,867 posts, read 14,886,109 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
This is how business operates today. Once taxes are cut to zero, the only place to go is to give money to businesses. How are them tax cuts workin' out?
taxpayers paid 100% for that stadium and from 1974 to 1990 taxpayers paid 800,000 yearly for upkeep. that shows government waste and corruption, not the failure of business.

the actual net to the city is going to be around 350,000 after auction expenses.
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Old 11-18-2009, 05:33 AM
 
69,368 posts, read 63,992,474 times
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Originally Posted by plannine View Post
They gave lots of tax cuts to the Lions and Pistons to play there. But the teams didn't get all (or a controlling %) of the concessions and parking, so they left, as soon as their lease was up. (the Lion's left early and just paid the last years of their lease)
I think the taxpayers always gets a bum rap when it comes down to arenas and as an individual who has actually negotiated lease terms for a sports franchise (indoor arena football), I can tell you that usually leases are negotiated for the benefit of the arena, and the leasing venues involved. Taxpayers are never an issue during the talks. While taxpayers are usually on the hook for the debt, ideally its the facilities themself which pays down the debt due to these leases

What nvx was talking about though was cutting business taxes are to blame and they arent. Its an old, outdated, poorly managed facility who has had its day.
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Old 11-18-2009, 05:34 AM
 
69,368 posts, read 63,992,474 times
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Originally Posted by floridasandy View Post
the actual net to the city is going to be around 350,000 after auction expenses.
I dont think the city would have cared if they received $1 for the facility. For them the most likely reason for the sell off was to get rid of the $1.5M expense a year in upkeep.
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Old 11-18-2009, 05:52 AM
 
Location: Michigan
5,376 posts, read 5,336,897 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by floridasandy View Post
taxpayers paid 100% for that stadium and from 1974 to 1990 taxpayers paid 800,000 yearly for upkeep. that shows government waste and corruption, not the failure of business.

the actual net to the city is going to be around 350,000 after auction expenses.

The place made a profit for the city for years (Pontiac has been a failing city for decades). But like any building, when your "built for" tennats move out - you have a empty facility and nobody else wanting (or needing) a big, outdated cave.

The "taxpayers" also paid for the Lion's new field. Most built since the 50's have been underwritten by the city/state, directly or indirectly.

Last edited by plannine; 11-18-2009 at 06:04 AM..
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Old 11-18-2009, 06:14 AM
 
12,867 posts, read 14,886,109 times
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it is voodoo economics. it never pays for government to try and bribe business to come in.

we did that in our county with piper aircraft (paying them to stay) and then they did the layoffs. the worst thing you can have is government tied to big business!
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Old 11-18-2009, 07:23 AM
 
1,902 posts, read 2,464,598 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
This is how business operates today. Once taxes are cut to zero, the only place to go is to give money to businesses. How are them tax cuts workin' out?

Properly negotiated tax incentives to attract real full time jobs do work out.

Sports stadiums fall far short of that. Today stadiums cost upwards of a billion dollars and create few jobs. Most are part time unskilled jobs, hardly a good ROI, maybe that's why the team owners don't want to foot the bill.

Just think how many real jobs could be created if that billion were spent to give incentives for small businesses to start or relocate to that city. Of course, that's not as sexy and certainly harder for the politicians to get their cut from a 1000 business owners than only one.
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