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Whats wrong with a religious group voting as a block. Dont kid yourself, you live in a Christian country and that isnt changing, ever.
As Ive said before the evangelical vote won the Election in 2004. In 08 obama won by default and no amount of energizing the religious vote would have closed that gap. That wont be the case in 2012,. When we start screaming abortion is murder every GD christian in this country will find a booth and pull the ticket.
Be ready
For all you Christian folks who argue that your not trying to force your religion on America, behold the above post. I just wish every Fundamentalist would just own up to it. Btw, America is NOT a Christian nation, at least how the founding fathers envisioned America. Please educate yourselves, Jefferson hated Christianity, so did many others. DON'T DENY that Fundamentalist Christians would dismantle the wall between church and state in a holy heartbeat if they could. What's the difference between groups like Westboro and al Qieda? Not much.
Because once you leave this earth (die), you will not have any additional opportunites to make a choice in the matter. It's too late when we die to decide whether Jesus is the Son of God or mere mortal. Who are we to question the creator of the universe about whether this is "fair" or not? It wasn't fair for Jesus to suffer and die on that Cross for OUR sins but He did it out of love for humanity. It is up to us whether we embrace this gift of salvation or not. The choice we make here on earth will determine where we spend eternity.
This is what you are told, so this is what you believe.
I cant argue with that. However it sounds more like a selfish human trait to NEED to be told that you are god's son or risk damnation, and once you are standing face to face, they just say... "Told ya so!!! Sorry you had your chance, BYE!!!" I cant imagine why a spiritual entity would have such an egotistical need.
If my appreciation for different cultures as well as christ himself gets me thrown into hell with child molesters and thieves, well then, you can have a party watching me fry from heaven.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Borus
This is what you are told, so this is what you believe.
I cant argue with that. However it sounds more like a selfish human trait to NEED to be told that you are god's son or risk damnation, and once you are standing face to face, they just say... "Told ya so!!! Sorry you had your chance, BYE!!!" I cant imagine why a spiritual entity would have such an egotistical need.
If my appreciation for different cultures as well as christ himself gets me thrown into hell with child molesters and thieves, well then, you can have a party watching me fry from heaven.
I understand this is all confusing to you and how it does not make sense to your human understanding but you are forgetting the fact that God gave us all free will to decide for ourselves. Ever since the beginning of humanity, we all have chosen in some form to rebel against God. Since the price of sin = death and eternal separation between the sinner and God, it would be unjust for us to escape that punishment. God, in His loving mercy, sent His only begotten Son Jesus to die on the Cross satisfying the penalty of sin once and for all. God does not desire for ANY of us to perish which is why He sent Jesus Christ to die for the sins of humanity. It is up to us to accept that gift or reject it. Do you think it was fair for Jesus, who was sinless, to die a brutal death on the Cross for your sins, my sins and the sins of all humanity? All God is asking in return for that HUGE sacrifice is that we accept this gift of salvation and allow Him to transform our lives. He loves us with an everlasting love but He will not force us to choose Him or take away our free will to decide for ourselves.
Originally Posted by cagey cretin Whats wrong with a religious group voting as a block. Dont kid yourself, you live in a Christian country and that isnt changing, ever.
As Ive said before the evangelical vote won the Election in 2004. In 08 obama won by default and no amount of energizing the religious vote would have closed that gap. That wont be the case in 2012,. When we start screaming abortion is murder every GD christian in this country will find a booth and pull the ticket.
Many members of this forum are Evangelicals so I feel like questions like this can't be asked here since those Evangelicals will obviously say they have nothing in common with radical Muslims. If you've spent any considerable time on this forum, you know who the Evangelicals are and not suprisingly, they are ones on this forum who are in denial about the connection they have to radical Muslims.
I understand this is all confusing to you and how it does not make sense to your human understanding but you are forgetting the fact that God gave us all free will to decide for ourselves. Ever since the beginning of humanity, we all have chosen in some form to rebel against God. Since the price of sin = death and eternal separation between the sinner and God, it would be unjust for us to escape that punishment. God, in His loving mercy, sent His only begotten Son Jesus to die on the Cross satisfying the penalty of sin once and for all. God does not desire for ANY of us to perish which is why He sent Jesus Christ to die for the sins of humanity. It is up to us to accept that gift or reject it. Do you think it was fair for Jesus, who was sinless, to die a brutal death on the Cross for your sins, my sins and the sins of all humanity? All God is asking in return for that HUGE sacrifice is that we accept this gift of salvation and allow Him to transform our lives. He loves us with an everlasting love but He will not force us to choose Him or take away our free will to decide for ourselves.
I am not forgetting about free will!!! My free will tells me that anything is possible, period! This is not confusing, its clear to me. There is no benefit to boxing yourself into one religion when clearly so many cultures exist that live peaceful lives.
Christians do not have a monopoly on family values and morals. Its absurd to try and make me believe that someday the whole planet has to be Christian or SUFFER. I will never buy that.
I know you mean well, and I do believe you are speaking from your heart, but seriously, I'm not confused, or lost and I dont need saving. This very act is what gives people a bad perception of your religion.
Basically, I believe in the same morals as you do, except I dont stop there, I believe there is merit and wisdom in what other religions say as well, and many of the morals are identical to the teachings of Christianity.
Learning what other cultures believe across the globe keeps me stimulated, and by finding the similarities in all of them, I find REAL truth. I am content to sit on the sidelines and ponder all possibilities. I am not happy with hearing the same old regurgitated parables repeated over & over & over from one religious camp, it seems like brainwashing!!!
Any religion can be warped but crazy people so even though I am a Christian I can see the beauty in other religions including Islam. Is my faith based in another religion? No my faith is in Christianity.
Being a Christian or any religion for that matter is done or should be by choice and once that choice is made you follow the laws of that religion. All religions have laws that need to be followed to save your soul. In Christianity is is believing in Jesus and that he is the son of God and died for our sins. There is nothing hypocritical or underhanded about it. It is pretty simple.
they both make rules which they themselves never follow.
they think they can make things better by praying for the destruction of all mankind.
they tend to be angry and dogmatic alot.
they think their will and gods are the same
they lack a sense of fairness in all their works
they believe women and children should not dominate men
1 out of 6 is not bad
Any religion can be warped but crazy people so even though I am a Christian I can see the beauty in other religions including Islam. Is my faith based in another religion? No my faith is in Christianity.
Being a Christian or any religion for that matter is done or should be by choice and once that choice is made you follow the laws of that religion. All religions have laws that need to be followed to save your soul. In Christianity is is believing in Jesus and that he is the son of God and died for our sins. There is nothing hypocritical or underhanded about it. It is pretty simple.
That was a pretty straight forward statement as you are just explaining your own beliefs. Nothing to argue with there and certainly nothing hypocritical.
Its when it extends into.. "and if you dont believe this too, you are going to hell" that I start debates.
I will always debate that everyone is entitled to believe as they wish, but in the simplest purest form, all religions boil down to:
1) good vs evil
2) generosity vs selfishness
3) light vs dark
4) love vs. hate
5) understanding vs. ignorance
6) kindness vs callousness
and on and on.
For all those who pick the positive end of the spectrum, we are all on the same team no matter whose name you declare it under.
I'm not a Christianity "expert" but I do what what my beliefs are about as I've studied the Bible for myself. Since this argument is getting us nowhere, why don't you stop acting as if you know what Christianity is all about and I'll not act as if I know what atheism is all about. Deal?
Can't defend your words, I see.
Then why don't you do the same. You're no expert.
So stop claiming that you know who is and is not xian.
Atheism is easy to understand. Anyone can understand it.
It's very simple: we have no belief in a god-thing.
Period.
You can (and do) try to attach other things to it, knowing it's bogus.
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