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Old 11-28-2009, 07:52 AM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,476,088 times
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Originally Posted by irishvanguard View Post
Either way, I come down on the side of those who teach hope for upward mobility instead of inculcated cynicism. Do you?
I come down quite clearly on the side of those who are prepared to recognize even uncomfortable realities and take sensible steps toward policy and action based on those realities. Passing on fairy tales and prescriptive quackery do not advance the prospects of any student. Allowing teachers into the classroom who are capable of no more than that is today as ever a dereliction of any school system's principal duties and responsibilities.
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Old 11-28-2009, 07:54 AM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,476,088 times
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Originally Posted by irishvanguard View Post
The arrogant student learns nothing. Perhaps that is the source of my ignorance, as well as yours.
I suspect that there are few on this board who expend more time and effort in learning than I do. Often, it shows...
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Old 11-28-2009, 07:54 AM
 
3,709 posts, read 4,628,200 times
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Originally Posted by saganista View Post
I come down quite clearly on the side of those who are prepared to recognize even uncomfortable realities and take sensible steps toward policy and action based on those realities. Passing on fairy tales and prescriptive quackery do not advance the prospects of any student. Allowing teachers into the classroom who are capable of no more than that is today as ever a dereliction of any school system's principal duties and responsibilities.
But there is no chemotherapy for cynicism. You really wouldn't want to pass this disease onto the innocents, would you?
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Old 11-28-2009, 08:00 AM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,476,088 times
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Originally Posted by irishvanguard View Post
But there is no chemotherapy for cynicism. You really wouldn't want to pass this disease onto the innocents, would you?
Pollyanna did not help as many people as Clara Barton.
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Old 11-28-2009, 08:19 AM
 
Location: The Land Mass Between NOLA and Mobile, AL
1,796 posts, read 1,661,814 times
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Originally Posted by saganista View Post
The article in the OP reads as if it were written by some right-wing church lady, and indeed it was. Katherine Kersten -- whom one commentator referred to as the Twin Cities' answer to Phyllis Schlafly -- has been in constant trouble over her publishing career for racist and other forms of bigotted commentary. You can imagine her reaction to Keith Ellison's campaign and decision to swear the Congressional oath of office on the Koran as examples.

Meanwhile, the awful document Kersten rails against is merely seeking approaches to educating minority youth in a state that has traditionally had rather small minority populations but has recently and rapidly found itself less and less in that situation. As various posters have here expertly pointed out, the mantra of "Hey, be just like us white folk!" doesn't do the job. Nor does reassuring minority students that the so-called American Dream is working in their favor when any one of them can look around a community and see quite plainly that it is not and that the system is in fact stacked strongly against them. Minnesota still draws the majority of its K-12 teachers from a demographic that does not come automatically equipped with a background in or even much thought about divsersiy issues. Attempts to bring its future classroom workforce up to speed in the area are no more dangerous than a remedial math or english course would be to those students not yet well enough versed in those subjects. The state should be applauded for its efforts in this direction, not derided as they sometimes are by die-hard white enclavists...
Thank you for providing this background. I kind of suspected as much, but it is always nice to hear it from some kind of source. You offered a shortcut to what would have taken an hour or two of online research to suss out. I can see exactly what you are talking about happening in rural MN, and even in Minneapolis/St. Paul. When I go home to visit, which isn't very often, I can see the changes. They actually make me happy. People are learning to be more open and accepting.
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Old 11-28-2009, 08:49 AM
 
2,557 posts, read 5,861,291 times
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I am so proud that my daughter, college professor, will NOT be a part of the FALSE LIBERAL AGENDA even though she will probably be one of the very few Conservative Doctors there are in the field. She is very open minded and will not push anyone's agenda.
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Old 11-28-2009, 09:05 AM
 
30,065 posts, read 18,665,937 times
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Originally Posted by sailordave View Post
Nope, no indoctrination goes on at our nation's universities,...yeah right.
Katherine Kersten: At U, future teachers may be reeducated | StarTribune.com
Do you believe in the American dream -- the idea that in this country, hardworking people of every race, color and creed can get ahead on their own merits? If so, that belief may soon bar you from getting a license to teach in Minnesota public schools -- at least if you plan to get your teaching degree at the University of Minnesota's Twin Cities campus.
In a report compiled last summer, the Race, Culture, Class and Gender Task Group at the U's College of Education and Human Development recommended that aspiring teachers there must repudiate the notion of "the American Dream" in order to obtain the recommendation for licensure required by the Minnesota Board of Teaching. Instead, teacher candidates must embrace -- and be prepared to teach our state's kids -- the task force's own vision of America as an oppressive hellhole: racist, sexist and homophobic.
It calls for evaluating future teachers in both coursework and practice teaching based on their willingness to fall into ideological lockstep.
The first step toward "cultural competence," says the task group, is for future teachers to recognize -- and confess -- their own bigotry. Anyone familiar with the reeducation camps of China's Cultural Revolution will recognize the modus operandi.

This is why state supported and public education is doomed in the US. I agrree with the comparison to the Cultural Revolution.
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Old 11-28-2009, 09:15 AM
 
3,282 posts, read 5,202,213 times
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Originally Posted by saganista View Post
The right-wing argues ever from the outliers. Hard truth is a difficult pill to swallow for those invested in and wedded to their hapless stereotypes. But major kudos for putting these hard facts on the line...
I understand that many are ideologically invested in believing that meritocracy is robust. It reminds me a bit of some of the more hard-line strains of Indian religions which teach that everyone literally gets the life they deserve because it absolves them of all pondering/caring about the circumstances of others.

I'm not poor and I lead a pretty comfortable life. I have nothing vested in getting on a soap box and proclaiming that the system doesn't work for the average person. But I take a deep issue with teaching impressionable youth that they will always get a 1 to 1 return on the effort that they put out, something which is at best a half truth. Then when reality bites back, these same people will go on to believe that they have been cheated by some "other" or that all the "other" people deserve what they get.

It's an awful spectacle and if I were a member of the 1% I'd watch it with pure glee.
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Old 11-28-2009, 09:24 AM
 
19,226 posts, read 15,321,408 times
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I protest!

This whole thread makes conservatives look intelligent!

I have always been cynical about stealth contrivance.

Just tell the damn kids that birds of a feather flock together, but humans can do whatever they want.
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Old 11-28-2009, 09:34 AM
 
3,709 posts, read 4,628,200 times
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Originally Posted by Hoarfrost View Post
I understand that many are ideologically invested in believing that meritocracy is robust.
It's an awful spectacle and if I were a member of the 1% I'd watch it with pure glee.
I would argue that you have the talent and intelligence to be part of the much-maligned "1%".

But it would be a false assumption that the "1%" (including you) arrived at their station by the abuse of others and at the expense of others. That is the liberal mythology.

For instance, what did Oprah ever steal from you? (Caution: don't give me any "anecdotes or outliers" argument; you could claim everyone within this percentile is an "exception to the rule".)
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