Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
This is exactly what I knew would happen with this thread. We get blanket statements about sea levels rising and glaciers melting with no proof to back it up. When you ask for the proof you get called ignorant. No, believing statements without looking for proof is actually what would make one ignorant.
Pointing out the proof, opposite to their belief, results in this;
Even giving an actually link where she can go and look at the data herself is of little use when the religion of a true believer is brought into question.
Take your average fundamentalist Christian who votes Republican and voted for George W. Bush. Take this true believer, who thru faith believes in Jesus Christ, will also reject science as being manipulated/faked/fabricated, even if the overwhelming amount of research produced by the worlds leading scientists corroborate what anyone with eyes can see: The earth is getting warmer and the results of this warming trend are obvious wherever you live.
But not to a True Believer. The great paradox of this type of thinking is lost on these folks. What a shame. Great irony in their thinking, too bad its so dangerous to the world
Interesting observation and one that I have made. There is most likely not even one Bush Republican that has admitted that man is contributing the rapid change in climate. It is a mindset that goes hand in hand with everything else they are in denial about concerning the failures of the party and ideology that they support. Strange that they can believe in fairy tales (of the Bible and otherwise) and not in science. These are the very people whose ignorance and stupidity are obstructing any changes for the better, whether it be in the ecology or affordable health care for fellow Americans. The only ones that stand to win on either of these issues are the big corporations and these ignorant fools are not even reaping the profits that the corrupted representatives are getting in the form of bribes frome these industries. What a bunch of dolts!
Yeah, don't hold your breath. Heck, GORE won't even answer questions anymore. If the poster boy won't answer questions, how can you expect his minions to?
So true. They just keep repeating the predictions that the alarmists put out.
one scientist who knows more about sea levels than anyone else in the world it is the Swedish geologist and physicist Nils-Axel Mörner, formerly chairman of the INQUA International Commission on Sea Level Change. And the uncompromising verdict of Dr Mörner, who for 35 years has been using every known scientific method to study sea levels all over the globe, is that all this talk about the sea rising is nothing but a colossal scare story.
Despite fluctuations down as well as up, "the sea is not rising," he says. "It hasn't risen in 50 years." If there is any rise this century it will "not be more than 10cm (four inches), with an uncertainty of plus or minus 10cm". And quite apart from examining the hard evidence, he says, the elementary laws of physics (latent heat needed to melt ice) tell us that the dramatic levels that the globalwarming community scream about are nearly impossible.
The reason why Dr Mörner, formerly a Stockholm professor, is so certain that these claims about sea level rise are 100 per cent wrong is that they are all based on computer model predictions, whereas his findings are based on "going into the field to observe what is actually happening in the real world".
When running the International Commission on Sea Level Change, he launched a special project on the Maldives, whose leaders have for 20 years been calling for vast sums of international aid to stave off disaster. Six times he and his expert team visited the islands, to confirm that the sea has not risen for half a century. Before announcing his findings, he offered to show the inhabitants a film explaining why they had nothing to worry about. The government refused to let it be shown.
Similarly in Tuvalu, where local leaders have been calling for the inhabitants to be evacuated for 20 years, the sea has if anything dropped in recent decades. The only evidence the scaremongers can cite is based on the fact that extracting groundwater for pineapple growing has allowed seawater to seep in to replace it. Meanwhile, Venice has been sinking rather than the Adriatic rising, says Dr Mörner.
One of his most shocking discoveries was why the IPCC has been able to show sea levels rising by 2.3mm a year. Until 2003, even its own satellite-based evidence showed no upward trend. But suddenly the graph tilted upwards because the IPCC's favoured experts had drawn on the finding of a single tide-gauge in Hong Kong harbour showing a 2.3mm rise. The entire global sea-level projection was then adjusted upwards by a "corrective factor" of 2.3mm, because, as the IPCC scientists admitted, they "needed to show a trend".
When I spoke to Dr Mörner last week, he expressed his continuing dismay at how the IPCC has fed the scare on this crucial issue. When asked to act as an "expert reviewer" on the IPCC's last two reports, he was "astonished to find that not one of their 22 contributing authors on sea levels was a sea level specialist: not one". Yet the results of all this "deliberate ignorance" and reliance on rigged computer models have become the most powerful single driver of the entire warmist hysteria.
•For more information, see Dr Mörner on YouTube (Google Mörner, Maldives and YouTube); or read on the net his 2007 EIR interview "Claim that sea level is rising is a total fraud"; or email him – morner@pog.nu – to buy a copy of his booklet 'The Greatest Lie Ever Told'
In 1842 the "Isle of the Dead" in SE Tasmania was selected for the site of a "Mean Sea Level" refernce mark by Capt. James Clark Ross. Today this mark can clearly be seen 35 cm ABOVE the current mean sea level.
Yeah, wasn't it Heroditus, or Hypocliftus, or somebody that figured out ocean displacement by taking a bath on his wife's advice?
Actually science really leads us to believe that there is a God. Scientists still haven't proven how life began. Science has given us some amazing achievements and medical advancements.
I believe in a Creator. Unbelievers believe that life just spontaneously came into being. That the organic just HAPPENED one day in an inorganic world. Both take faith.
Folks who don't understand what science is are better off not trying to explain it.
it's great how you openly admit this is all political you. All about your fears. You continue to say nothing has happened?????no ice cap melting, rise in sea level, record temperatures, increased desertification,,,,,yep nothing.
Yes some ice has melted. But no one has been able to show how this ice melt is different from the melt that occurred in previous warming periods.
Yes sea level is rising. It has been rising for about 18thousand years since we came out of the last ice age. The rise we see now is not statistically different than the annual sea level rise over the last 300 years.
The Antarctic ice cap as measured in the 2009 maximum was the largest ever recorded going back to the 1970's However, there has been some melt of ice cap in the Arctic. Again, that melt is not substantively different from melts in previous warming periods. (Both the Medieval Warming Period and the Holocene Maximum).
As for record temperatures, one might consider that Houston set a record for early snow last year, and then beat that record this year. Edmonton Alberta Canada set a new low temperature record this last week for December. However, since we have been going into a warming period, and the last warming period took place before modern record keeping existed, it stands to reason that we are setting new warm records now.
As for desertification, one might consider land use as having some bearing on the subject.
No one is saying that we are not seeing a warming. We are saying that there is no evidence to data that proves this warming is different or more dramatic than previous warming’s. The Holocene Maximum lasted for 5000 years. The Medieval Warming Period lasted for 350 years. We have been close to (but not quite equal to) the MWP temperatures for about 20 years….maybe…We are 5 degrees cooler than the HM.
Come up with some factual reference point that shows this warming to be materially different from previous warming’s during this interglacial and we will have something to talk about. Providing hyperbole about melting ice and rising sea levels does nothing to advance your belief system.
Folks who don't understand what science is are better off not trying to explain it.
I understand science very well. I also understand that no scientist has ever given us a good explanation of how organic life just HAPPENED in an inorganic world.
Yes some ice has melted. But no one has been able to show how this ice melt is different from the melt that occurred in previous warming periods.
Yes sea level is rising. It has been rising for about 18thousand years since we came out of the last ice age. The rise we see now is not statistically different than the annual sea level rise over the last 300 years.
The Antarctic ice cap as measured in the 2009 maximum was the largest ever recorded going back to the 1970's However, there has been some melt of ice cap in the Arctic. Again, that melt is not substantively different from melts in previous warming periods. (Both the Medieval Warming Period and the Holocene Maximum).
As for record temperatures, one might consider that Houston set a record for early snow last year, and then beat that record this year. Edmonton Alberta Canada set a new low temperature record this last week for December. However, since we have been going into a warming period, and the last warming period took place before modern record keeping existed, it stands to reason that we are setting new warm records now.
As for desertification, one might consider land use as having some bearing on the subject.
No one is saying that we are not seeing a warming. We are saying that there is no evidence to data that proves this warming is different or more dramatic than previous warming’s. The Holocene Maximum lasted for 5000 years. The Medieval Warming Period lasted for 350 years. We have been close to (but not quite equal to) the MWP temperatures for about 20 years….maybe…We are 5 degrees cooler than the HM.
Come up with some factual reference point that shows this warming to be materially different from previous warming’s during this interglacial and we will have something to talk about. Providing hyperbole about melting ice and rising sea levels does nothing to advance your belief system.
A Round, Warm Earth:
Debunking the Republican Denials of Global Climate Change
Myth 3: The current global warming trends are nothing more than natural repetitions of warming seen during medieval times.
Republicans are eager to cite what they call the "Medieval Warm Period" as proof that global climate change is a purely natural event, a nothing to worry about. They claim that global temperatures in medieval times exceeded the global temperatures of today, and were the result of purely natural causes. However, the scientific review of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change has strongly rejected the validity of this claim, and found that warming trends today are more dramatic than at any time in the last thousand years.
This myth is based on a number of false premises. First of all, the increase in global temperatures during the "Medieval Warm Period" has been found in a number of peer-reviewed scientific studies to be greatly less than the warming that is taking place today. Second, this myth is based only on European weather trends in medieval times, when what really matters is global climate trends. Third, the Republicans who make claims about a "Medieval Warm Period" that supposedly dwarfs the current warming trend base their claims upon a comparison of temperatures in medieval times to temperatures during the entire 20th Century. The problem with doing so is that the comparison clumps all of the 20th Century together as if it is one moment in time with one temperature, thus treating the dramatic increase in global temperature from the beginning of the 20th Century to the end of the 20th Century as if it does not exist. Furthermore, the evidence for significant warming in Europe in medieval times is not completely clear. Republican analysts frequently confuse evidence of drought with evidence for temperature increase, and so make a leap of faith when they make their claims of a "Medieval Warm Period". The temperatures we record today are reliable figures collected directly without the need for such stretched supposition.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
