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I don't label myself left or right but I'm finally understanding why most of you do NOT want the reforms from Obama and 'change'.
I originally thought it was because you were not compassionate toward those less fortunate. However, it comes down to this: America is about equal opportunity, not equal outcome.
You are tired of enabling the downtrodden. The keyword is "enable". Have you ever helped someone get on their feet and time after time they still stay down? I have. They are looking for you to feed them fish and refuse to learn how to fish. They will bankrupt you dry and then blame you for giving up on them.
This is fundamentally the difference between liberals and the rest.
Liberals: Feed them fish.
Others: Offer them the opportunity to learn how to fish. End of story.
I don't label myself left or right but I'm finally understanding why most of you do NOT want the reforms from Obama and 'change'.
I originally thought it was because you were not compassionate toward those less fortunate. However, it comes down to this: America is about equal opportunity, not equal outcome.
You are tired of enabling the downtrodden. The keyword is "enable". Have you ever helped someone get on their feet and time after time they still stay down? I have. They are looking for you to feed them fish and refuse to learn how to fish. They will bankrupt you dry and then blame you for giving up on them.
This is fundamentally the difference between liberals and the rest.
Liberals: Feed them fish.
Others: Offer them the opportunity to learn how to fish. End of story.
Well I look at it this way. Everywhere I have worked there has always been one that constantly bums a cig from me. I don't mind giving one out once in a while because I don't want to be selfish and a prick. There are times that maybe I run out and ask for one also although seldom.
However when that guy asks for one every single day after a while you get tired of it and tell him no more, get your own. I did that, after a few times I said 35 cents a cig. And they paid it. One guy I told one time why don't you get your own when he constantly bummed off me and he said get this "they are expensive and I would smoke too much if I bought my own pack". But guess what? after the intitial shock on his face when I started charging him be started paying for them.
What am I trying to say? I don't mind helping when someone is in need, I may be someday also, however abusers and users need to be kept in check.
Let me try to explain it using your own ridiculously oversimplified analogy:
Republicans:
- Make the fishing equipment so expensive that only a select few can afford it.
- control the market so that fish become artificially overpriced and the masses hoard and fight over them.
- recklessly overfish the pond without a single thought regarding sustainability extending past the next fiscal quarter.
- somehow convince Joe the Plumber that it's the big bad liberals that want to take his fish away
Democrats:
- Try in vain to mitigate any of the above from happening
Feeding them fish is only one component of Liberalism.
Liberals: build the hatchery, procure the water, buy the eggs, purify the air, de-ionize the sunlight, massage the larvae, immunize the hatchlings, vitaminize the food source, provide the shade, control the temperature, quarantine the juvenile stock, drain the pond, and handpick the commercial harvest. Why? Because liberals believe you are entitled to this.
Conservatives: Get your own g*****n fishing pole and go catch you some food or die. Why? Because conservatives believe that unsustainable entitlements are the undoing of this nation.
You are misrepresenting our side. We want the same things as Democrats and Liberals but we believe your process of achieving those goals are ineffective and lead to waste. We think your ideas sound good in theory but in practicality don't work whereas our ideas can sound harsh in theory but are more effective from a practical standpoint.
With regard to healthcare for example, we don't believe that more government intervention is the solution. We believe in ideas like eliminating state limitations with regards to purchasing insurance so that people can buy the types of insurance they want instead of a hodge podge policy that includes things we may not desire. Interstate competition will lower premiums and the market will meet that demand. We also believe in things like tort reform and legislation that will protect doctors and hospitals in good faith efforts which will lower defensive medical practices and reduce costs.
I think both Democrats and Republicans offer components or solutions that I like. It's unfortunate that politics is so partisan that people can't compromise. A big reason the Democrats failed to pass healthcare reform despite having a majority in both houses and an active President is because of their unwillingness to drop the public option early in the process and initiate reforms that both sides could agree on. The Republicans also hurt this process by trying abandon reform altogether and taking the "Let's start over process." The President certainly didn't help matters when he initially tried to seek universal healthcare. If the Democrats adopted a more realistic and practical health care solution from the start back in the Spring of 2009, this may have been passed
Well I look at it this way. Everywhere I have worked there has always been one that constantly bums a cig from me. I don't mind giving one out once in a while because I don't want to be selfish and a prick. There are times that maybe I run out and ask for one also although seldom.
However when that guy asks for one every single day after a while you get tired of it and tell him no more, get your own. I did that, after a few times I said 35 cents a cig. And they paid it. One guy I told one time why don't you get your own when he constantly bummed off me and he said get this "they are expensive and I would smoke too much if I bought my own pack". But guess what? after the intitial shock on his face when I started charging him be started paying for them.
What am I trying to say? I don't mind helping when someone is in need, I may be someday also, however abusers and users need to be kept in check.
Yes, they want you not only to be responsible for their cigs, but be their babysitter so they don't smoke too much...
At the end they will just blame you for lending them too many and get lung cancer, or not lending them any so they are forced to buy a whole pack and get lung cancer.
I call that irresponsible. Back to the topic, I wouldn't jump into conclusion saying every person that needs help is like that, but I can imagine a lot are.
You are misrepresenting our side. We want the same things as Democrats and Liberals but we believe your process of achieving those goals are ineffective and lead to waste. We think your ideas sound good in theory but in practicality don't work whereas our ideas can sound harsh in theory but are more effective from a practical standpoint.
With regard to healthcare for example, we don't believe that more government intervention is the solution. We believe in ideas like eliminating state limitations with regards to purchasing insurance so that people can buy the types of insurance they want instead of a hodge podge policy that includes things we may not desire. Interstate competition will lower premiums and the market will meet that demand. We also believe in things like tort reform and legislation that will protect doctors and hospitals in good faith efforts which will lower defensive medical practices and reduce costs.
I think both Democrats and Republicans offer components or solutions that I like. It's unfortunate that politics is so partisan that people can't compromise. A big reason the Democrats failed to pass healthcare reform despite having a majority in both houses and an active President is because of their unwillingness to drop the public option early in the process and initiate reforms that both sides could agree on.
I agree with this. There was a thread however recently asking "when is profit too much?" or something like that. Some known conservatives on this board posted some thoughts I disagree with, they seem to hold to capitalism and freedom to charge whatever with no waivering devotion. One said that in crisis like after a hurricane that charging $20 for a bag of ice was not profiteering but just fair market value and freemarket at work. I disagree with that, profit without ethics and no good will toward another is not good for America. I am generally not one to believe in government intervention but there are times it can be needed to regulate.
Let me try to explain it using your own ridiculously oversimplified analogy:
Republicans:
- Make the fishing equipment so expensive that only a select few can afford it.
- control the market so that fish become artificially overpriced and the masses hoard and fight over them.
- recklessly overfish the pond without a single thought regarding sustainability extending past the next fiscal quarter.
- somehow convince Joe the Plumber that it's the big bad liberals that want to take his fish away
Democrats:
- Try in vain to mitigate any of the above from happening
Just to be the devil's advocate, if the fishing equipment is so expensive, why are immigrants (across the rio grande or fresh off the boat) without any $ are able to succeed? Within a decade they own property. Then they're able to send their children off to college.
What I'm saying is that it doesn't necessarily require $ to succeed, but drive and motivation.
I understand there are people who have the drive and motivation but still cannot make it due to unforeseen circumstances (such as illness or accidents that wipe them out financially with hospital bills). But for the rest, it just takes HUNGER and DRIVE. I see poor immigrants do it all the time: they are willing to do WHATEVER it takes.
Cesar Millan was an illegal immigrant who had nothing and cleaned houses before he became the Dog Whisperer.
I don't label myself left or right but I'm finally understanding why most of you do NOT want the reforms from Obama and 'change'.
I originally thought it was because you were not compassionate toward those less fortunate. However, it comes down to this: America is about equal opportunity, not equal outcome.
You are tired of enabling the downtrodden. The keyword is "enable". Have you ever helped someone get on their feet and time after time they still stay down? I have. They are looking for you to feed them fish and refuse to learn how to fish. They will bankrupt you dry and then blame you for giving up on them.
This is fundamentally the difference between liberals and the rest.
Liberals: Feed them fish.
Others: Offer them the opportunity to learn how to fish. End of story.
I hate to burst your bubble, but Republicans are not conservative and Democrats are not liberal. So to compare liberals and Republicans is comparing apples and oranges.
Essentially nowadays party wise I think it breaks down like this.
Democrats: Feed the fish to supposedly disadvantaged minorities, attoneys and the poor.
Republicans: Feed the fish to big business, the very wealthy, and oil/war profiteers.
Everyone else can learn to fish or not, but the Ds and Rs will not teach you.
I hate to burst your bubble, but Republicans are not conservative and Democrats are not liberal. So to compare liberals and Republicans is comparing apples and oranges.
Essentially nowadays party wise I think it breaks down like this.
Democrats: Feed the fish to supposedly disadvantaged minorities, attoneys and the poor.
Republicans: Feed the fish to big business, the very wealthy, and oil/war profiteers.
Everyone else can learn to fish or not, but the Ds and Rs will not teach you.
Yes, I get confused about that sometimes...I was thinking of those who voted for Scott Brown in Mass to answer, and they were mostly Republicans and Independents. They were against the tide of change by Obama.
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