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Old 02-09-2010, 04:49 PM
 
228 posts, read 506,219 times
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Before anyone here starts pointing fingers at politicians (Republican, Democrat, or otherwise) for the state of the economy the reason why we are in this mess is because people borrowed money and spent beyond their means. Nobody said you had to buy a $1M McMansion with a $20,000 downpayment and take out a loan for that downpayment. Nobody said you had to buy things you didn't need on your credit cards and rack yourselves up in tens of thousands of dollars in debt. I know I shouldn't talk about the latter because I am equally as guilty though I am still able to manage my debt.

Then when it all comes crashing down we panic and beg the government for assistance and when they propose a program we complain that there are too many conditions and so forth. Case in point President Obama's Foreclosure Rescue Plan - people want to be bailed out so they don't lose their home but also cry when they find out it hurts their credit rating. Also people complain that the stimulus bill should go straight to the people and not the banks who got us into this mess. While I agree that the banks shouldn't be bailed out if the government gave us that stimulus money directly we'd end up carelessly spending it all and you'll have more of the same of what I listed above. At least by bailing out the few banks the government can somewhat monitor closely how that money is spent (such as the AIG outrage over bonuses).

Anyway to sum up the reason why we are in this mess and why we are doomed as a nation is that there is no personal accountability for our own faults and when we screw up we blame others for our problems. Add that our problems can easily be solved if we all looked in the mirror for a change and be true to ourselves.
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Old 02-09-2010, 04:57 PM
 
11,944 posts, read 14,726,241 times
Reputation: 2772
Actually, Bush said you should, in lockstep with every credit card/ finance industry special interest group that had funded him into office from the getgo. True patriots spend beyond their means. If you really love america, spend spend spend. The american dream rachetted up to nightmare when his campaign promises exaggerated fiscal circus, paying voters from the US treasury through promises of tax refund (when we couldn't afford to be doing that because no budgetary cut went alongside that promise).

He also did it by fanning an already overheated real estate market by opening the sluice valves of deregulatory climate wide open. Laid the cops off or scolded them for interfering. Laisez fair only when it serves the guy who took you to this dance, to hell with the party, the nation, and the globe.
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:02 PM
 
241 posts, read 250,813 times
Reputation: 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by 808s View Post
Anyway to sum up the reason why we are in this mess and why we are doomed as a nation is that there is no personal accountability for our own faults and when we screw up we blame others for our problems.
Criminals on Wall St aren't going to take any responsibility, personal or not.
What you should be calling for is more regulations and harsher punishments for swindlers, err "bankers".
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:06 PM
 
Location: Alvarado, TX
2,917 posts, read 4,749,406 times
Reputation: 802
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
Actually, Bush said you should, in lockstep with every credit card/ finance industry special interest group that had funded him into office from the getgo. True patriots spend beyond their means. If you really love america, spend spend spend. The american dream rachetted up to nightmare when his campaign promises exaggerated fiscal circus, paying voters from the US treasury through promises of tax refund (when we couldn't afford to be doing that because no budgetary cut went alongside that promise).

He also did it by fanning an already overheated real estate market by opening the sluice valves of deregulatory climate wide open. Laid the cops off or scolded them for interfering. Laisez fair only when it serves the guy who took you to this dance, to hell with the party, the nation, and the globe.
Of course, blame it on Bush or anyone else who you think governs you. You, madam, are the one who rules your destiny. Do you always believe the politicians who tell you to spend, spend, spend? A long time ago, I came up with an idea that has worked time and again for me: Buy what you Need, and Need what you Buy. I've save myself many heartaches with that little ditty. Maybe you should try the same thing, huh?
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:07 PM
 
Location: Armsanta Sorad
5,648 posts, read 8,023,090 times
Reputation: 2462
The US is falling about because of greed, feminism, selfishness, and classism.
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:11 PM
 
Location: Sinking in the Great Salt Lake
13,139 posts, read 22,708,718 times
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The US hasn't fallen yet. We should ask China what will bring us down, since they are gonna be writing the history books.
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:15 PM
 
Location: Texas
44,257 posts, read 64,056,257 times
Reputation: 73913
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
Actually, Bush said you should, in lockstep with every credit card/ finance industry special interest group that had funded him into office from the getgo. True patriots spend beyond their means. If you really love america, spend spend spend. The american dream rachetted up to nightmare when his campaign promises exaggerated fiscal circus, paying voters from the US treasury through promises of tax refund (when we couldn't afford to be doing that because no budgetary cut went alongside that promise).

He also did it by fanning an already overheated real estate market by opening the sluice valves of deregulatory climate wide open. Laid the cops off or scolded them for interfering. Laisez fair only when it serves the guy who took you to this dance, to hell with the party, the nation, and the globe.
Yes, Bush held a gun to your head and said, "Go buy a house and sh*t you can't afford or I will shoot you and five kittens."

That's exactly what he did. Learn some history first:

Clinton, Republicans agree to deregulation of US financial system | Piggington's Econo-Almanac | San Diego Housing Bubble News and Analysis
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:19 PM
 
228 posts, read 506,219 times
Reputation: 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
Actually, Bush said you should, in lockstep with every credit card/ finance industry special interest group that had funded him into office from the getgo. True patriots spend beyond their means. If you really love america, spend spend spend. The american dream rachetted up to nightmare when his campaign promises exaggerated fiscal circus, paying voters from the US treasury through promises of tax refund (when we couldn't afford to be doing that because no budgetary cut went alongside that promise).

He also did it by fanning an already overheated real estate market by opening the sluice valves of deregulatory climate wide open. Laid the cops off or scolded them for interfering. Laisez fair only when it serves the guy who took you to this dance, to hell with the party, the nation, and the globe.
Sure Bush said everyone should live the American Dream but he didn't hold a gun to anyone's head and tell them to buy that $1 million McMansion they couldn't afford. It is those individuals who see lifestyles of the rich and famous and thought, "Oh, I can live that way." Then when it all comes crashing down they cry to the government for help.

And being patriotic means loyalty to your country, not spending more money. Patriotism in my opinion means using your head.
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:25 PM
 
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,271 posts, read 53,999,856 times
Reputation: 40556
Quote:
Originally Posted by West of Encino View Post
The US is falling about because of greed, feminism, selfishness, and classism.


Feminism? Pat, is that you?
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Old 02-09-2010, 05:25 PM
 
228 posts, read 506,219 times
Reputation: 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by ah yes of course View Post
Criminals on Wall St aren't going to take any responsibility, personal or not.
What you should be calling for is more regulations and harsher punishments for swindlers, err "bankers".
While I agree that the bankers are the ones who caused this mess most did so within legal means, and deregulation is the reason they did what they did. We can't punish them for any laws they did not break though they were careless and in the process screwed over a lot of people. Last I read carelessness and stupidity is looked down upon but it is not illegal.

Yes, the banking system should be regulated back to the pre-Reagan era. Even with regulations firms borrowed 12:1 against their net worth and after Ronald Reagan's administration deregulated the banking industry firms started borrowing 40:1 or more and now it's a giant mess.

Whoever's in office should simply regulate the banks once again and maybe the investment bankers won't be so careless.
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