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Chronically poor people, for various reasons, often lack very basic skills and don't have a childhood-based foundation upon which to build "further education," (sometimes even community college education to become a plumber or whatever). ... Even though the number one priority would be to keep people from getting into that situation, I think the government should at least ensure that people working in this condition can survive reasonably (food, healthcare, housing, transportation, etc.). The minimum wage is one of several possible tools for achieving that. I don't really have enough economic expertise to know how high it should be, or how big of a factor it should be relative to the other tools, like subsidies and jobs programs.
Chronically poor people, for various reasons, often lack very basic skills and don't have a childhood-based foundation upon which to build "further education," (sometimes even community college education to become a plumber or whatever). ... Even though the number one priority would be to keep people from getting into that situation, I think the government should at least ensure that people working in this condition can survive reasonably (food, healthcare, housing, transportation, etc.). The minimum wage is one of several possible tools for achieving that. I don't really have enough economic expertise to know how high it should be, or how big of a factor it should be relative to the other tools, like subsidies and jobs programs.
Nothing wrong with trying to help people as you suggest. I am with you. Where I and others do not agree with some people is that many of the programs do tend erode incentive to do more in life.
I have no problem giving some help regarding housing and other basic necessities. However, the people need to be pushed to take training or some other types of programs to help them get out of there. Generally there is not such thing. I am not for letting people rut on the streets either.
As far as minimum wage I will not go over that one. I have covered that one a few times lately. I am not an economist either but I do read as much as I can on the issue. If you really want to read more minimum wage I suggest a very good book I just finished reading. It is not a big book but it is to the point. It gives a nice historical background on how the minimum wage got started, the ulterior motives behind it, how it actually hurt the people it is claimed to help. It is entitled "Race and Economics". I have read many of the points through different sources but this writer puts many of them all together in one book. I believe you will learn also. I am not saying you will agree but at least it gives you at least a foundation to see whether minimum wage is that good of an option, take care.
First, there are many people "with low
intelligence" who make far more than minimum wage.
Second, what do you mean, "need to be able to have..."? You keep going in the same circle with they can't do more but the must have more. If they cannot earn more, how do you propose they have more?
Sure and there a lot of people with low intelligence making min wage or a little more then min wage. Well you could raise the min wage a few dollars or have the government make the difference or lower or eliminate income tax for people who make under a certain amount. There are plenty of ways probably more then I can think of.
Nothing wrong with trying to help people as you suggest. I am with you. Where I and others do not agree with some people is that many of the programs do tend erode incentive to do more in life.
I have no problem giving some help regarding housing and other basic necessities. However, the people need to be pushed to take training or some other types of programs to help them get out of there. Generally there is not such thing. I am not for letting people rut on the streets either.
As far as minimum wage I will not go over that one. I have covered that one a few times lately. I am not an economist either but I do read as much as I can on the issue. If you really want to read more minimum wage I suggest a very good book I just finished reading. It is not a big book but it is to the point. It gives a nice historical background on how the minimum wage got started, the ulterior motives behind it, how it actually hurt the people it is claimed to help. It is entitled "Race and Economics". I have read many of the points through different sources but this writer puts many of them all together in one book. I believe you will learn also. I am not saying you will agree but at least it gives you at least a foundation to see whether minimum wage is that good of an option, take care.
I agree a training program would be good as long as they are trained in jobs they can do and that have job openings.
Very few "only have the ability" to do minimum wage jobs. MANY "only have the desire" to do minimum wage jobs. Nothing is stopping anyone from making a few extra dollars on the side as I outlined before, and trying to make something better for themselves instead of coasting and taking the easy route of relying on someone else to be able to put food in their mouth or a roof over their head. If you only rely on someone else to help provide that for yourself, a day will come where you are incredibly disappointed.
And before you respond with something about how some people just dont have the skills or education...or whatever excuse you want to use, like I said before, you are right, but that is a very small % of the people out there, and I believe there should be some assistance for that small group of people. Everyone else who has or previously held even a minimum wage job has the ability (again maybe not the desire) to go clean windows, shovel snow, mow lawns, or some other task that they can do by obtaining some cheap tools and soliciting work for them self with the potential to turn it into something bigger. At the end of the day though, there will always be people who dont make a lot of money, and that is how a healthy economy works...not by trying to force some ridiculous wage distribution or limit that does not reflect the value that one adds to a business.
How is that a small group when the U.S. has tons of people who are working poor and can not do more? If a bunch of businesses started up they could not all succeed because there would be to much competition. Also opening a business is not guarantee that you will make money doing it.
Sure and there a lot of people with low intelligence making min wage or a little more then min wage. Well you could raise the min wage a few dollars or have the government make the difference or lower or eliminate income tax for people who make under a certain amount. There are plenty of ways probably more then I can think of.
Anyone making minimum wage isn't currently paying any federal income taxes, and probably no state income taxes either.
Raising the minimum wage might help a few people earn a few more dollars in the short term, but it will also cause the price of the goods & services provided by their employers to go up by at least the same amount. It's also likely that the higher minimum wage will cause employers to hire fewer people.
Have the government make up the difference? Hmmm. Where does government get the money that it gives away? It takes it from people who worked for it. So now we want to punish those who ARE smart enough to earn more than minimum wage by taking what they worked so hard for, to give it to someone else? Really?
Sure and there a lot of people with low intelligence making min wage or a little more then min wage. Well you could raise the min wage a few dollars or have the government make the difference or lower or eliminate income tax for people who make under a certain amount. There are plenty of ways probably more then I can think of.
20 employees x 2080 hours x "a few dollars" ($3) = $124,800
That means for the company to stay where it was at it would need to get rid of 8.27 of those 20 people.
Congratulations, you've earned your official supervisory medal of honor in regards to massive layoffs. You did just lay off 41.36% of their work force.
How is that a small group when the U.S. has tons of people who are working poor and can not do more? If a bunch of businesses started up they could not all succeed because there would be to much competition. Also opening a business is not guarantee that you will make money doing it.
I refuse to accept your defeatist premise that "they cant do more" they just likely are not very motivated and are comfortable where they are. If they truly wanted more, they would figure out a way.
And yes, businesses fail all the time, but again, being a defeatist and not even trying because its "not a guarantee" is absolutely pathetic.
I've gone down a long path with you giving examples of how almost anyone can try to improve their situation, and all I've heard from you are lame excuses about things not being fair, or being too hard...obviously your plan is to sit back and let others do for you instead of doing something for yourself to better your situation. Quite frankly I find it very sad and pathetic that people are willing to just put their best interest in the hands of someone else and sit there and wait...they deserve whatever they get at that point.
What do you think we need?
I have this theory based entirely off of nothing that if we increased the minimum wage to something that IS livable, that we may have less poverty. Less welfare cases. Etc.
I understand everyone's life is different. What one may think is a good wage, someone may think it's crap.
The min wage I believe in NJ is like $7.75. Let's say they slightly doubled it to $15. $15 an hour, IMO, is something that is livable. Especially in a dual income home. ...
In our state, minimum-wage annual income times two [to equal dual income households does equal the 'median household income' in some counties.
Washington County and Aroostook County, of Maine.
In my county [Penobscot] the data is greatly skewed because we have a city [where there are more jobs and the cost-of-living is higher].
I see no need to double the minimum-wage. People are able to support themselves and raise families on minimum-wage.
Anyone making minimum wage isn't currently paying any federal income taxes, and probably no state income taxes either.
Are you sure about that? I thought a childless adult working full time at minimum wage currently pays a couple hundred dollars a year in federal income tax.
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