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2. Is there ANY PROBLEM that the US faces currently, which was not caused by George Bush?
Yes. Most of the economic problems we're coping with are rooted in Reagan's deregulation of everything and massive deficit spending for purposes of financing tax cuts for the rich.
Reagan, icon of the Right, was possibly the worst president since Hoover, though he was unquestionably a well-intentioned and likable fellow. Everyone who met him loved him. Even Ansel Adams, after meeting with Reagan to air his grievances about Reagan's decimation of environmental protection, walked out of the meeting glowing about what a great guy Ronnie was.
But he was a horrible president. It's not Bush's fault that the financial meltdown occurred. It was Reagan-era policies that were left unchanged by the negligence of Bush I, Clinton, and Bush II.
Lets be honest with ourselves here. Barack Obama campaigned on the "your taxes will not be raised one dime" theme. Are the VAT supporters of the opinion that Barack Obama made that promise out of a true understanding of national economics? Afterall, the amount of our current debt, coupled with no new taxes to pay for it, means more debt unless we experience the Mother of All Economic Upturns.
Are liberal VAT supporters prepared to say that Barack Obama is an inept President since he obviously has no idea how the tax/spend/debt/deficit system works? No new taxes on the middle class is what he said, right?
If people want european style subsidies, handouts, freebies, and entitlements, then they better be in favor of european style taxes to pay for them as well.
I can hear it now "But, but, Obama promised my taxes wouldn't go up one cent!"
ETA: Those VAT's over in europe hover around 20%. Germany's is 20%.
Last edited by AuDiBelle; 03-29-2010 at 01:16 PM..
Location: Jonquil City (aka Smyrna) Georgia- by Atlanta
16,259 posts, read 24,752,651 times
Reputation: 3587
Quote:
Originally Posted by AeroGuyDC
Lets be honest with ourselves here. Barack Obama campaigned on the "your taxes will not be raised one dime" theme. Are the VAT supporters of the opinion that Barack Obama made that promise out of a true understanding of national economics? Afterall, the amount of our current debt, coupled with no new taxes to pay for it, means more debt unless we experience the Mother of All Economic Upturns.
Are liberal VAT supporters prepared to say that Barack Obama is an inept President since he obviously has no idea how the tax/spend/debt/deficit system works? No new taxes on the middle class is what he said, right?
The promises that Obama made were for his first term- and he has kept his tax promise. But in his 2nd term, it is becoming obvious that new revenue will be needed.
Location: Jonquil City (aka Smyrna) Georgia- by Atlanta
16,259 posts, read 24,752,651 times
Reputation: 3587
Quote:
Originally Posted by whatyousay
If people want european style subsidies, handouts, freebies, and entitlements, then they better be in favor of european style taxes to pay for them as well.
I can hear it now "But, but, Obama promised my taxes wouldn't go up one cent!"
ETA: Those VAT's over in europe hover around 20%. Germany's is 20%.
Many of the programs we have such as health care, Social Security, mass transit, schools, colleges, roads, highways, parks and other things benefit the country greatly. They are worth paying for. The Republicans certainly do not mind wasting massive amounts on trillion dollar farm handouts, unnecessary wars and unwanted military hardware.
as I'm sure I'm the only person in this forum who's lived in Europe for a substantial period of time.
A VAT is not a bad thing at all. You really wouldn't notice it. It's only a few percentage points higher than some of our sales taxes, and I don't think we need to make ours 20%, I mean 2-5% would be more sufficient.
It would have to be compounded with the state sales taxes, so states could decided how to go about it.
One thing to look at is taxing online sales...it's some 10% of all retail sales, and they are all tax free. Untapped 100s of billions of dollars.
But I think a reasonable VAT with lower state sales taxes and a sensible income tax, could go a long way. Believe it or not, this goes for Dems and Reps, we spent and spend without regard for the budget, now we will need to pay for it and all future endeavors.
I say lets overhaul our tax code, to increase revenue to pay for things vital to a functional society. We will all benefit and the defict would decrease.
as I'm sure I'm the only person in this forum who's lived in Europe for a substantial period of time.
A VAT is not a bad thing at all. You really wouldn't notice it. It's only a few percentage points higher than some of our sales taxes, and I don't think we need to make ours 20%, I mean 2-5% would be more sufficient.
It would have to be compounded with the state sales taxes, so states could decided how to go about it.
One thing to look at is taxing online sales...it's some 10% of all retail sales, and they are all tax free. Untapped 100s of billions of dollars.
But I think a reasonable VAT with lower state sales taxes and a sensible income tax, could go a long way. Believe it or not, this goes for Dems and Reps, we spent and spend without regard for the budget, now we will need to pay for it and all future endeavors.
I say lets overhaul our tax code, to increase revenue to pay for things vital to a functional society. We will all benefit and the defict would decrease.
I think they'll just vote in a VAT on top of the system we currently have.
It would take too many years to rework the current tax structure and they need revenue coming in NOW.
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