Krugman: 'Advisory Panels' dictate medical care and will save a lot of money (suspect, companies)

[InformedConsent]

Originally Posted by g978

I can reverse the question and say are you comfortable with an some bureaucrat in an insurance company deciding your care (as happens now)?

So Obama's and the Dems' takeover of medical care improves this how?

If the guidelines are clear then no I am not uncomfortable. The Doctor will do what he thinks is right.

No, the doctor will do what the panel dictates.

You and others want waste driven out of the system, defensive medicine stopped. Well here is a way of doing that.

Denying medical treatment is very different from eliminating unnecessary diagnostics. Why do you conflate the two?

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by g978

Republicans have complained that the legislation doesn`t do enought o cut costs. Now they are complaining that there is a mechanism to, wait, cut costs!

Does it matter if it is this panel or a panel from the insurance company. Costs will be controlled one way or the other.

Huge difference. One could, before this law, choose to pay out of pocket for those medical services not covered by insurance. Now, the government "panel" decides what treatment is given, period. No exceptions or the doctor gets fined.

Costs can be cut by not paying off unions and Obama donors.

Costs can be cut by putting a hiring freeze on the federal government and not creating new bureaucracies.

Costs can be cut by the President not flying all over the country "campaigning" for legislation (future and already passed).

Costs can be cut by eliminating the fraud currently within the Medicare & SS systems.

Costs can be cut by scaling down Michele Obama's "staff" by 2/3rds.

Costs can be cut by not providing taxdollar funded services to illegal aliens.

Costs can be cut by banning "earmarks" for legislators as add-ons to legislation.

Costs can be cut by not nationalizing private industry.

Costs can be cut by not giving foriegn aid to countries whom are not our allies.

Costs can be cut by getting the US out of the UN!

Costs can be cut by not trying to rescue every nation that undergoes a natural disaster (or at least severly cutting back aid in the form of cash).

Costs can be cut by eliminating lifetime pensions for elected officials.

Costs can be cut in millions of ways. But, the goal is to tax the citizen until they MUST rely upon the government for everything. That is why the will not stop the spending. That is why jobs are being intentionally destroyed. That is why our economy is being intentionally destroyed. That is why our soverienty as a nation is being intentionally destroyed. That is why our Constitution is being intentionally destroyed.

The size of government and the liberties of the citizens are an inverse relationship. What part of that is difficult for you to understand?

[g978]

Originally Posted by ndfmnlf

Where do you think doctors get their ideas for treatment from? Do they just pull them out of their a$$e$?

There's such a thing as "standards of medical care". These standards didn't pop out of thin air. They were developed through experience and codified by subspecialty groups into guidelines. You can call these groups issuing these guidelines "panels" if you want, but they are already in place, and they are there to guide doctors and their patients on the state of the art of medical care. They prevent doctors from concocting unproven cures on gullible patients.

Exactly, but some people will not let facts get in the way of their opinions. I have to go soon and get on with my private sector, wealth creating job unlike some on here I suspect.

[g978]

Originally Posted by InformedConsent

So Obama's and the Dems' takeover of medical care improves this how?


No, the doctor will do what the panel dictates.


Denying medical treatment is very different from eliminating unnecessary diagnostics. Why do you conflate the two?

Who is denying medical coverage? I believe in this law medical coverage cannot be denied for those with pre-existing conditions or insurance revioked after someone gets ill./

It was the insurance companies who denied care in some cases. Not the Government or this law.

If this is a takeover why are there still private insurtance companies. the law basically sets minimum standards for those companies. As we do for life insurance, home insurance and auto insurance. If socialised Government "run" helathcare is soo bad then why is the military on it and happy?

[InformedConsent]

Originally Posted by g978

You know exactly what I meant. Palin and others coined the phrase "death panel". Inaccurate of course but that shouldn`t stop her.

What makes you so sure none of the panel's medical care denials will result in death?

[OhioIstheBest]

Originally Posted by g978

I believe your heroine (assumption here) Sarah Palin called North Carolina real america, she didn`t say that about Ohio. Take that up with her, especially since you seem to believe everything she says. I would like to believe otherwise.

You really are odd if you think the President will spend all day determining the care for 300 million people. That is a lot of work. He is working on other things, like winning the war in Afghanistan (you know where Osama is) by sending more troops (shame Bush didn`t do that), and other issues.

Did Sarah Palin call NC real America? Didn't know that. I don't pay attention to her. Or very little anyway.

You trying to say Ohio isn't real America?

You are naive if you think this stuff is going to be carried out without Obama having a say in it.

And he has spent the last 14 months determining the "care" for 300 million people. Or did he not know what he signed? And I'm supposed to believe he is going to stop now? LOLs.

And who cares about George Bush? He isn't president. In case you haven't noticed he hasn't been for awhile.

[g978]

Originally Posted by lifelongMOgal

Huge difference. One could, before this law, choose to pay out of pocket for those medical services not covered by insurance. Now, the government "panel" decides what treatment is given, period. No exceptions or the doctor gets fined.

Costs can be cut by not paying off unions and Obama donors.

Costs can be cut by putting a hiring freeze on the federal government and not creating new bureaucracies.

Costs can be cut by the President not flying all over the country "campaigning" for legislation (future and already passed).

Costs can be cut by eliminating the fraud currently within the Medicare & SS systems.

Costs can be cut by scaling down Michele Obama's "staff" by 2/3rds.

Costs can be cut by not providing taxdollar funded services to illegal aliens.

Costs can be cut by banning "earmarks" for legislators as add-ons to legislation.

Costs can be cut by not nationalizing private industry.

Costs can be cut by not giving foriegn aid to countries whom are not our allies.

Costs can be cut by getting the US out of the UN!

Costs can be cut by not trying to rescue every nation that undergoes a natural disaster (or at least severly cutting back aid in the form of cash).

Costs can be cut by eliminating lifetime pensions for elected officials.

Costs can be cut in millions of ways. But, the goal is to tax the citizen until they MUST rely upon the government for everything. That is why the will not stop the spending. That is why jobs are being intentionally destroyed. That is why our economy is being intentionally destroyed. That is why our soverienty as a nation is being intentionally destroyed.

The size of government and the liberties of the citizens are an inverse relationship. What part of that is difficult for you to understand?

Sorry *******s. You can still pay for that unneccsary MRI if you really wish to.
Tax the citizen until then rely on Government. Ummm the US taxes less than most western countries and in those countries with higher taxes people are still free. People still buy stuff and have liberties. Your liberties are not set to 15% tax or 20% etc.

How is the soveriengty being destroyed (I suspect you will say UN). Why did the GOP do anything about it in 2001-2006 when they had COMPLETE control.

[jcarlilesiu]

Originally Posted by g978

Just as if you have a car accident, you may want a new car but the insurance company decides what you get, not you.

One small problem. If my car insurance deciedes NOT to pay my claim, I have the option in the current legal system to sue them.

You really think anybody has a chance in hell to win a suit against a government panel?

[OhioIstheBest]

Originally Posted by g978

It was the insurance companies who denied care in some cases. Not the Government or this law.

Then they committed fraud. The FBI has an insurance fraud unit.

Why didn't Obama just tell the FBI to start doing their jobs and enforce existing laws? Why all this unecesary legislation.

And if the insurance companies deny care then why force everyone to gete insurance? Why should I have to pay for something that doesn't work. (supposedly)

[lifelongMOgal]

Originally Posted by g978

And you are niave if you think the insurance companies have your best interests at heart. At least with the Government they are elected so it isn`t in their best interests to **** off people.

Do you think this government cares about the people beyond what control they can exert over them and what taxes they can collect form them? Really?

My insurance company does not interfer with my medical care. I pay for that out of pocket. The insurance is only a fall back "safety net" for catastrophic medical care, as it should be.