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Welcome to the club. If I could give anyone advice in this day and age I would suggest learning how to fill out tax forms. If I were you I would look for a federal or state government position and hope you live long enough to use your pension. Environmental considerations are nothing but a PIA to business and they will spend as little as possible. However the energy companies are dying to get enough people to fill out their impact statements. Just look at Environmental scientist positions on Monster.com. This is OK if you like Wyoming. If you are still in grad school and can afford to stay until you have a Doctorate then you might consider academics.
PM me and we can converse without blabbing our business to the world.
OK, let me explain. When a builder goes to the bank to get a construction loan, they typically loan him 75 to 80% of the appraised value of the home when it is finished. They (the lender) also expects the builder to "have a little skin in the game" so the builder typically is required to put up around $100,000 (given a finished house price of $1.5 million or so). Since most of the builders I fund build 5-6 houses annually they would need to come up with $500k-$600K in cash. Not always an easy thing to do. So, I loan them the $100,000 per house and they end up paying me a total of between $25,000 and $40,000 for the use of the money (the interest). It's cheaper for them, they can maintain a higher volume of projects under construction and yes, these guys are solid as rocks financially. They have to guarantee the construction loans of approx. $800,000 per house, or about $4-5 million total.
See? I told you folks it pays to learn about this stuff!
I hear so much about how the middle class is suffering because of the "rich". The middle class can not pay there bills
They have no health insurance. It just goes on with list of problems.
I consider myself and my family very middle class.
We pay our bills on time and we have health insurance. We have life insurance and have prepared for our retirement. We live well with in our means. Trust me when I say that I am not "rich".
So back to my question, what is considered rich, middle class and poor?
America is losing it's middle class, truly. The question is what state do you live in, 'several' states have illegal/amnesty population is so high over the years that the middle class are very much struggling to keep their lifesyle, with rises in mortgages and rent, healthcare, etc., and they are falling into poverty by the millions. The poor are poorer now in every way, homelessness is way up in families and middle aged, and people are seen everyday on streets and living in junky motorhomes. Some experts say it's too late for our nation because of the amnesty of '86 and the multi millions resulting out of that. One thing is for sure, we must "reverse" the illegal population with our laws already on the books to help America keep as much middle class as we can....This problem and preventing terrorism are vital to save our country, and so we Must be careful to vote for a candidate who will protect us on these two issues.
Faith10 Yes we have big problems. I'm older than most on this thread and I can tell you not so many years back how truly great things were in our Country. Well, last evening there was a story on tv about Islamic people who now live in Minnesota. A woman works at Target and refused to check someone out because she was buying a pork product. Some of their taxi drivers won't pick up fares who either carry alcoholic beverages or were drinking. Their protest is it's against their religion. Then we have the Hazelton Pa issue that Lou Dobbs ran a report on. The illegals and legal Hispanics are expecting to learn English at our expense. I could go on and on. If all of you immigrants do not like the way we do things in this magnificent Country then go home. Either adapt to our ways or leave the Country! Plain English!
Winter, you have my sympathy. I certainly understand your sentiments and I agree, it's hard to sit by and watch as things deteriorate and spin out of conrol, and we're told "there's nothing we can do about it"- nothing, that is, that wouldn't be mean, or politically incorrect. Very frustrating, and the sense of entitlement and ingratitude you refer to grates on me, as well.
I don't have a lot of experience in economics like other contributors, but here's what I understand:
The "Middle Class" is the traditional "default" class in Aerican society, and has been so, more-or-less since World War II. The Middle Class has, until recently, made up about 85% of the US population. The middle class, very briefly, is "Too Poor To Quit Working, but Too Prosperous to Despair". Being middle class means we have, in addition to the basic needs of food and shelter, some discretionary income as well. We can, if we save our money or take on a second job, or scrimp and save, someday buy a boat-- or maybe go on a cruise- - or put a child through college. Our existence goes beyond mere "survival". Most importantly, middle class implies the possibility of someday owning a home. To put it simply. "life becomes worth living" in the middle class.
A large, numerous middle class is what makes a society optimistic. Even the poor, seeing the large middle class, can hopefully aspire to join it. There is relatively little class-envy or hatred in this sort of society.
Our next-door neighbor, Mexico, is far different. Its middle class makes up about 10 to 15 percent of the population.(more-or-less, depending on the economy). A very small part of the population is fabulously wealthy, and able to live as international jet-setters. The large majority are desperately, abysmally, and hopelessly poor. They actually HATE the rich (and with good reason), which forces the rich to live behind security gates and employ private security guards. Society is rife with class hatred. The poor see no possible solution to their misery, except to leave--and guess where they come? The government actually encourages them to leave, so as not to have to deal with them.
As this is happening, a wide variety of factors is causing our OWN middle class to shrink. Good-paying jobs are disappearing. Tensions are rising. "Gated communities" are now very common in many areas, and we are getting used to seeing them. I pass quite a few of these every day. I assume their appeal is that they offer a barrier from the "little people" out there. Understandable, perhaps, but certainly not something that we, as Americans, have been used to seeing.
It seems like I read recently that Wal Mart was actually the LARGEST EMPLOYER in HALF of our STATES (!)- If this is so, then it's frightening, because NO ONE would consider a job at Wal Mart as a "middle class" job (except for some managerial spots, I suppose). No one would advise a young person to "Get a job at Wal Mart, get married, and before you know it, you'll be buying a new house".
This is far too broad a subject to cover here, and I'll step down now so someone else can join in. But suffice it to say that the future of our society looks pretty bleak at the moment. Can't imagine the sort of "breakthrough" that would reverse this trend as we move ahead into the "world economy"..
The best to you....
Location: Ohio, but moving to El Paso, TX August/September
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Spin off of Middle Class Thread
Give me some hard numbers..given your life experience, what do you see as middle class?
In my mind, middle class is 50-120K a year. But I think compared to others my idea of it is too low, while to others it may be too high. What numbers do others assign to classify middle class?
Middle class I consider to be having a home in the $225k - 250 price range, making around $50,000+ per year, paying their bills, etc.
We finally cleared a 6 figure income last year for the first time. Barely but we did. When we bought this house, we paid $180,000 for it. We did NOT want to get way over our heads. We live VERY comfortably. ONE income. Pay our bills. And saving for retirement. Have a goal of buying our retirement land and build our vacation/retirement home in the next 5-10 years. Hubby has 20+ years before he has to retire.
It's called being smart with your money. Something my daddy taught me. He's worth several million now but made his MONEY work for him instead of him working for his money.
Told me there were two ways to make money in this life...work for your money or make your money work for you.
At first everyone has to work for it, but a smart person will make the money work for him...easier on the back. Liz
I think it really depends on where you live. We (2 adults, no kids) live in Central MA, our house is paid for, so we can live comfortably on $60.000 a year and save money for retirement, emergencies etc. , have health insurance, take trips.....
But if you live in Boston, you most likely would need at least a $100.000 to income to have the same lifestyle.
emjbulls thread was merged with this one because it's the same topic.
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Spin off of Middle Class Thread
