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Old 05-18-2013, 08:42 AM
 
7 posts, read 27,711 times
Reputation: 28

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
You are obviously not a native Mainer so as we read your derogatory post, we will consider the source of the rant. You sound like someone who moved to Maine and now lacks an acceptance of the state....if that's the case, go back to where you came from.
Go easy...
I have worked with Northern Mainers cutting up trees, and tried like hell to get a family business (cedar shingles) to become successful. The people up North are GREAT PEOPLE. But there is only seasonal employment for many, if any employment at all...and a lot of folks are on assistance. We worked very hard (I hated cutting and not being able to swat mosquitoes feeding on my face. grrr..) and for little pay, and I would maybe even still be doing it in some capacity if I could have made some sort of living.
Yea, Northern Mainers are resolute, crafty, lots of perseverance, stalwartly, and also maybe needlessly denied better opportunities.
Many people do have careers and opportunity their whole lives in other states, then come to Maine to retire...then suddenly it's "hey no industry here, it will spoil my views!"
I have talked to some Mainers who see Maine as "less than perfect" or "poor"....and they would like to see some job creation.
I hate it when everything becomes personal when this "from away" stuff ..(booooring) chimes in....

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Old 05-18-2013, 09:13 AM
 
7 posts, read 27,711 times
Reputation: 28
I believe my original post was expressing my lamenting the fact that I have to leave "Mainers" as well as "Maine"...
Some people, not born in Maine have spent a lot of time and effort to live here, and appreciate the people and the State. When there is the slightest bit of criticism that "well, your from away" stuff sounds off.
Maybe someone would like to see a middle class instead of everything looking like York, full of seasonal vacation homes, rich people, etc. That is the future of Maine in many peoples opinion. Rich and poor.
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Old 05-18-2013, 09:58 AM
 
1,587 posts, read 2,150,883 times
Reputation: 1614
Quote:
Originally Posted by westender4life View Post
Go easy...
I have worked with Northern Mainers cutting up trees, and tried like hell to get a family business (cedar shingles) to become successful. The people up North are GREAT PEOPLE. But there is only seasonal employment for many, if any employment at all...and a lot of folks are on assistance. We worked very hard (I hated cutting and not being able to swat mosquitoes feeding on my face. grrr..) and for little pay, and I would maybe even still be doing it in some capacity if I could have made some sort of living.
Yea, Northern Mainers are resolute, crafty, lots of perseverance, stalwartly, and also maybe needlessly denied better opportunities.
Many people do have careers and opportunity their whole lives in other states, then come to Maine to retire...then suddenly it's "hey no industry here, it will spoil my views!"
I have talked to some Mainers who see Maine as "less than perfect" or "poor"....and they would like to see some job creation.
I hate it when everything becomes personal when this "from away" stuff ..(booooring) chimes in....
I did "go easy." Most of the state deals with seasonal employment issues; it's not just Northern Maine. Like I said and you apparently overlooked. If you can come up with excellent paying jobs (let's call them clean jobs) without the negative that often accompanies them, go for it. No Mainer is going to opt for better paying jobs in Maine at a cost of the destruction of "Maine, the Way Life Should Be." Speaking of spoiling the view, something off the coast had to be painted a certain color (forgot the exact location near Portland) for the sake of the wealthy--pretty sure a from away--person's view.... I think most native Mainers would be more concerned with protecting the waterways from pollution than concerning themselves with a view. Fishing is an industry and no one wants to eat fish poisoned by pollution.

I have a question about your scenario. Are the retirees who don't want their views spoiled "from aways" or "natives?"

You hate it when everything becomes personal or someone mentions the "from away stuff." I guess you are entitled to your opinion. The "from away" attitudes are reality. People are attracted to Maine often because Maine is the way it is because of a lack of industry. Then upon arrival, the talk begins about the need for more industry and more, better paying jobs.....can you really have it both ways?

There have been comments made about young people leaving the state to find jobs. I have an idea of a way to increase job opportunities for Mainers....pass a law that if you're not a native, you're not allowed to be hired for any job in Maine. Now that would raise the eyebrows and light up CD. That would preserve and reserve jobs for Mainers, wouldn't it? Do we want more jobs for Mainers (natives) or more jobs for those "from away?" Maybe the problem isn't a lack of jobs but rather too many people "from away" being hired........something to think about. I have heard that the blueberry industry can't find enough Mainers to harvest the crops. There was a time when native Mainers were harvesting the blueberry crop. Now they rely on people from away.

Last edited by mainegrl2011; 05-18-2013 at 10:27 AM..
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Old 05-18-2013, 04:26 PM
 
1,587 posts, read 2,150,883 times
Reputation: 1614
Quote:
Originally Posted by westender4life View Post
I believe my original post was expressing my lamenting the fact that I have to leave "Mainers" as well as "Maine"...
Some people, not born in Maine have spent a lot of time and effort to live here, and appreciate the people and the State. When there is the slightest bit of criticism that "well, your from away" stuff sounds off.
Maybe someone would like to see a middle class instead of everything looking like York, full of seasonal vacation homes, rich people, etc. That is the future of Maine in many peoples opinion. Rich and poor.
No Mainer wants criticism of Maine from a non native. Like it or not, that's the way it is. So..........on your way out, you can't resist getting a "dig" in. I read your OP again. You have somehow managed to live in Maine for 30 years and you're trading Maine for Seattle. You "choose" to leave Maine or you "have" to leave Maine--not the same things. Maybe you should or could learn to live on the salary of a Maine Special Ed. teacher....some of the highest pay in the State for teachers is in York and Cumberland counties. Maybe you expect more, expect too much, think you're worth more, etc. ........hard saying, not knowing..........I hope you will live happily ever after in Seattle and that it will meet or rise to your expectations.
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Old 05-19-2013, 09:53 AM
 
7,068 posts, read 4,243,288 times
Reputation: 6724
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
Hah! Your list proves that Mainers are the most frugal in the U.S. The other states are overpaying their governors.
No.... It really doesn't...

How about;

• Third in the nation for the number of households on TANF cash welfare (4.9 percent).

• Second for the number of households receiving food stamps (13.8 percent).

• Second for food-stamp error rate (10.4 percent).

• Third for number of residents enrolled in Medicaid (27 percent).

Second for welfare spending as a percentage of overall state spending (30.5 percent).

Yea... Real frugal with the tax payer dollars... Perhaps we should put more effort into good paying jobs instead of subsidizing poorly paying employers?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
If you aren't a native Mainer, you wouldn't or maybe couldn't understand....I've never known a Maine native who thinks Maine is impoverished.....
Obviously then you don't get out much. It isn't uncommon for someone with such a pretentious attitude in Maine to have a relatively small circle of friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
You are obviously not a native Mainer so as we read your derogatory post, we will consider the source of the rant. You sound like someone who moved to Maine and now lacks an acceptance of the state....if that's the case, go back to where you came from.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
No Mainer wants criticism of Maine from a non native. Like it or not, that's the way it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
pretty much anything that happens to Maine to make it more like the other states is viewed a bad thing. (Your words are that Maine is going to fall further and further behind--you couldn't possibly be a Maine native and type something like that.)
That's not the way it is. Not all of us carry such ignorance of the world, or such a pretentious attitude. Not all of us enjoy living in the past. Maine's greatness comes from the type of people (before mentioned excluded, as much as they think they count), not the lack of industry. Not all industry is "dirty" or risks ruining Maine. People are attracted to Maine because of the lack of dirty industry, not the lack of industry in general.

You are correct, Maine can attract Green jobs that would be beneficial. But that would require overhaul the state tax system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
There have been comments made about young people leaving the state to find jobs. I have an idea of a way to increase job opportunities for Mainers....pass a law that if you're not a native, you're not allowed to be hired for any job in Maine. Now that would raise the eyebrows and light up CD. That would preserve and reserve jobs for Mainers, wouldn't it? Do we want more jobs for Mainers (natives) or more jobs for those "from away?" Maybe the problem isn't a lack of jobs but rather too many people "from away" being hired........something to think about. I have heard that the blueberry industry can't find enough Mainers to harvest the crops. There was a time when native Mainers were harvesting the blueberry crop. Now they rely on people from away.
We don't go to college to pick blueberries. Not all of us are interested in cutting down trees or fishing.

Even the old industry that used to bring good paying jobs has been neutered or destroyed. Textile industry is gone, sawmills/papermills neutered. One hears the laments from even lobstermen about the situation of their industry, a staple of many coastal towns.

Maine is on a steady decline. Maine's poverty is self induced. It doesn't help that a portion of the population would rather stick their head in the sands rather than tackle the issues, while sucking at the tit of welfare.

Quote:
Originally Posted by westender4life View Post
Portland offers much. I like it's aura. I find that it has an unpretentious vibe that allows one to partake in dining, cultural events, shopping, or mingling with others, without having to look or act that one "is all about the money"... (I fled Jersey because of THAT)
I moved down to the Portland area in 2010. I feel no need to ever return to my hometown in midcoast Maine. The unpretentious attitude is exactly why. It is a great escape from the pretentious older generation (who will never admit it) inhabiting many of the small, dying, towns further north. The exact people who insist that we accept living on garbage wages, without experiencing culture, and stuck in the past.

I learned long ago to ignore the ignorant of Maine. They won't change, and will cling to their ignorance till they're buried in the ground.
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Old 05-19-2013, 11:00 AM
 
1,587 posts, read 2,150,883 times
Reputation: 1614
Lord Squidworth: I doubt you and I will ever agree on much of anything. Maybe we can agree to disagree. We could turn this into a pi$$in' contest, but for what purpose. You have found happiness in Portland--congratulations. I would guess you are under 30. Your contempt for those further north in Maine seems political to me. Most of Washington County are conservatives; therefore, I would guess you are of the liberal persuasion. Please post on this topic/thread once every three years--do you think Maine will still exist by then? I would like to see if your views change over time. Do you know enough to know what you don't know?...just something to think about.

I should have been more specific for the nit pickers like yourself. Maine is the most frugal when it comes to the governor's salary. I would have thought you could have inferred that from the context clues (the list of governors' salaries from various states). People are also attracted to Maine for it's lack of population....room to breathe without people piled on top of each other. I never said all industry is dirty. Now, now....no personal attacks....Don't berate me for things I didn't say.... I feel sorry for you. You seem to hate many things about Maine and anyone who doesn't agree with you. You've got your mind made up on Maine's doom. Just because I don't agree with you doesn't make me ignorant. That makes it your opinion and you are entitled to it.

I didn't major in blueberry picking in college either, but I'm not going to condemn the industry. I feel bad for the lobstermen/women especially with the low prices last summer. Now that you have gone to college, do you think you're too good to work in the tree industry or blueberry industry or fishing industry? I don't care whether you work in them or not, but I find your contempt, arrogance, condescending attitude and your hatefulness disgusting. Picking blueberries is for fun, muffins, and pancakes; harvesting blueberries is a huge money-making industry.
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Old 05-19-2013, 11:17 AM
 
643 posts, read 1,344,493 times
Reputation: 622
Too many assumptions in your posts, mainegrl. Stick to facts or your own experience. I'm retired (as one example of your incorrect assumptions). The jobs situation in Maine bothered us while we were there because it was difficult to meet and know so many people who were genuinely struggling financially. People with impressive work ethics and/or education struggling with many part-time jobs and other financial difficulties in taking care of their families. It had nothing to do with our own experience or why we didn't stay after a few years. The OP's post struck a chord that resonated with our experience there. Your posts just prove my point. Defiant, blustery attitudes about Mainers vs Maine citizens. There's certainly much to be proud of, but also much that's very disturbing. The percentage of the population struggling economically is one of the latter.
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Old 05-19-2013, 11:38 AM
 
643 posts, read 1,344,493 times
Reputation: 622
[quote=mainegrl2011;29622415] There have been comments made about young people leaving the state to find jobs. I have an idea of a way to increase job opportunities for Mainers....pass a law that if you're not a native, you're not allowed to be hired for any job in Maine. Now that would raise the eyebrows and light up CD. That would preserve and reserve jobs for Mainers, wouldn't it? Do we want more jobs for Mainers (natives) or more jobs for those "from away?" Maybe the problem isn't a lack of jobs but rather too many people "from away" being hired........something to think about. I have heard that the blueberry industry can't find enough Mainers to harvest the crops. There was a time when native Mainers were harvesting the blueberry crop. Now they rely on people from away.[/quote


I don't know where you were born, but you clearly don't possess an American spirit or sensibility. That's about the least patriotic attitude imaginable. And one that hurts Maine. There are more than a few gorgeous states with beautiful coastlines (ocean and lake) that are not "over-developed" and that have protected landscapes yet diverse economies, opportunity, and a larger middle class than Maine does. I refuse to list them, lest they be ripped apart by more of your vitriolic remarks.
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Old 05-19-2013, 12:17 PM
 
7,068 posts, read 4,243,288 times
Reputation: 6724
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
Lord Squidworth: I doubt you and I will ever agree on much of anything. Maybe we can agree to disagree. We could turn this into a pi$$in' contest, but for what purpose.
You already did that with point after point with your pretentious attitude towards the OP and other posters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
Your contempt for those further north in Maine seems political to me. Most of Washington County are conservatives; therefore, I would guess you are of the liberal persuasion.
I don't hold contempt for those further north per say, but rather find those outlined in the previous post a burden for Maine. They're not conservatives, they're not liberals. Their just arrogant, pretentious "Mainers" that think we're all like them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
I should have been more specific for the nit pickers like yourself. Maine is the most frugal when it comes to the governor's salary.
Frugal with the governors salary? So what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
Don't berate me for things I didn't say....
I'm berating you for being pretentious, arrogant, ignorant, and thinking those views are shared by all, clearly outlined in your posts and bolded in what I quoted in the previous one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
I feel sorry for you. You seem to hate many things about Maine and anyone who doesn't agree with you. You've got your mind made up on Maine's doom. Just because I don't agree with you doesn't make me ignorant. That makes it your opinion and you are entitled to it.
I clearly outlined what I disliked about Maine, one portion of its population. Your previous posts clearly attack those disagreeing with you about Maine, and regard them as second rate citizens because they're from "away" and therefor their opinions, no mater their length of stay here, are secondary.

My opinions of Maine economically are not based upon thoughts, but actual economic facts.

Your "facts" are opinions, that you behave as if everyone feels the same way.

See once again...

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
No Mainer wants criticism of Maine from a non native. Like it or not, that's the way it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
I didn't major in blueberry picking in college either, but I'm not going to condemn the industry. I feel bad for the lobstermen/women especially with the low prices last summer. Now that you have gone to college, do you think you're too good to work in the tree industry or blueberry industry or fishing industry? I don't care whether you work in them or not, but I find your contempt, arrogance, condescending attitude and your hatefulness disgusting. Picking blueberries is for fun, muffins, and pancakes; harvesting blueberries is a huge money-making industry.
Pot, meet kettle.

You're grasping at straws and attempting to make something mean something it clearly does not.
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Old 05-19-2013, 01:20 PM
 
Location: South Portland, ME
894 posts, read 1,072,808 times
Reputation: 891
Quote:
Originally Posted by mainegrl2011 View Post
I did "go easy." Most of the state deals with seasonal employment issues; it's not just Northern Maine. Like I said and you apparently overlooked. If you can come up with excellent paying jobs (let's call them clean jobs) without the negative that often accompanies them, go for it. No Mainer is going to opt for better paying jobs in Maine at a cost of the destruction of "Maine, the Way Life Should Be." Speaking of spoiling the view, something off the coast had to be painted a certain color (forgot the exact location near Portland) for the sake of the wealthy--pretty sure a from away--person's view.... I think most native Mainers would be more concerned with protecting the waterways from pollution than concerning themselves with a view. Fishing is an industry and no one wants to eat fish poisoned by pollution.

I have a question about your scenario. Are the retirees who don't want their views spoiled "from aways" or "natives?"

You hate it when everything becomes personal or someone mentions the "from away stuff." I guess you are entitled to your opinion. The "from away" attitudes are reality. People are attracted to Maine often because Maine is the way it is because of a lack of industry. Then upon arrival, the talk begins about the need for more industry and more, better paying jobs.....can you really have it both ways?

There have been comments made about young people leaving the state to find jobs. I have an idea of a way to increase job opportunities for Mainers....pass a law that if you're not a native, you're not allowed to be hired for any job in Maine. Now that would raise the eyebrows and light up CD. That would preserve and reserve jobs for Mainers, wouldn't it? Do we want more jobs for Mainers (natives) or more jobs for those "from away?" Maybe the problem isn't a lack of jobs but rather too many people "from away" being hired........something to think about. I have heard that the blueberry industry can't find enough Mainers to harvest the crops. There was a time when native Mainers were harvesting the blueberry crop. Now they rely on people from away.
Your xenophobic attitude is not a good reflection on your state. It's also puzzling because you seem to have some kind of grudge against people "from away" and yet you fail to realize that as it currently stands, those people are the only thing that is keeping Maine running.

Maine basically has two major sources of income. Tourism (which relies on getting people "from away" to come spend their money in Maine) and rich retirees who pay massive taxes to live in the nice parts of Maine (these are also "people from away"). Without these, your state would completely collapse, because you have no way to support yourselves, since there are very few good paying jobs within your state.

And that's why it's so absurd that your state motto is "life the way it should be", since Maine is one of the worst states in the country to actually live in as a "normal person" trying to earn a living. Only those who don't know better would think that is "how it should be". And that's probably why it doesn't get fixed - because of this attitude you express; "this is how it is, if you don't like it, leave".

I guess people on welfare (the "natives", as you call them) are plenty content to keep being supported by all these people "from away" and not have to do anything yourself. But why be so vehemently opposed when people look at the situation and say "hey, wouldn't this be better if there were jobs so that Mainers could support themselves, rather than rely on welfare to get by"?

Your comment about "native workers only" further demonstrates your ignorance. Attracting better talent is better for everyone. It's all a cycle - if you have a good workforce, you will attract better jobs, the better jobs will attract an even better workforce, which will attract even better jobs, etc. If you limit your workforce to what you have, your less-than-stellar workforce will fail to attract new businesses, because the level of talent isn't there to draw them in. Maine currently has a very low skilled workforce. You can't attract good jobs on your own (if you could, they would already be there), so clearly you need to figure out how to get better workers to come to your state, and jump start the cycle.

Companies act in their own self interest, not the state's. You have to give them a reason to set up shop in your town if you want them there. They aren't just going to do it out of the "kindness of their hearts". We pulled off a huge coup a few years ago and got IBM to set up an office in Lansing thanks to partnerships with both the state government and Michigan State University. We accomplished that by providing a very talented workforce (Michigan State graduates) and a welcoming environment (state government made some deals to entice them to set up shop here). As a result, IBM has hired over 700 people for the Lansing office in the past 4 years and will be hiring another 125 this year. And these are all good jobs, they aren't "bust your ass in a hot factory for $10/hour", these are highly skilled salaried positions that people would move across the country to get. This isn't something that just randomly happened, IBM could have opened a new office anywhere in the country, but Lansing saw that it was going to be a huge boost to our economy if we could get them to do it here, so we made it happen.

This is what people are saying needs to happen in Maine - you have to entice the big companies to come to you. They aren't just going to do it on their own. In order to get a big company like that, and all the good jobs that come with it, you need to both have your local government work with them AND you have to get enough people capable of working for such a company in order to get them to come to Maine. If you say "well, the laws are what they are, we're not budging on them" or even "you can only hire Mainers" then those big companies are just going to laugh and create new jobs somewhere else (like they are currently doing).

Last edited by JoulesMSU; 05-19-2013 at 01:28 PM..
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