What is up with towns shutting down because a tiny bit of snow? (Portland: purchase, closing)

[Isotope-C14]

Originally Posted by hamellr

@Isotop-C14 Here is some light reading for you:


If it's so OK and has minimal impact, why are so many groups and agencies across the Northern US interested in decreasing it's use?

Probably cost. It's not free. Money really does drive 90% of decision making.

Most of your links do not include multiple recent, peer reviewed data, in a non-biased environmental journal, like Environmental Science and Technology. To be quite honest, I don't believe everything I find on the internet (treehugger.com, really?), I know for a fact that certain pages on the wikipedia have quite wrong statements about certain instances of acid base chemistry due to first hand research on the topic, even though they site a source, that source was published outside the realm of peer review.

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Even there, the critical reader has to understand *how* the data was acquired. While it is common to use something like conductivity meters (since they are cheap and *can* test on-the-spot) it is not nearly as good as using something like Ion Chromatography, where the individual ions are separated from the sample matrix, this is harder, you have to collect the sample, and how to do it is rather complex compared to sticking an electrode into a solution. Sometimes the preliminary data will not take into account complex geological issues as well, these streams don't exist in a bubble, and all kinds of unusual minerals may be present out of sight, underwater, or even flowing out some irresponsible person's 55 gallon drum behind their barn...

Not all methods due to expense, will be used for a given experiment. Most departments that deal with basic science of the environment are not well funded, and governmental organizations also have other agendas. The best one can do is hope that based on preliminary data, that better data is produced down the road. This might make one think "better safe than sorry" dealing with all chemistry, but road salt will have far less, if any long term impact, if sensible application rates are applied.

[pdxMIKEpdx]

I don't understand why the big whoohaw in an Oregon forum over road salt we don't use in Oregon.

We don't use road Salt in Oregon and probably never will either.

I think we have it handled very well thank you very much.


What's the point in getting all upset over it?
Nobody really cares about it because:

WE DON"T USE ROAD SALT IN OREGON!!!!!

[Minervah]

Originally Posted by pdxMIKEpdx

I don't understand why the big whoohaw in an Oregon forum over road salt we don't use in Oregon.

We don't use road Salt in Oregon and probably never will either.

I think we have it handled very well thank you very much.


What's the point in getting all upset over it?
Nobody really cares about it because:

WE DON"T USE ROAD SALT IN OREGON!!!!!

LOL! It reminds me of a comment I read by Trey Shannon that went something like this:

"If they like it so much (they want to move here), why do they want to change it?"

[ramedud]

Originally Posted by pdxmikepdx

i don't understand why the big whoohaw in an oregon forum over road salt we don't use in oregon.

we don't use road salt in oregon and probably never will either.

I think we have it handled very well thank you very much.


What's the point in getting all upset over it?
Nobody really cares about it because:

we don"t use road salt in oregon!!!!!

lol

[pdxMIKEpdx]

Well, all I can say is that in my experience, snow in Portland used to be a hell of a lot better twenty or thirty years ago before all them dad gummed outsiders invaded and ruined it for everybody.

[hamellr]

Originally Posted by Isotope-C14

Probably cost. It's not free. Money really does drive 90% of decision making.

The generally accepted replacement (Calcium Chloride) in terms of similar effectiveness is 3x the cost.


Although it's long term environmental impacts aren't known yet either, it's thought to be neutral.

[davemess10]

Originally Posted by Minervah

LOL! It reminds me of a comment I read by Trey Shannon that went something like this:

"If they like it so much (they want to move here), why do they want to change it?"

I would say most people like about 95% of what Portland/Oregon has to offer, they just don't understand why the area is so insular and kind of "non-progressive" when it comes to some things, like:
1. Road Salting/Plowing
2. Pumping your own gas
3. Sales Tax
4. Studded tires

Almost no other areas of the US operate this way, so I'm definitely not surprised it's a shock to most when they find out OR is different. They're things people would never even imagine not having.

Just because people get worked up with one or two quirks in Oregon doesn't mean they hate the whole state.

[Squidlo]

Originally Posted by davemess10

I would say most people like about 95% of what Portland/Oregon has to offer, they just don't understand why the area is so insular and kind of "non-progressive" when it comes to some things, like:
1. Road Salting/Plowing
2. Pumping your own gas
3. Sales Tax
4. Studded tires

Almost no other areas of the US operate this way, so I'm definitely not surprised it's a shock to most when they find out OR is different. They're things people would never even imagine not having.

Just because people get worked up with one or two quirks in Oregon doesn't mean they hate the whole state.

Welcome to Portlandgrad comrade. Do not let the politburo construe your remarks as an attack on the current political climate. I have been chased from coffee shops for even admitting I prefer to live in Texas over Portlandgrad.

[Minervah]

Originally Posted by davemess10

I would say most people like about 95% of what Portland/Oregon has to offer, they just don't understand why the area is so insular and kind of "non-progressive" when it comes to some things, like:
1. Road Salting/Plowing
2. Pumping your own gas
3. Sales Tax
4. Studded tires

Almost no other areas of the US operate this way, so I'm definitely not surprised it's a shock to most when they find out OR is different. They're things people would never even imagine not having.

Just because people get worked up with one or two quirks in Oregon doesn't mean they hate the whole state.

Never said I thought that though. I was just trying to inject some humor into the discussion. Hence the smiling emoticons.

[hamellr]

Originally Posted by davemess10

I would say most people like about 95% of what Portland/Oregon has to offer, they just don't understand why the area is so insular and kind of "non-progressive" when it comes to some things, like:
1. Road Salting/Plowing
2. Pumping your own gas
3. Sales Tax
4. Studded tires

Or is it so "non-progressive," that it's "progressive?"

Seriously though, I recently saw an article in another cities newspaper that was talking about how Portland's freeway system is so progressive and they were lamenting how their city didn't buck against the trend of paving everything back in the day too.