Meet the new gridlock, worse than the old gridlock. (Portland: house, buying)

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by VTHokieFan

I've said nothing about it being a liberal hell hole



That's a great solution. Everyone who opines that Portland's traffic is bad should leave Portland. Love it or leave it is the dumbest response to anything.

Well I disagree with you about how bad traffic is here, I have seen much, much worse.

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by KJoe11

No, the article does not back up your claim at all. It does, however, refutes your opinion.

The comments of "if you don't like it leave or don't live there" offers no value. I think it is great that you defend Portland if you feel there is invalid criticism. But not every remark is a personal attack on your 'beloved' city.

You should try clicking on the interactive link, the worst commute is I-5 to Vancouver, after that it is pretty mild compared to other cities. Sometimes you have to look at the data rather than the article.

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by VTHokieFan

This has always been my idea for a new traffic pattern



Abolish "405" and turn it into I-5 and make the portion between the I-5/405 interchange and I-5/84 interchange an exit to 84/from I-5. Likewise, make the Marquam bridge an exit to 84/From I-5 as well.

So you solution is to change the name of the interstates?

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by bler144

You posted this early afternoon, so I'm not particularly surprised it wasn't too bad at 1:30 pm. Try it at 4:45 going north from the Steel Bridge to Lombard and I'd wager it will be at least twice as long.

As Deezus notes, the issue is chokepoints, particularly when you add congestion. Most of the day Interstate isn't that bad, but during rush it is because you get sufficient traffic trying to turn left that it clogs up all the traffic trying to go straight, particularly when you miss a cycle or two for MAX running through north and south. Most notable on the stretch south of Rosa Parks before it opens up to 4 lanes. Conversely, Greeley is actually pretty smooth south of Rosa Parks, but it's not unusual to miss a cycle where the road tightens up and more drivers are trying to turn west towards Univ. Park.

And even if you're not sitting through cycles, if you're bypassing I-5 because of traffic onto Interstate/MLK, you're still accepting that it's going to take you 10-15 minutes to cover a stretch that would have taken 2-3 minutes if the interstate were moving at posted speed. So you're impacted, even if it's a concession you're willing to live with.

And the more I-5 is clogged up, the more cars shunt off I-5 onto those local roads creating more congestion for the local traffic. As North portland becomes more dense over time, frankly I think it's likely to get worse still.

No one is arguing that traffic doesn't back up during rush hour, and that much of the I-5 traffic is created by the commuters in Vancouver.

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by VTHokieFan

Simplifying traffic would make things better IMO.

Simplifying what? All you did was remove the 4 and the 0 from 405. You can use the 405 now for a bypass from the 84 interchange.

[VTHokieFan]

Originally Posted by urbanlife78

Well I disagree with you about how bad traffic is here, I have seen much, much worse.

Probably in your home state of New Jersey, but Portland's traffic is still bad.

[jjpop]

Originally Posted by urbanlife78

Then don't use the interstates if you don't want to sit in that traffic.

I already avoid the freeways when they're all gummed up. I'm just saying that maybe there's an answer to the gummed up freeways. There are two alternatives: 1) reduce the number of cars on the freeways (increase mass transit, make it easy to use, accessible, reliable, and fast), or 2) increase the capacity of the freeways (add lanes). I suppose the third alternative would be to do a little bit of both.

Also, I wish people wouldn't have a "Portland vs. suburbs" mentality because we are all in this together. It's the Portland urban equivalent of the Clackamas County anti-Portland attitude.

[bler144]

Originally Posted by jjpop

Also, I wish people wouldn't have a "Portland vs. suburbs" mentality because we are all in this together. It's the Portland urban equivalent of the Clackamas County anti-Portland attitude.

Agree. On the first part I think there are other alternatives - smooth out some of the roughspots (I-5 to I-84 interchange being one, but also the 84-5-405-26 transfer when crossing the city westbound), and look at adding other bypasses altogether.

On the east side it's a bit needless to force all the traffic inbound from the gorge to come all the way in to the airport before crossing the river; on the west side there's still the holy grail of a western bypass. In theory you could cut due north from Woodburn to Longview and keep a decent amount of through traffic from entering the core of the metro at all.

No one is arguing that traffic doesn't back up during rush hour, and that much of the I-5 traffic is created by the commuters in Vancouver.

Your initial argument on this point was that the Vancouver traffic is Vancouver's problem. It very much has an impact south of the river, which you now seem to be acknowledging without acknowledging that you've pretty significantly changed your argument.

[urbanlife78]

Originally Posted by VTHokieFan

Probably in your home state of New Jersey, but Portland's traffic is still bad.

Ah cute, an inaccurate personal attack. New Jersey is no more my home state than Oregon is your home state. But I suggest staying know topic and not resorting to personal attacks, thank you.

[VTHokieFan]

Originally Posted by urbanlife78

Ah cute, an inaccurate personal attack. New Jersey is no more my home state than Oregon is your home state. But I suggest staying know topic and not resorting to personal attacks, thank you.

I'm not sure how being from New Jersey is an attack. Your username previously had a New Jersey residence on it. I was just saying, compared to your home area which is in the NYC metro area, I bet Portland traffic is mild.